What is the purpose of infant baptism?

[Jude Thaddeus]

Your gaslighting has long been acknowledged.

Your pretense of being a self-noteworthy expert in Biblical understanding has long been acknowledged.

Your posts routinely reflect YOUR view of YOU are always RIGHT and everyone else WRONG who disagrees with YOU has been acknowledged.

Get over yourself…very few are soliciting YOU for your personal Biblical views or your regular rants of personal attacks.

You have chosen your path, be content, without being a false accuser, it’s old and boring to say the least.

Not my JOB to continuously PROVE anything to YOU. My JOB is to TRUST the knowledge IN Scripture OVER YOU…and TRUST to Believe God IS the Provider of His Understanding of His Knowledge…And CHRIST JESUS IS the HEAD of His Church…
NOT YOU, NOT your Church, NOT your Gentile fathers, NOT your “catholic” brothers.

Matters NOT to me…what YOU Believe, what YOU Claim, what YOU Do. YOU alone are accountable FOR your own choices.

You and I Disagree on basic tenants…
so what…get over it.

Praise, Worship, Adoration, Prayers and Glory “TO” God Alone…

Taken

Your obvious hatred for anything Catholic is irrational.

 

[GodsGrace]

It's very uncomfortable to realize one has been lied to all their lives. This evangelical was so shocked reading the Early Church Fathers, she threw up. It's a very interesting testimony.

By bashing CC teaching with misconceptions? In a public forum?

Not "absolutely everything correct". That's another misrepresentation of the Authority Principle, previously explained.

Catholics are free to disagree with all kinds of things, we are not free to rebel.

Mandatory celibacy was only formalized in ONE rite that you make a stink about. That doesn't prove there were no celibate clergy before that. Jesus was celibate, was He wrong too? That's the basis of celibacy only in the Latin rite. And it's not a doctrine but a discipline. Catholic priests are not asked to be celibate, they voluntarily give up everything for full time service to the Church. "Asked to be celibate" is a red flag illustrating your ignorance.

Of course it's wrong, because it's not what the Church teaches. It's carefully explained in this video that even an idiot can understand.

Further explained here:

Search | Catholic Answers

www.catholic.com

No Catholic is obligated to accept private revelation. Show me a saint who contradicts scripture and I'll show you a heretic.

Don't shut the door on God's grace.

He hasn't. In fact, he approved the Latin Mass.

Traditionalists have an important role to play within the Church. Hyper-traditionalists are just a new form of Protestantism. Archbishop Vigano descended into Protestantism with his radical traditionalism, claiming the pope is not the pope. Use some discernment with what you read.

As you know, I agree with Vigano.
And, judging from the above post,
you haven't understood anything I've stated and which I took a lot of time to post to you.
So,,,,I don't have time for this.

And those videos.....do you really think I have to watch them to know what they say?

Adieu Judas.
Two down.

Keep protecting the CC and hating your brother Christians....
God will be happy with you.

1 Corinthians 1:10
1 Peter 3:8
Ephesians 4:3
Philippians 2:2


Need more?

 

[Taken]

Your obvious hatred for anything Catholic is irrational.

If “I” hate something, anything…WHY DO YOU think it YOUR PLACE to make declarations FOR ME?

You being an adult…SHOULD be on a path of gaining WISDOM, rather than blurting out nonsense LIKE a school yard bully.

 

[Augustin56]

Correct.
There's a great shortage of priests - at least over here.
Beginning in October, there'll be only 4 priests for my entire area...a large area.
Also, a push is being made to shut down a lot of church buildings and centralize worship in churches in
the main towns. There's a lot of push back regarding this...especially from older folk who won't be able to attend church
unless someone drives them - and many young persons are not interested in going to church or driving their loved ones to Mass.

So, every now and then someone will state that if they only allowed priests to get married, we might have more of them.
The priests I know, are happy not to be married.

But would it help?
What do you think?

(We had another beautiful seminary close down in the city of Lucca because it's huge and it only had, I think, 10 seminarians.)

PS Because churches are being kept open....one priest will have up to 8, what used to be called here, parishes to administer both physically and spiritually. It will now be called AN AREA.... Too much...it's very disheartening.

Interestingly, I don't think allowing priests to get married would change anything. The Orthodox allow married priests and they are having the same problem with vocations, from what I've heard. I think it's more of a spiritual problem. I've noticed that those dioceses that are more faithful to the Church's teaching and actions have more vocations. Those that don't, have less. Very subjective, I know, but I think you know what I mean. We're up to 20 seminarians at present, which is way up from not that long ago. And the young priests that are being ordained in the last few years really seem to have been formed incredibly well. (better than the older priests of my generation)

 

[GodsGrace]

Interestingly, I don't think allowing priests to get married would change anything. The Orthodox allow priests to get married and they are having the same problem with vocations, from what I've heard. I think it's more of a spiritual problem. I've noticed that those dioceses that are more faithful to the Church's teaching and actions have more vocations. Those that don't, have less. Very subjective, I know, but I think you know what I mean. We're up to 20 seminarians at present, which is way up from not that long ago. And the young priests that are being ordained in the last few years really seem to have been formed incredibly well. (better than the older priests of my generation)

I'd like to reply but on phone now.
Tomorrow.
I agree re the spiritual problem...

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

As you know, I agree with Vigano.

Ok, you admit to being a schismatic. Look what happens to everybody else who follows that path.

And those videos.....do you really think I have to watch them to know what they say?

You won't watch them because they expose your ignorance. Others might.

Matthew 18:17 If the member refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if the offender refuses to listen even to the church, let such a one be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

Good bye.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

If “I” hate something, anything…WHY DO YOU think it YOUR PLACE to make declarations FOR ME?

You make irrational declarations all the time.

You being an adult…SHOULD be on a path of gaining WISDOM, rather than blurting out nonsense LIKE a school yard bully.

You cannot be put on ignore. That's too bad for everybody else that has to put up with your irrational posts.

 

[Taken]

You make irrational declarations all the time.

You cannot be put on ignore. That's too bad for everybody else that has to put up with your irrational posts.

You joined this forum some 4 months ago and speak AS IF you not only know but are an authority on this forums long term members….which I find amusingly immature.

FYI…the adults on this forum just scroll on by what they do not choose to read!

 

[GodsGrace]

Interestingly, I don't think allowing priests to get married would change anything. The Orthodox allow married priests and they are having the same problem with vocations, from what I've heard. I think it's more of a spiritual problem. I've noticed that those dioceses that are more faithful to the Church's teaching and actions have more vocations. Those that don't, have less. Very subjective, I know, but I think you know what I mean. We're up to 20 seminarians at present, which is way up from not that long ago. And the young priests that are being ordained in the last few years really seem to have been formed incredibly well. (better than the older priests of my generation)

I wanted to say that I agree with you.
Priests being married will have no effect on church membership/attendance.
Some of the older priests (at least here) became priests for varying reasons having nothing to do with being called by God.
There are fewer priests today but they truly believe in the Priesthood and are even a little discouraged when they get out of seminary and find that there's administrative work to be done. I've been told by a brand new priest (3 years) that they're not properly trained for this.
However, I was in administrative work (secretarial) as a profession and I can attest to the fact that it's not something that can be learned. You either have it or you don't.

Also, I agree fully that watering down our faith does not help.
Those that seek to be followers of Jesus are looking for stable support and not wishy washy churches
that attempt to appease the world paradigm by becoming LESS holy....
Liberalism should not be accepted by any denomination that aspire to follow Jesus and His teachings.
We don't need to belong to a church to be less holy...

-Some here love the current Pope. He's ruining the church.
His muddled statements and the continual need to clarify his statement is astounding.
And yet, many young priests look up to him....and some do not care for him.
Some are liberal and some aren't - and they carry that with them wherever they go.

Strong leadership and strong biblical doctrine are both necessary to "grow" a church/denomination.

 

[GodsGrace]

Ok, you admit to being a schismatic. Look what happens to everybody else who follows that path.

You won't watch them because they expose your ignorance. Others might.

Matthew 18:17 If the member refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if the offender refuses to listen even to the church, let such a one be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

Good bye.

Others might watch your videos?
I could post hundreds.
But I won't.
Know why?
People already hate the CC
and you and Bread are the reasons why.
Your dripping with hate and that's not what Jesus taught.
So maybe your CHURCH is teaching it to you?
Or maybe you're filled with sinful pride.
Or maybe you're just plain ................fill in the blank.

Smart persons know how to ATTRACT others to the CC....
The others know how to DISTANCE others from the CC

YOU are in the 2nd category.

 

[Marymog]

Actually, I attend the CC.

Another member here, name starts with Bread, just doesn't know when to stop.
I'm not here to criticize the CC except for maybe a couple of things that I can't agree with...
but my aim is not to debate this. Any denomination could teach whatever they want to....
but I don't have to agree. I've discussed this with some, BTW, and if they don't have a problem with it,
I don't know why Bread should have a problem with it. Plus, I think he's poison for the church and will
keep away anyone even CONSIDERING converting.

I said what I just told you above and he insisted that I give a list of what I don't agree with.
So there you have it.

I'm very protective of the CC....
So I'm not one to debate any teaching unless it's really necessary.

So, if you want to PM me, I'll tell you more - but otherwise, that's the story.
I've stopped posting to Bread, BTW.
I'm more than willing to discuss with you.

Thanks GG....

Based on your response it seems to me you just believe what you want, practice what you want, do what you want when it comes to being a Christian and adhering to the teachings of Christ and the Apostles. Some call it the lone wolf approach to Christianity. If they say they are Catholic but don't adhere to all Catholic teachings because they just can't agree with all of it's teachings, they call them a Cafeteria Catholic. You seem to fall in to that category. FYI.....Scripture teaches opposite of what you practice.

To the best of my knowledge @BreadOfLife only responds to or addresses false statements about The Church. He does a very good job of referencing Scripture to show how the doctrines of The Church match up with the teachings in Scripture. I don't know what you mean by he just doesn't know when to stop. I doubt he has been pestering you. He, to the best of my knowledge, only responds to falsehoods and doesn't pester others on this forum. He is very direct and sometimes condescending, but I don't think he pesters.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Mary!
I've been looking for you.
Nice to see you again.
The voice of reason....

OK so,
Married priests were Anglican and they've been accepted into the CC.
If their wife dies,,,,,zippo.
Same for Catholic Deacons, as I'm sure you know.

I know all the rest of it.
But the priesthood became celibate in the 1,200's.
So the CC was wrong before or it's wrong now.
I sure hope you don't reply with ongoing revelation....

And WHO am I supposed to stop listening to?
I don't listen to anybody....except those who know for sure.

Soooo GG are you going to address the fact that your statement was false or are we just going to pretend it didn't happen?

You said that it is wrong to ask that priests not marry. The Church doesn't ask priest not to marry/stay celibate, they agree not to get married and stay celibate AND there are married priest. It doesn't matter if they were Angelicin at one time or Baptist at one time...there are married priest and your statement was false. Furthermore, you just added another falsehood to your statement. They were not all former Angelicins! Would you like to admit that falsehood or we just going to pretend that didn't happen also?

You said that there is no mention of priestly celibacy in the NT and I gave you several verses from the NT that prove you to be wrong. Are you going to address your false statement or pretend it didn't happen?

Looking forward to your response and to set the record straight........Mary

 

[GodsGrace]

Thanks GG....

Based on your response it seems to me you just believe what you want, practice what you want, do what you want when it comes to being a Christian and adhering to the teachings of Christ and the Apostles. Some call it the lone wolf approach to Christianity. If they say they are Catholic but don't adhere to all Catholic teachings because they just can't agree with all of it's teachings, they call them a Cafeteria Catholic. You seem to fall in to that category. FYI.....Scripture teaches opposite of what you practice.

To the best of my knowledge @BreadOfLife only responds to or addresses false statements about The Church. He does a very good job of referencing Scripture to show how the doctrines of The Church match up with the teachings in Scripture. I don't know what you mean by he just doesn't know when to stop. I doubt he has been pestering you. He, to the best of my knowledge, only responds to falsehoods and doesn't pester others on this forum. He is very direct and sometimes condescending, but I don't think he pesters.

Mary

IF I say I DO NOT agree with a teaching...of whatever denomination....
that doesn't mean I'm lying....IT MEANS I DON'T AGREE WITH IT.

I don't like being called a liar because I don't agree with what you or @BreadOfLife believe is correct.

I also do not call myself a Catholic BECAUSE I don't agree with all the doctrine.
I give REASONS why I don't agree.

I'm not going to get into a debate about doctrine.
It doesn't matter if you don't understand what I mean that Bread doesn't know when to stop...
others on this thread, I'm sure, know exactly what I mean.
If he tried to go on some other forum, he'd be perm banned within 2 days.
He does not address persons with any decent civility and will turn many AGAINST CATHOLICISM.

I like to correct Protestants when they misunderstand something about the catholic faith.
That's all I plan to do on this particular thread.

I don't plan to justify myself to you, Bread, Judas or anybody else.

And lone wolf?
My oh my.
Far from it.....
I'm VERY INVOLVED with the Catholic church ....which is why I know a bit more than some on here.
EVEN THOUGH I DON'T AGREE WITH ALL ITS DOCTRINES.

And, again, if I'm accepted by that church, I certainly don't need the acceptance of anyone on this forum.

I'm going to continue to speak to Protestants...
I will no longer address Catholics here who do more to HARM THE CHURCH than to help it.

 

[GodsGrace]

Soooo GG are you going to address the fact that your statement was false or are we just going to pretend it didn't happen?

You said that it is wrong to ask that priests not marry. The Church doesn't ask priest not to marry/stay celibate, they agree not to get married and stay celibate AND there are married priest. It doesn't matter if they were Angelicin at one time or Baptist at one time...there are married priest and your statement was false. Furthermore, you just added another falsehood to your statement. They were not all former Angelicins! Would you like to admit that falsehood or we just going to pretend that didn't happen also?

You said that there is no mention of priestly celibacy in the NT and I gave you several verses from the NT that prove you to be wrong. Are you going to address your false statement or pretend it didn't happen?

Looking forward to your response and to set the record straight........Mary

Here's setting the record straight and I'll reply to no further posts from you:

1. There is NO WHERE in the NT that states that Priests could not be married.
In fact, they were married until 1,200AD and the reason this changed was not for spiritual reasons....you'll have to do some studying yourself.

Please support your statement that a normal, semnarian of the Catholic Church, could be married but still go to seminary and come out a Priest. Thanks.

The verses you provided is not addressed to the NECESSITY of priests being EITHER unmarried OIR celibate.
This is an idea the CC had back in 1,200 WHICH IS NOT BASED ON SCRIPTURE but on its own convenience.

YOU lie when you stare that it's in the NT.
YOU lie when you state that there are married priests as if a man could decide to become a Priest, go to seminary, and THEN GET MARRIED and still PRACTICE being a priest. PRACTICE dear Marymog.

And this is it for me.

PS I remembered you as being a nice person....
guess you've been around Bread for too long and have absorbed his attitude.
Too mad.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Soooo GG are you going to address the fact that your statement was false or are we just going to pretend it didn't happen?

You said that it is wrong to ask that priests not marry. The Church doesn't ask priest not to marry/stay celibate, they agree not to get married and stay celibate AND there are married priest. It doesn't matter if they were Angelicin at one time or Baptist at one time...there are married priest and your statement was false. Furthermore, you just added another falsehood to your statement. They were not all former Angelicins! Would you like to admit that falsehood or we just going to pretend that didn't happen also?

You said that there is no mention of priestly celibacy in the NT and I gave you several verses from the NT that prove you to be wrong. Are you going to address your false statement or pretend it didn't happen?

Looking forward to your response and to set the record straight........Mary

Suffering under a bad pope is far preferable to sedevacantism. The damage a bad pope can do is limited by Divine decree. The damage we ourselves can do is not.

Sedevacantism: An attack on the Church’s Authority Principle

The theory of sedevacantism has arisen at least six times just in my own lifetime: A foolhardy way to escape a pope we think wrong.

www.catholicculture.org

 

[BreadOfLife]

IF I say I DO NOT agree with a teaching...of whatever denomination....
that doesn't mean I'm lying....IT MEANS I DON'T AGREE WITH IT.

I don't like being called a liar because I don't agree with what you or @BreadOfLife believe is correct.

I also do not call myself a Catholic BECAUSE I don't agree with all the doctrine.
I give REASONS why I don't agree.

I'm not going to get into a debate about doctrine.
It doesn't matter if you don't understand what I mean that Bread doesn't know when to stop...
others on this thread, I'm sure, know exactly what I mean.
If he tried to go on some other forum, he'd be perm banned within 2 days.
He does not address persons with any decent civility and will turn many AGAINST CATHOLICISM.

I like to correct Protestants when they misunderstand something about the catholic faith.
That's all I plan to do on this particular thread.

I don't plan to justify myself to you, Bread, Judas or anybody else.

And lone wolf?
My oh my.
Far from it.....
I'm VERY INVOLVED with the Catholic church ....which is why I know a bit more than some on here.
EVEN THOUGH I DON'T AGREE WITH ALL ITS DOCTRINES.

And, again, if I'm accepted by that church, I certainly don't need the acceptance of anyone on this forum.

I'm going to continue to speak to Protestants...
I will no longer address Catholics here who do more to HARM THE CHURCH than to help it.

Your statement above in RED is precisely WHY I have accused you of lying. I specifically said that I wouldn’t have a problem with it If ALL you sis was disagree with Catholic doctrine.

HOWEVER, you go further than that by falsely claiming that a Catholic doesn’t have to believe in all Catholic doctrine and dogma. You have repeated this lie on numerous occasions.

A Catholic who rejects doctrine and dogma is a PROTESTANT. It’s exactly what your Protestant Fathers did in the 16th century.

If it offends you when I expose your lies – then STOP LYING . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Your gaslighting has long been acknowledged.

Your pretense of being a self-noteworthy expert in Biblical understanding has long been acknowledged.

Your posts routinely reflect YOUR view of YOU are always RIGHT and everyone else WRONG who disagrees with YOU has been acknowledged.

I couldn’t care less if all you did was “disagree”.
Unforyunately, you don't stop there and instead, persist in vomitting out hatred and lies.

And yoiur "gaslighting" excise for not havubg an intekkigent resposne has gotten tired and boring . . .

Get over yourself…very few are soliciting YOU for your personal Biblical views or your regular rants of personal attacks.

You have chosen your path, be content, without being a false accuser, it’s old and boring to say the least.

Not my JOB to continuously PROVE anything to YOU. My JOB is to TRUST the knowledge IN Scripture OVER YOU…and TRUST to Believe God IS the Provider of His Understanding of His Knowledge…And CHRIST JESUS IS the HEAD of His Church…
NOT YOU, NOT your Church, NOT your Gentile fathers, NOT your “catholic” brothers.

Matters NOT to me…what YOU Believe, what YOU Claim, what YOU Do. YOU alone are accountable FOR your own choices.

You and I Disagree on basic tenants…
so what…get over it.

I see you’re trapped in the mire of your usual hypocrisy.
You’re entire diatribe is a personal attack.

Praise, Worship, Adoration, Prayers and Glory “TO” God Alone…

Taken

Well – 4 out of 5 ain’r bad . . .

“Pray” simply means “ASK”. We can ASK fellow members of the Body of Christ to pray for us – whether they are here on earth or in Heaven.

James 4:16
Confess therefore your sins one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The supplication of a righteous man availeth much in its working.

 

[GodsGrace]

Your statement above in RED is precisely WHY I have accused you of lying. I specifically said that I wouldn’t have a problem with it If ALL you sis was disagree with Catholic doctrine.

HOWEVER, you go further than that by falsely claiming that a Catholic doesn’t have to believe in all Catholic doctrine and dogma. You have repeated this lie on numerous occasions.

A Catholic who rejects doctrine and dogma is a PROTESTANT. It’s exactly what your Protestant Fathers did in the 16th century.

If it offends you when I expose your lies – then STOP LYING . . .

1. Ask some Priests....re not believing ALL catholic doctrine.....see what THEY tell you.

2. 90% of Catholics do not accept ALL CATHOLIC DOGMA.

So you're one of the very few REAL CATHOLICS!

Kuddos.

 

[BreadOfLife]

1. Ask some Priests....re not believing ALL catholic doctrine.....see what THEY tell you.

2. 90% of Catholics do not accept ALL CATHOLIC DOGMA.

So you're one of the very few REAL CATHOLICS!

Kuddos.

I don’t care about what a renegade priest tells me. I go straight to the Magisterium.
Unfortunately, there are some priests who get it wrong.

I heard a priest explain to a congregation once that the miracle of the Feeding of the 5000 was NOT about Jesus multiplying the food – but that that they shared what they had brought with them.

He was a wrong as your priest friend who tells you that we can reject Catholic doctrine and still be in good standing. Your Protestant Fathers were guilty of this very thing . . .


PS – I thought you were “done” with me.
Hmmmm . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Again, I don’t care what you wanna read. You could read lady and the tramp or whatever. You can read the book of Mormon if you want. Catholics are so superstitious they believe about anything they’re told.

I guess all of the historical facts I gave you were too much to handle . . .

So, tell me, cultist –
WHY haven’t you been able to show me how the 7 Deuterocanonical Books “contraduct the rest of Scripture?

Why do you adhere to a POST-Christ, POST-Temple Canon of Scripture that was declared by a FALSE Prophet (Akiva) who proclaimed a FALSE “Christ” (Kokhba).