We are judged by works, not by faith

[Ghada]

And your gospewl of living a sinlessly perfect life is a false gospel.

You do despise it, that's for sure. "What? No sinning at all? Are you kidding me!? What reprobate came up with that one!?"

And, your gospel of living sinful for life, is the gospel of man's religion. And so we reject each other's gospels. No surprise there.

I'll keep my gospel of being newborn of God sinless, and keeping that way through Jesus Christ.

Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

I do not believe in nor practice your manner of teaching myself, that I am reconciled with God by Jesus, while continuing sinning as before unto death. Not even of sinning less than before unto death.

Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

The Bible Jesus Christ is not unequally yoked with any unbeliever, which is any unrepented sinner not yet obeying His command to repent.

Partial repentance of double minded Christianity, is not the whole hearted repentance of all sinning commanded by Jesus, for the sole sake of walking with Jesus, even as He walked with the Father.

And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

That ye might walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing, being fruitful in every good work, and increasing in the knowledge of God; Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness;

I completely reject the inglorious power of Christian religion, to sin less.

Including the Christian doctrine against being born again sinless of God, and ceasing from sinning against God.

By your one simple rejection of ceasing from sinning, your whole gospel is rejected by 2 Peter 2.

 

[Ghada]

Well it is just you and a few others who have been deceived by doctrine of demons who believe you no longer commit any sin in thought word or deed.

So, now in your gospel only demons teach to cease from sinning and do it.

But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;...Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

Seriously, can you not get any more in opposition to the Bible?? When you leave your doctrine-talk, your ad-libbing dives deep into the pit.

But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.

I would love to read your mind and see how you justify your sins to not have to call them sin.

No you don't. It's too pure. You'd get bored looking around for the lust you know so well.

And also, since you don't believe the things I say from the Bible, nor what I testify of in my own life, then you wouldn't believe it, even if you see the truth and purity of it in my heart and mind.

You don't even believe it is impossible when the Bible says it.

Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You do despise it, that's for sure. "What? No sinning at all? Are you kidding me!? What reprobate came up with that one!?"

Now you lie.

I despise the lie that conceived it and has you held captive in its evil.

But as you now have resorted to lying about me, to me- Have the last word, for I am done with one who is a liar.

 

[dad]

The new birth of God to become as Jesus is, is not for you then. Which is obvious since you mock it.

Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.
Philippians 3:12

You should be so lucky

Making yourself better at sinning less is fine for Christian religion, not for being resurrected unto life.

He chastens us and makes us bear fruit. As one pastor put it

"perfectionism is really the sin of pride. Perfectionism is a battle of self-worth and a lack of trust in God’s acceptance of you through Jesus’ saving work on the cross."

13 Bible Verses About Perfect

Here are 13 Bible verses for what the Scriptures say about perfect and perfection. Do you struggle with feeling like you have to do everything exactly right? Or do you give up with frustration when you can’t achieve impossible (and unrealistic) standards? Read on to learn more about how...

theholymess.com

Jesus said if a brother sins, you say when. One is the kingdom of Christ, and the other is your churches.

You want to pretend that would be never? Yet Jesus said if a brother sins 70 times you still must forgive. Doesn't seem like never to me

Since you reject ever being newborn pure and sinless in Christ, then your still wearing the same old filthy diapers. Now as a Christian. They're no doubt quite white on the outside now.

He cleans up thos born again. The real tragedy is those painted graves that pretend they are full of life and goodness.

Your life. You reject 2 Peter 1 in order not to fall.

The first verse in that chapter sheds light on the issue

2 Peter 1:1
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Not through the perfection you think you have. I kid you not

Jesus doesn't fall nor fail with you, nor in you. Your Christ is the failure, not Jesus Christ.

Jesus does not fail in chastening His Own. He does not do so for nothing.

Once again. What sins are these you keep claiming.

The greatest sin is pride, you know that? People to proud to admit they make mistakes sometimes do so out of pride. For brothers doing some sin that might offend or hurt other believers, that is nothing the same.

We have a good Lawyer!
1 John 2:1 (My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin.) But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous One

Hebrews 10:14 For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy

If they were all perfect who could be made holy? It takes time.

Philippians 3:12 It’s not that I have already reached this goal or have already become perfect. But I keep pursuing it

Get over it, it is NOT like that.

He not only begins a good work in us, He finishes it one day. (Not in one day)

Philippians 1:3-6 I give thanks to my God for every remembrance of you, always praying with joy for all of you in my every prayer, because of your partnership in the gospel from the first day until now. I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.


1 John 4:16
And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

1 John 4:17
Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.


We are being made perfect not by our works but by His love in us

 

[dad]

James 5:16 Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.

Those who claim to have no sin cannot do that.

 

[Ghada]

I despise the lie that conceived it and has you held captive in its evil.

You don't despise Christians speaking of not sinning, but only despise the lie of thinking such a thing?

Definitely a distinction without a difference.

 

[Jack]

"We are judged by works, not by faith"

Hebrews 11
6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

 

[Ghada]

Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.
Philippians 3:12

Of course this is after the resurrection of the body, with perfect immortal flesh and bones like Jesus' resurrection. The mind and spirit of them overcoming sinning in the end, is also perfected as God on the throne. That is when those enduring temptation like Jesus, will never have temptation to endure and the devil to fight again.

The unrepented of sinning, with lust still in the heart, aren't resurrected unto life. The manner of our heart, soul and life at death, is the manner of our eternal future, after God judges our works without respect of persons.

Hebrews 10:14 For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy

If they were all perfect who could be made holy?

True. Christian perfection of the Bible on earth is being holy in all manner of life with blameless living. It's not the perfection of God on the throne, where we couldn't even be tempted. That is only after the resurrection of the body unto life. (See above correction of your forced error with Phillip 3:12)

 

[Ghada]

"perfectionism is really the sin of pride. Perfectionism is a battle of self-worth and a lack of trust in God’s acceptance of you through Jesus’ saving work on the cross."

So your imperfect gospel preaches. I reject it.

I choose the Bible gospel:

And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Let your heart therefore be perfect with the LORD our God, to walk in his statutes, and to keep his commandments, as at this day.

I will behave myself wisely in a perfect way. O when wilt thou come unto me? I will walk within my house with a perfect heart.

Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you.

Epaphras, who is one of you, a servant of Christ, saluteth you, always labouring fervently for you in prayers, that ye may stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.

But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you.

The double hearted gospel of self-willed efforts to just sin less, of course rejects the Bible gospel of being perfect of heart, soul, and life holy and blameless with Christ in love of God.

This is the only gospel I believe from the heart, live, and preach. I also reject your mockery of it.

 

[Ghada]

You want to pretend that would be never? Yet Jesus said if a brother sins 70 times you still must forgive. Doesn't seem like never to me

You're gospel makes this a commandment to sin 70 times and assumes by your own sinful experience, that all Christians must do the same. I reject it.

Unlike your doctrine, Jesus was commanding forgiveness if we sin against one another. He was not commanding us to sin against one another, so that we could 'practice' forgiving one another.

Does your church have 'slapping sessions', where you go around slapping one another, in order to perfect forgiving one another?

Is it like that movie scene, where the guy kept saying, "Thank you sir, may I have another!"

 

[Ghada]

He cleans up those born again.

All at once with a perfectly pure heart toward God and blameless life just like the child Jesus. This of course is only for those repented of sinning first, and then believing the gospel of Jesus Christ, to always now please God just as Jesus did. That's the only brethren of the Lord on earth.

Your unrepented faith and gospel is just another religion of partial ongoing partial repentance, with a never ending 'progressive' self-transformation of sinning less. It's basically a restart for sinners, but this time around only seeking to sin less. But never ever not sinning just as before.

I call it the Christian religion reboot for continued unrepented sinners.

The first verse in that chapter sheds light on the issue

2 Peter 1:1
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
Not through the perfection you think you have. I kid you not

But since you also deny doing the righteousness of God without sinning, then what's the difference?

The perfection Christianity of the Bible is, of course, simply loving God with a whole heart and living blamelessly without sinning with the devil against God.

Blessed are they that keep judgment, and he that doeth righteousness at all times.

If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

 

[Ghada]

The greatest sin is pride, you know that? People to proud to admit they make mistakes sometimes do so out of pride.

Oh, I make mistakes. I'm just not sinning with works of the flesh from a lusting heart.

Why do you only speak of mistakes in your life, and never speak of any actual sins. You call yourself a sinner. You say you still sin. You resent any Christian not joining you. And so, I'll ask again. What are these sins you keep talking about for yourself?

Or do you call the unrighteous works of the flesh, 'mistakes'.

We have a good Lawyer!
1 John 2:1 (My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin.) But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous One

You quote 'if', but preach 'when'.

He not only begins a good work in us, He finishes it one day. (Not in one day)

Your gospel doesn't preach that of the Bible. The Bible preaches the all at once perfect conversion of Jesus Christ. In one moment of time, them that repent and believe from the heart unto God's righteousness, are immediately made holy, pure, and blameless in life, just like Jesus born into the world by Mary.

Your reboot gospel, that 'takes time' to stop being a devil's child by works, is not that of the Bible. And of course, it never includes not being a devil's child by works at all.

It takes time.

In your 'progressive' gospel of trying to sin less and so make yourself more holy. But never being holy in all our living without sinning with the unholy devil.

How much time does it take to stop doing works of the flesh? Does it take a year or so to work on not getting drunk? A month or two to not stealing? A decade to stop the vile cursing? How long does your gospel give, because you declare enough is enough, and begin judging the works of Christians claiming saving faith?

We are being made perfect not by our works but by His love in us

God's love is not in those unrepented of all sinning, and still hating Him by sinning with the world.

Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

Maybe less of the time now in the converted sinners' 2nd time around, but still doing it.

 

[dad]

Of course this is after the resurrection of the body, with perfect immortal flesh and bones like Jesus' resurrection.

No, that was Paul talking and still very much alive and on planet earth.

The unrepented of sinning, with lust still in the heart, aren't resurrected unto life.

Once saved we have repented. Our eternal life does not then hinge on whether we glance at a chic before catching ourselves etc

The manner of our heart, soul and life at death, is the manner of our eternal future, after God judges our works without respect of persons.

The only manner that matters is if Jesus is in us and we accepted Him. Rather than strain at little possible sin nats of the righteous, you would be better to cast your gaze upon Jesus. Look full in His wonderful face.

True. Christian perfection of the Bible on earth is being holy in all manner of life with blameless living. It's not the perfection of God on the throne, where we couldn't even be tempted. That is only after the resurrection of the body unto life. (See above correction of your forced error with Phillip 3:12)

I see. So now you are perfect on earth because you resit every and all temptation always. Heaven help you if you grab that extra cookie someday.

 

[dad]

So your imperfect gospel preaches. I reject it.

I choose the Bible gospel:

And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Let your heart therefore be perfect with the LORD our God, to walk in his statutes, and to keep his commandments, as at this day.

So when Jesus told His disciples to not let their heart be troubled, you think they were not saved??

But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

Did you take that to mean that if someone like Martha was impatient (Jesus took so long to get to Lazarus's grave) they were not saved??

But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you.

Did you think that meant that when they first started having suffering they were not saved, only after they suffered a lot they were perfect and saved??

..Bible gospel of being perfect of heart, soul, and life holy and blameless with Christ in love of God.

The gospel is that Jesus died for our sins.

 

[dad]

You're gospel makes this a commandment to sin 70 times and assumes by your own sinful experience, that all Christians must do the same.

No it makes it something Jesus pointed out. We are to forgive...and if people were perfect there would be no need.

Unlike your doctrine, Jesus was commanding forgiveness if we sin against one another.

Perfect people sin??? Why would anyone ever need to forgive a perfect sinless saint??

He was not commanding us to sin against one another, so that we could 'practice' forgiving one another.

Of course He did not ask us to sin. He pointed out that we would still need forgiveness for sinning.

 

[dad]

All at once with a perfectly pure heart toward God and blameless life just like the child Jesus.

Say what? Did the child Jesus say, like Paul, 'O wretched man that I am'?

Your unrepented faith and gospel

Lie. To be saved we need to repent. Your claims of perfection after repenting are made up.

But since you also deny doing the righteousness of God without sinning, then what's the difference?

The righteousness of God is Jesus! He helps us be like Him. That requires judgments and chastening etc. People did not walk out of the river after being Baptized as sinless perfect beings.

The perfection Christianity of the Bible is, of course, simply loving God with a whole heart and living blamelessly without sinning with the devil against God.

So why would He chasten every single saved person exactly? For kicks?

If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

Right, seeing good fruit tells us what kind of tree it is. Bearing apples, however is not what saved us.

 

[dad]

Oh, I make mistakes. I'm just not sinning with works of the flesh from a lusting heart.

Well, you can call a manure pile a gem if you like. However, the bible is full of it's heros sinning and trespassing and falling and learning to do better. Did David get unsaved when he numbered Israel against God's will, and lusted after another man's wife? No. He got judged and punished harshly.

Why do you only speak of mistakes in your life, and never speak of any actual sins. You call yourself a sinner. You say you still sin. You resent any Christian not joining you. And so, I'll ask again. What are these sins you keep talking about for yourself?

I point out that all have sinned. It is also true that His people require chastening and that means they are not yet literally perfect.

Or do you call the unrighteous works of the flesh, 'mistakes'.

Jesus mentioned trespasses, will that do?

You quote 'if', but preach 'when'.

Paul did what he did not want to do at times. Like clockwork people do imperfect things.

The Bible preaches the all at once perfect conversion of Jesus Christ. In one moment of time, them that repent and believe from the heart unto God's righteousness, are immediately made holy, pure, and blameless in life, just like Jesus born into the world by Mary.

No. He says we need to forgive brethren for sins, and that He needs to correct us in life. Not that we are perfect the moment we come to Him.

Your reboot gospel, that 'takes time' to stop being a devil's child by works,

False. We are His children soon as we get saved. Not the devil's children at all any more ever. Brothers we forgive are not children of the devil!

How much time does it take to stop doing works of the flesh?

Your life time! (with His help)

God's love is not in those unrepented of all sinning, and still hating Him by sinning with the world.

The saved have repented. Then they also need to do some more repenting at times, but that is nothing to do with salvation. Once we are sons, we are sons, period.

Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

Not sure what you thought that verse meant and why you posted it, as if in relation too the discussion here.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You don't despise Christians speaking of not sinning, but only despise the lie of thinking such a thing?

Definitely a distinction without a difference.

Only in your mind! I desire with all my hear to attain sinlessness, but until that day, I am saved sealed, redeem,ed, perfected, justified and being sancrtified. YOu are under a delusion that you have ceased from sinning and never give in to your fallen human nature which is still alive and well in you though rendered dead

 

[Ghada]

I desire with all my heart to attain sinlessness,

Then repent of all your sinning, not just in part at your leisure.

Your hope to repent fully at His appearing won't happen. The heart doesn't change from unrighteousness to righteousness by face to face challenges.

And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

(For we walk by faith, not by sight)

Also, sinless Christians don't attain to sinlessness, but only repent for it in this life, and believe Jesus to purge us wholly to be blameless as He.

It's the resurrection of the dead unto life, that the repented believers attain to by keeping ourselves sinless, even as when first being pure newborn of God, with all things being of God, even as the Son of God.

but until that day,

You'll just keep on sinning in unrepentance.

I am saved sealed, redeem,ed, perfected,

Perfected? What about all your railing against Christian perfection?

And so here it is. You're sinless within the cup, while still sinful without. And you really like the idea of also being sinless without, but yoju won't repent for it.

Jesus teaches and commands to repent and be sinless within the cup and also without.

So now, you're preaching sinlessness within only. Why do you rail against preaching sinlessness at all? Just clarify that you preach being perfected sinless within only, and condemn those who also preach being sinless without.

justified and being sancrtified.

And so, once again the Christian gospel of being all good and holy and sinless on the inside only, while still 'working on' repenting of all sinning outwardly. Which of course never ends in repenting of all sinning until the grave. That's when yhou hope the appearing and sight of Jesus will move you to finally just repent of all sinning at once. Won't happen.

And of course, the Bible sanctification from sin and sinning is all at once in this life, is through the thorough and all complete purging, cleansing, and washing away in the blood of the Lamb.

And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Sanctification-wise, you rate as such are some of you.

YOu are under a delusion that you have ceased from sinning and never give in to your fallen human nature

And now, you claim claim being perfected and having a fallen human nature at the same time. I claim the new divine nature. You can keep your gospel of continued fallen human nature and sinning, before, during, and after your conversion to Christian religion.

which is still alive and well in me

I see. Having your fallen human nature is alive, well, and really swell.

It suits you quite well.

though rendered dead

Another one of those nonsensical things, that only the really 'spiritual' can figure out.

You think it's really swell to have your sinful human nature alive and well, and yet it's dead.

Here, I think I've got it. Your sinful fallen human nature is only in your body of outward living, while the new divine nature of God is in your soul alone. Which of course is all by faith alone.

Your soul is perfected in Christ, but not your life. The Bible differs.

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

It's not just our soul and spirit hid in Christ, but also our body and life.

And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Waiting until the grave and Jesus confronting you face to face, in order to finally repent and live blamelessly, doesn't work.

And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

(For we walk by faith, not by sight)

 

[Ghada]

So when Jesus told His disciples to not let their heart be troubled, you think they were not saved??

Did you take that to mean that if someone like Martha was impatient (Jesus took so long to get to Lazarus's grave) they were not saved??


Did you think that meant that when they first started having suffering they were not saved, only after they suffered a lot they were perfect and saved??

You don't even know that no man was saved and justified by Jesus Christ, before His resurrection.

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Your gospel of salvation for man before Jesus' resurrection, is not the Bible.