The absurdity of Pretrib logic

[Spiritual Israelite]

The sudden destruction will be the sudden destruction of the peace and safety feeling that the world will have at the time.

See, this is a case of you not being honest with scripture. Are you afraid to do that, Doug? Paul said "they shall not escape" the "sudden destruction". Why not? We can easily see why not from looking at how Peter described that destruction here:

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

Compare to:

1 Thessalonians 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

Looking at these passages objectively, it is quite clear that when the day of the Lord arrives unexpectedly, sudden destruction by fire will come upon the entire earth and His enemies "shall not escape".

You are not using scripture to interpret scripture here, Doug. Your interpretation of 1 Thess 5:2-3 contradicts what is shown in 2 Peter 3:10-12. You never care about making sure your interpretation of one passage doesn't contradict any others. The idea that the "sudden destruction" has to do with destroying "the peace and safety feeling that the world will have at that time" does not fit the context of what Paul was saying at all and does not correlate with what Peter wrote, either. The "sudden destruction" is physical destruction by fire. God's enemies "shall not escape" it.

 

[WPM]

Matthew 24:31 is not the rapture.

The gathering of the elect in Matthew 24:31 is after Jesus has returned to this earth. It is referring to the gathering of the Jews back to land of Israel.

Matthew 24:31 corresponds to Ezekiel 39:28. The gathering of the Jews back to the land of Israel, even if scattered to the farthest parts of heaven (a metaphor for the most distant nations), is a promise that God made to them back in Deuteronomy 30:4-6.

4 If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:


5 And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.

Pretrib must be taught for it to be learned. This is deep error.

Premils are quick at assuring unsaved Jews that they are “God’s chosen people.” They do this despite multiple Scriptures forbidding such a contention. In fact, nothing could be further from the truth. Anyone that rejects Christ’s new covenant made in His blood have no covenant relationship with God and therefore no right to claim God as their own. They are rather children of the devil.

We should not elevate anyone to the position of “Gods elect” until God has placed them there. On the authority of repeated Scripture (Old Testament and New Testament), the elect are continually depicted as all those who truly know God. Jesus said in John 10:14: “I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.” There is an intimate relationship between God and His people. They know each other in a spiritual way. They are in union with one another. They one.

Their relationship with God is real and personal. It is not merely an intellectual knowledge they possess or is it adherence to outward religious rules and regulations. Daniel 11:32 tells us: “the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.”

These are they that have individually experienced a saving knowledge of God through salvation! They are God’s chosen people, those He has sovereignly entered into a personal relationship with. They are a holy “remnant” who are found throughout the ages. They can be found in the Old Testament and the New Testament. Election comes through knowing Christ! Jesus taught in John 17:3: “And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.”

To know Him is to possess eternal life. To know Him is to be a child of God. Spiritual election is nowhere said in the Bible to be attained by any merit of oneself or by way of one’s birthdate, birth place or birth parents. It is not a corporate thing. It never was or it never will be. It is an individual thing. Whilst God chose Israel as the nation to exclusively manifest His glory, no one was ever saved according to their race or place; they had to have a personal individual encounter with God. This applies equally to Old Testament and New Testament saints. The sacred text is saturated in these personal encounters with the Lord and their resulting testimonies, from the beginning.

It is only by knowing God that Paul the Apostle could testify with confidence in 2 Timothy 1:12: “for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.”

Favor with God has always come by way of a spiritual transformation appropriated by saving faith. This truth is repeatedly emphasized throughout the Word of God and is far from ambiguous. What is more, it has encompassed both Hebrew and Gentile throughout both testaments. Biological pedigree, religious prowess and social status has never secured favor with God in any age.

The Greek word from which we get our word “elect” is eklektos. It is a participle of the verb eklegomai, which can be used as a noun (i.e. elect) or as an adjective that means “picked out” or “chosen.” Whatever way the theologians may try to water-down this word, it carries a strong meaning in the original Greek. Those who are chosen of God have been specially picked to fulfil a divine purpose.

 

[WPM]

Satan is still active in the world causing trouble for God's creation. And has not been bound in the bottomless pit like what will happen at Jesus's Second Coming. Satan when he becomes bound in the bottomless pit will not have access to the world during that one thousand years.

• Do you believe Satan and his minions are physical beings?
• Is the dragon in Revelation 20:2 a literal physical dragon?
• Is the serpent in Revelation 20:2 a literal physical serpent?
• Do you believe Satan literally has 7 heads and 7 necks?
• Is the key mentioned in Revelation 20:1 a literal metal door key?
• Is the chain mentioned in Revelation 20:1 a literal metal chain?
• Is the prison mentioned in Revelation 20:7 a literal brick prison?
• Do you believe demons need to be detained in a literal physical prison with literal metal chains in order to be restrained?
• Can a prisoner in a prison have great wrath while in chains?
• Does imprisonment mean immobility?
• Does it mean a prisoner cannot do harm?
• Can a dog on a chain walk or roam about?
• Can a prisoner in a prison walk or roam about?
• Does a prisoner have the ability to kill, steal, destroy, rape and embezzle in prison?

 

[The Light]

You have just set a new world record for the number of times you have been wrong.

Or maybe you lack understanding.

Job 14
10 But a man dies and lies prostrate.
A person passes away, and where is he?
11 As water evaporates from the sea,
And a river becomes parched and dried up,
12 So a man lies down and does not rise.
Until the heavens no longer exist,
He will not awake nor be woken from his sleep.

There are men that were laid down that will not rise until the heavens are passed away.

That's what we have been discussing about John 5

There are also many of those that sleep in the dust that will be raised immediately after the great tribulation. See Daniel 12:1-2. They are part of the great multitude that will be in heaven for the marriage supper during the wrath of God. They will return with the armies of heaven at the end of wrath. See Rev 19

 

[WPM]

There are men that were laid down that will not rise until the heavens are passed away.

Who are these?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Satan is still active in the world causing trouble for God's creation. And has not been bound in the bottomless pit like what will happen at Jesus's Second Coming. Satan when he becomes bound in the bottomless pit will not have access to the world during that one thousand years.

I showed you what it means for Satan to be bound and you have chosen to ignore it. You can't even bring yourself to specifically comment on the points that I made.

Doug, did Jesus not indicate that he bound Satan long ago, as the following passage shows? Yes or no?

Matthew 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: 26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? 27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. 28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.

Clearly, Jesus said that He was binding Satan long ago in order to make room for the spiritual kingdom of God to spread throughout the world. What do you think Jesus meant when He talked about binding the strong man (Satan) and spoiling his house? What does it mean for Jesus to spoil Satan's house? I'll give you a hint. Other scripture tells us. Those scriptures might include Hebrews 2:14, 1 John 3:8 and Acts 26:18.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

That is all they have now. They cannot b ring any prooftext to the tableI. It impossible to engage with them. All their so-called proof texts they present have been addressed and rebutted. What have they now but sweeping extra biblical statements, avoidance and ad hominem?

They have nothing but opinions. It's quite noticeable that they have no scripture to bring to the table that backs up their many wild claims. Any objective onlooker to this discussion has to be embarrassed for the pretribs and wondering why they are not waving the white flag of surrender by now. This debate is very one-sided. Can any pretrib step up and actually present a coherent argument using scripture?

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

 

[WPM]

...as we speak Satan is bound for 1000 yrs?
Amil baloney

If you open your Bible you will see the opposite.

Jesus said just prior to His death in Matthew 12:28-29, “Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David? But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils. And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. Or else how can one enter into a strong man’s house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind (deo) the strong man? And then he will spoil his house.”

This is referring to His earthly ministry. When it talks about Satan and his kingdom being bound, being in chains or being imprisoned it is not talking about physical metal chains a physical brick prison because Satan is not a physical being. He is a spiritual being. It is talking about a spiritual condition of restraint that curtails him in regard to his influence and power.

Jesus describes Satan here as the “strong man.” He depicts Himself as the One who enters the house the strong man and plunders his goods. But before this happens he must first be incapacitated.

The Lord identifies the casting out of devils, and the resulting liberating of souls, with the actual binding of the strong man. He in turn presents this as proof that Satan is curbed through the presence and victorious function of the kingdom of God. Christ was specifically referring to Satan here (the strong man) and his demonic kingdom, and expressly connects his binding with the manifestation of the kingdom of God during His earthly ministry. The subjugating of devils was proof of the spiritual restraint of the evil one. Satan could not prevent this. Satan could not overcome those who had been rescued by Christ.

The devil was subject to the purposes of God and hurt by the spiritual advance of the kingdom of God. This kingdom is still alive and active today. Souls are still being marvelously delivered from the power of Satan. The binding of the strong man continues today wherever the Gospel prevails.

Mark 3:11, 23-27 also records: “unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God ... And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils. And he called them unto him, and said unto them in parables, How can Satan cast out Satan? And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end. No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind (deo) the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.”

This familiar discourse by our Lord came as a response to the crude scoffs of the religious Scribes (during His earthly ministry) dismissing Christ’s deliverance ministry as a work of Satan. Christ’s reply confirmed that the binding of Satan commenced 2,000 yrs ago and is not simply a future hope that will occur after the Lord’s return. He said: “No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.” Christ was firstly referring to the false charge that was laid at his door in relation to his assault on the demonic realm. Secondly, He was describing the subjugation of the “unclean spirits” as “when they saw him” they “fell down before him” in surrender.

Jesus said in the corresponding passage in Luke 11:20-22, “if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you. When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace: But when a stronger than he shall come upon him, and overcome him, he taketh from him all his armour wherein he trusted, and divideth his spoils.”

Here, Christ highlights the Sovereign power of the kingdom of God and reveals how the “strong man” – Satan – and his kingdom of devils can only be defeated by One that is stronger than them, namely Himself – the Son of God. As we examine the gospels we discover, Satan was stripped everywhere that Christ confronted him. The Lord entered the devil’s house and took authority over him and spoilt His goods. Previously, Satan's grip on the nations was so strong and so embedded that the truth of God's Word could not penetrate through. The devil overwhelmingly controlled the Gentile nations.

Christ said: “When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace.” This was a direct reference to the unchallenged power of Satan over the nations in the Old Testament. The vast territory of the Gentile nations was under his evil control. He governed the nations at will and operated in an unmolested environment – thus “his goods” were said to be “in peace.”

Satan’s wicked grip over the nations was loosened by the life, death and resurrection of Christ. Many millions were liberated by His message of hope and liberation. In fact, if anything was representative of Christ’s ministry it was the binding of the works of darkness and the deliverance of the afflicted. Christ defeated the power of Satan and all his minions with His sinless life, His vicarious death and His victorious resurrection and therefore wholly fulfilled His earthly assignment. The advance of the kingdom of God therefore has seen the pushing back of the devil’s frontline throughout the nations. It is not that he can’t still create havoc and deceive people; it is that he can’t hinder the triumphant advance of the Gospel throughout the world.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Matthew 24:31 is not the rapture.

Yes, it is. Do you not know, Doug, that Christians are the elect? Have you not read the New Testament?

Here's Paul talking to Jew and Gentile believers in the church of the Colossians:

Colossians 3:12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

Here's Paul writing to Jew and Gentile believers in the church of the Thessalonians:

1 Thessalonians 1:4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

Paul said "I endure all things for the elect's sakes".

2 Timothy 1:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

Did you know that Paul preached to both Jews and Gentiles which makes both Jew and Gentile believers the elect?

Romans 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. 12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness? 13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

 

[The Light]

The opening of the seals reveals what the events will be. All of the seals on the book have been opened, so we know what the events will be.

And yet the seals are not opened and the events will occur in the order of the seals.

The events of the 7th seal are the 7 trumpet plagues, to happen during the great tribulation. The event of the 6th seal will take place near the end of the great tribulation.

I'm not sure why you can't see that the tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins. It is marked by the signs of the sun, moon and stars. IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS.

Then the wrath of God begins AFTER the 7th seal is opened.

The great tribulation is not closed until Satan is cast into the bottomless pit in Revelation 20:1-3.

This is totally incorrect. The great tribulation is over before the 6th seal opens. You need to understand that the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24 is marked by the signs of the sun, moon and stars. It happens IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS. Then the 7th seal is opened and the 1 year wrath of God begins.

There is not gathering of the elect taking place during the time of the sixth seal events.

Incorrect. Here is the harvest that takes place at the 6th seal.

Rev 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

The gathering of the elect in Matthew 24:31 is after Jesus has returned to this earth.

No. Jesus remains in the clouds. The coming is marked by the signs of the sun, moon and stars. It occurs at the 6th seal.

Daniel 12:11 - 1290 days from the time the abomination of desolation is setup - until the Sign of the Son of man in heaven

No. 1335 days

Daniel 12:12 - 1335 days from the time the abomination of desolation is setup - until Jesus's Second Coming.

Correct. But this occurs at the 6th seal. See the cosmic signs to mark this event.

There is no scripture to support those 45 days.

At the end of the those 45 days, had they not been cut short there would be no believers raptured alive. All that are raptured at the 6th seal would be raised from the dead.

The 45 days in between, the kings of the earth will gather their armies to prepare to make war on Jesus.

Get it out of your head. Here is 150 days that you can't account for.

Rev 9
10 And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.

 

[The Light]

You are incapable or unwilling to address counter arguments. That is the story of this thread. All you do is promote what you have been taught.

Here it is again. Your false claims. Right out the playbook of those that think they have replaced Israel. When your views are completely destroyed by the Word of God.....................Deny, deny, deny.

There is nothing you can post regarding amil that the Word of God will not destroy. Your false beliefs are fools gold.

 

[WPM]

The sudden destruction will be the sudden destruction of the peace and safety feeling that the world will have at the time.

And is suddenly plunged into the great tribulation, a time of unmatched trouble. Which the great tribulation will not end until Jesus's Second Coming when Satan is cast into the bottomless pit prison in Revelation 20:1-3 for a thousand years.

LOL. Talk about butchering Scripture! Pretrib is becoming more farcical by the moment. The reality is, you see what we see: there is one final future coming of the lord that is absolutely climatic. No one survives it!

1 Thessalonians 4:14-5:9 declares: “if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming [Gr. parousia] of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain ‘shall be caught up’ [Gr. harpazō] together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ.”

Scripture forbids Pretrib position whatever angle you look at it. It is embarrassing how you guys have to explain clear literal Scripture away to allow your error to fit. You cannot take God at His Word. You cannot let the Bible speak for itself. You cannot answer simple questions. All you have are Pretrib cliches and talking points. You have nothing more.

You cannot deal with the destructive detail that is attributed to the second coming by God's Word. Your explanations are becoming literally laughable.

Listen to another ridiculous explanation from a fellow Pretribber:

They are emotionally destroyed.( REMEMBER YOU HEARD THE CORRECT CONTEXT FROM REBUILDER. AND HE WILL CONTINUE CORRECTING YOUR ERROR)

This is one of the most ridiculous things i have ever heard on end-time forums. This sums up Pretrib!

 

[The Light]

Who are these?

Those before the flood for starters.

 

[WPM]

Here it is again. Your false claims. Right out the handbook of those that think they have replaced Israel. When your views are completely destroyed but the Word of God.....................Deny, deny, deny.

There is nothing you can post regarding amil that the Word of God will not destroy. Your false beliefs are fools gold.

Take one text at a time. Exegete it slowly. Show us your biblical support for a rapture of the Church followed by a tribulation period followed by 3rd coming? Put your cards where your mouth is.

 

[WPM]

Those before the flood for starters.

Scripture that says this?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Still waiting for you to prove your last statement on this that GREAT was used as a translation more than many. Where is your proof? Additionally if you do not know the difference between MANY and ALL I suggest addition schooling.

What difference does that make as to how many times the word is translated as "great" compared to "many"? Most words have multiple definitions. Is that a hard concept for you to understand?

The word is used a great number of times in scripture, so it's not reasonable for me to take the time to count every time it's used.

This can give you some idea, at least:



And, as I pointed out, the word does NOT mean "many, but not all". Why are you too stubborn to admit that?

Exodus 5:4 And the king of Egypt said unto them, Wherefore do ye, Moses and Aaron, let the people from their works? get you unto your burdens. 5 And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now are many (rab), and ye make them rest from their burdens.

Is this talking about many, but not all of the Israelite people in Egypt or is it referring to all of them, of which there were "many"?

No. The question is did Abraham sojourn in the Philistines land MANY days or ALL his days.

LOL. You will do ANYTHING to avoid honestly addressing the points I'm making. The word "many" was used in referencing to the number of days he soujourned and not to the number of days he lived and you know it. So, did it refer to many, but not all of the days he sojourned or all of them? Your dishonesty here is disturbing. Why are you afraid to deal with scripture honestly? You'd rather just believe what you want to believe?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Take one text at a time. Exegete it slowly. Show us your biblical support for a rapture of the Church followed by a tribulation period followed by 3rd coming? Put your cards where your mouth is.

I don't think he is capable of this. But, it would be nice if he at least tried. I think he knows if he tried it would expose his false teaching. So, he doesn't even try. No matter what we do, we can't get one single pretrib to exegete any scripture. That is quite telling.

 

[CadyandZoe]

No, I don't mean that at all. I don't have those things, either. Understanding scripure has nothing to do with that, it has to do with spiritual discernment from the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 2:9-16).

Really? And how do you measure me against yourself? Do I lack spiritual discernment because we disagree? I don't think so.

What I'm saying is because of your heretical belief of denying the deity of Christ, you have no authority here whatsoever and there is no reason for anyone to trust that you can interpret any scripture correctly.

Did I claim to have authority? No. If what I say is true, then it should be believed. That's all there is to it. But my denial of the deity of Christ is based on scripture and common sense. Does the Bible teach that Christ died for your sins? If Yes, then Christ is not a deity because a deity can't die.

He is doing both, obviously.

If an argument is based on premise 'X' and premise 'X' is false the argument is not valid.

You are a fraud by pretending to be a Christian on this Christian forum.

It depends on how you define "Christian" doesn't it?

You are grasping at straws here.

How so? How is quoting a Bible passage grasping at straws?

This shows that you do not know God. God would never allow anyone else but Himself to be worshiped.

I did say Jesus is God didn't I?

In your view, Jesus is a god, but not God.

Wow, you are way off about that. I never said that at all.

LOL. No, it demonstrates that you are a wolf in sheep's clothing and I want everyone here to know that.

I saw what you did. You dodged the issue. You began a hominem attach against me and you are too ashamed to admit it. Right?

Have you seen the comments of these immature children that we amils are debating in this thread? No, I do not trust them to draw their own conclusions.

Are you their mom?

He can teach people directly if He wants, but I believe His preference is to use people to teach or else the spiritual gift of teaching would go to waste.

So you don't trust others with Spiritual discernment?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Total doctrinally biased nonsense. Show me any other verse in scripture where the Greek word "zao" means to be resurrected or to come to life. Good luck.

I could show you other places in scripture where the Greek word means "come back to life" but why? You didn't believe me when I showed you earlier.

 

[Douggg]

Doug, did Jesus not indicate that he bound Satan long ago, as the following passage shows? Yes or no?

I showed you what it means for Satan to be bound and you have chosen to ignore it. You can't even bring yourself to specifically comment on the points that I made.

Doug, did Jesus not indicate that he bound Satan long ago, as the following passage shows? Yes or no?

Matthew 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: 26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? 27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. 28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.

"Doug, did Jesus not indicate that he bound Satan long ago, as the following passage shows? Yes or no?"

Jesus was talking about His binding Satan to cast out devils, demonstrating Jesus's power over Satan. Not that Satan has been bound in the general sense from being no longer active. Satan is still active. Satan goes about like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour.