How are we to reckon ourselves as being dead to sin?

[Lizbeth]

John 18:20 KJV
[20] Jesus answered him, I spake openly to the world; I ever taught in the synagogue, and in the temple, whither the Jews always resort; and in secret have I said nothing.

Your still placing yourselves in the text where you don’t belong.

(shaking my head) There are reasons why believers know that we know that we don't belong to this world. We're in the world but not of it.

 

[Lizbeth]

Seems though with most the mental ascension always comes first.

Religion seems to hold people captive.

I assume you're talking about mental assent....? That's the point though, it isn't just mental assent with true believers. Our faith is due to a miraculous intervention of God.

 

[Waiting on him]

I assume you're talking about mental assent....? That's the point though, it isn't just mental assent with true believers. Our faith is due to a miraculous intervention of God.

Ok, go with that.

 

[Waiting on him]

Just because people can regurgitate commentary. Doesn’t make them genuine.

 

[Waiting on him]

Hebrews 1:2 KJV
[2] Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Three profound truths here.

 

[Waiting on him]

I assume you're talking about mental assent....? That's the point though, it isn't just mental assent with true believers. Our faith is due to a miraculous intervention of God.

Yes, my spell check makes many assumptions as well.

 

[Lizbeth]

Ok, go with that.

I think the wonderful, priceless, life and heart changing work that God wrought in us deserves much better than a cynical attitude like that.

 

[Waiting on him]

I think the wonderful, priceless, life and heart changing work that God wrought in us deserves much better than a cynical attitude like that.

I’m sorry I seem cynical, maybe I am. Could be I believe you are trapped in a great delusion?

 

[Waiting on him]

I think the wonderful, priceless, life and heart changing work that God wrought in us deserves much better than a cynical attitude like that.

Jesus also told the religious dictates of his time, they look good on the outside.

 

[Johann]

Precisely, you do realize this was written to religious dictators who had just escaped Judaism?

Incorrect-

The phrase "in Ephesus" is omitted in the RSV, NJB and Williams translations because it is missing in some of the earliest Greek manuscripts (P46, א, and B). There apparently was a blank space where a place name should have been inserted. It was a circular letter for all of the churches of Asia Minor. The letters to the seven churches in Revelation 2-3 show an ancient Roman postal route.
The KJV translation has "conversation," which meant "lifestyle" in a.d. 1611 when that translation was written. This clearly shows the need for updating translations! No translation is inspired. Their job is to communicate the gospel to one or more generations. Only the original message given by God is inspired.

In this letter, Paul addressed Gentile members of the Church (see Ephesians 2:11) who were perhaps recent converts (see Ephesians 1:15). He wrote to help develop the spirituality and testimonies of those who were already members.

"the old self" This refers to mankind's fallen characteristics and propensities in Adam (cf. Rom. 6:6; Col. 3:9). It is the priority of self, independence from God, more and more for me at any cost!

4:23 "you be renewed in the spirit of your mind," This is a present passive infinitive. Believers are to continue to be made new in their thinking by allowing the Spirit to develop the mind of Christ in them (cf. Rom. 12:2; Titus 3:5). This is an aspect of the "new covenant" from Jer. 31:31-34 (cf. Ezek. 36:22-38).

4:24 "put on" This is an aorist middle infinitive. This is the clothing metaphor which emphasizes the continuing decision to be in Christ (cf. Rom. 13:14; Gal. 3:27; Col. 3:8,10,12,14; James 1:21; 1 Pet. 2:1). This terminology of putting on Christ may have even been connected to the ordinance of baptism in the early church, where new converts put on clean, white clothing after baptism. It denotes a volitional choice!

"new self" This is a metaphor for the new life in Christ. Peter called it "partaking of the divine nature" in 2 Pet. 1:4. This is in contrast to the old fallen Adamic nature of Eph. 4:22.

"in the likeness of God" Believers should have the family characteristics of God (cf. Rom. 8:28-29; Gal. 4:19). The Bible emphasizes our position in Christ and also our need for progressive Christlikeness. Salvation is free, but maturity costs everything! Christianity is both a death and a life, a point and a process, a gift and a reward! This paradox is very difficult for modern people to grasp. They tend to emphasize one aspect or the other.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"that you walk no longer" In Eph. 4:17-19 there is a series of characteristics of the heathen lifestyle. These new believers themselves used to live like this (cf. Eph. 4:28). Paul lists the characteristics of fallen humanity several times in his writings (cf. Rom. 1:29-31; 1 Cor. 5:11; 6:9; 2 Cor. 12:20; Gal. 5:19-21; Eph. 4:19,31; 5:3-4; Col. 3:5-9). Col. 3:5.

How to produce holiness was the major conflict between Paul and the Jewish legalists. Both Paul and the Judaizers wanted a righteous lifestyle in converts. Paul acknowledged the past pagan sins of these believers, but believed that free grace, an indwelling Spirit, and a growing knowledge of the gospel would produce what legalism could not. The performance of the Old Covenant has been replaced by the new heart and mind of the New Covenant (cf. Jer. 31:31-34; Ezek. 36:22-32).

NASB, NKJV,
NRSV"in the futility of their mind,"
TEV"whose thoughts are worthless"
NJB"the empty-headed life"

This term means "vain," "empty," "aimless" (cf. Rom. 1:21). Verses 17-19 refer to either (1) the false teachers' speculations or (2) the believers' previous lives in paganism.

4:18 "being darkened in their understanding" This is a perfect passive participle. Their current state of spiritual blindness (as is ours) is a result of (1) supernatural temptation; (2) heretical influence; and (3) personal choice.

"excluded from the life of God" This is another perfect passive participle. This refers to separation from the OT covenant God and His promises (cf. Eph. 2:12).

"because of the ignorance that is in them" This refers to self-willed ignorance (cf. Romans 1:18-3:20).

"because of the stubbornness of their hearts" This is the abiding results of the fall (cf. Gen. 3; John 3:17-25). Col. 2:2.

4:19

NASB"having become callous"
NKJV"being past feeling"
NRSV"have lost all sensitivity"
TEV"have lost all feeling of shame"
NJB"sense of right and wrong once dulled"

This is another perfect active participle. Fallen humanity had become, and remained, insensitive or hardened beyond feeling, to both natural revelation (cf. Ps. 19:1-6; Rom. 1:18-2:16) and special revelation of the Bible and the Son, the written word (cf. Ps. 19:7-12) and the living Word (cf. John 1:1-14).

NASB"having given themselves over to sensuality"
NKJV"having given themselves over to licentiousness"
NRSV"have abandoned themselves to licentiousness"
TEV"give themselves over to vice"
NJB"have abandoned themselves to sexuality"

This literally means "open shamefulness" (cf. Rom. 1:24, 26, 28). Fallen humanity has abandoned all restraints, social and spiritual. These false teachers even shocked other pagans.

NASB"for the practice of every kind of impurity with greediness"
NKJV"to work all uncleanness with greediness"
NRSV"greedy to practice every kind of impurity"
TEV"and all sorts of indecent things without restraint"
NJB"eagerly pursue a career of indecency of every kind"

This means more and more for me at any cost (cf. Col. 3:5). Fallen humanity has lost the sense of corporate good. Humans live only for themselves, for the moment. This is the curse of the Fall of Genesis 3. It is so clearly manifested in modern western society!

4:20 "but you did not learn Christ in this way" This is a strong contrast between Christ's preachers and the false teachers. Verse 17 implies a contrast between their previous life in paganism and their new life in Christ.

 

[Waiting on him]

Incorrect-

The phrase "in Ephesus" is omitted in the RSV, NJB and Williams translations because it is missing in some of the earliest Greek manuscripts (P46, א, and B). There apparently was a blank space where a place name should have been inserted. It was a circular letter for all of the churches of Asia Minor. The letters to the seven churches in Revelation 2-3 show an ancient Roman postal route.
The KJV translation has "conversation," which meant "lifestyle" in a.d. 1611 when that translation was written. This clearly shows the need for updating translations! No translation is inspired. Their job is to communicate the gospel to one or more generations. Only the original message given by God is inspired.

In this letter, Paul addressed Gentile members of the Church (see Ephesians 2:11) who were perhaps recent converts (see Ephesians 1:15). He wrote to help develop the spirituality and testimonies of those who were already members.

"the old self" This refers to mankind's fallen characteristics and propensities in Adam (cf. Rom. 6:6; Col. 3:9). It is the priority of self, independence from God, more and more for me at any cost!

4:23 "you be renewed in the spirit of your mind," This is a present passive infinitive. Believers are to continue to be made new in their thinking by allowing the Spirit to develop the mind of Christ in them (cf. Rom. 12:2; Titus 3:5). This is an aspect of the "new covenant" from Jer. 31:31-34 (cf. Ezek. 36:22-38).

4:24 "put on" This is an aorist middle infinitive. This is the clothing metaphor which emphasizes the continuing decision to be in Christ (cf. Rom. 13:14; Gal. 3:27; Col. 3:8,10,12,14; James 1:21; 1 Pet. 2:1). This terminology of putting on Christ may have even been connected to the ordinance of baptism in the early church, where new converts put on clean, white clothing after baptism. It denotes a volitional choice!

"new self" This is a metaphor for the new life in Christ. Peter called it "partaking of the divine nature" in 2 Pet. 1:4. This is in contrast to the old fallen Adamic nature of Eph. 4:22.

"in the likeness of God" Believers should have the family characteristics of God (cf. Rom. 8:28-29; Gal. 4:19). The Bible emphasizes our position in Christ and also our need for progressive Christlikeness. Salvation is free, but maturity costs everything! Christianity is both a death and a life, a point and a process, a gift and a reward! This paradox is very difficult for modern people to grasp. They tend to emphasize one aspect or the other.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"that you walk no longer" In Eph. 4:17-19 there is a series of characteristics of the heathen lifestyle. These new believers themselves used to live like this (cf. Eph. 4:28). Paul lists the characteristics of fallen humanity several times in his writings (cf. Rom. 1:29-31; 1 Cor. 5:11; 6:9; 2 Cor. 12:20; Gal. 5:19-21; Eph. 4:19,31; 5:3-4; Col. 3:5-9). Col. 3:5.

How to produce holiness was the major conflict between Paul and the Jewish legalists. Both Paul and the Judaizers wanted a righteous lifestyle in converts. Paul acknowledged the past pagan sins of these believers, but believed that free grace, an indwelling Spirit, and a growing knowledge of the gospel would produce what legalism could not. The performance of the Old Covenant has been replaced by the new heart and mind of the New Covenant (cf. Jer. 31:31-34; Ezek. 36:22-32).

NASB, NKJV,
NRSV"in the futility of their mind,"
TEV"whose thoughts are worthless"
NJB"the empty-headed life"

This term means "vain," "empty," "aimless" (cf. Rom. 1:21). Verses 17-19 refer to either (1) the false teachers' speculations or (2) the believers' previous lives in paganism.

4:18 "being darkened in their understanding" This is a perfect passive participle. Their current state of spiritual blindness (as is ours) is a result of (1) supernatural temptation; (2) heretical influence; and (3) personal choice.

"excluded from the life of God" This is another perfect passive participle. This refers to separation from the OT covenant God and His promises (cf. Eph. 2:12).

"because of the ignorance that is in them" This refers to self-willed ignorance (cf. Romans 1:18-3:20).

"because of the stubbornness of their hearts" This is the abiding results of the fall (cf. Gen. 3; John 3:17-25). Col. 2:2.

4:19

NASB"having become callous"
NKJV"being past feeling"
NRSV"have lost all sensitivity"
TEV"have lost all feeling of shame"
NJB"sense of right and wrong once dulled"

This is another perfect active participle. Fallen humanity had become, and remained, insensitive or hardened beyond feeling, to both natural revelation (cf. Ps. 19:1-6; Rom. 1:18-2:16) and special revelation of the Bible and the Son, the written word (cf. Ps. 19:7-12) and the living Word (cf. John 1:1-14).

NASB"having given themselves over to sensuality"
NKJV"having given themselves over to licentiousness"
NRSV"have abandoned themselves to licentiousness"
TEV"give themselves over to vice"
NJB"have abandoned themselves to sexuality"

This literally means "open shamefulness" (cf. Rom. 1:24, 26, 28). Fallen humanity has abandoned all restraints, social and spiritual. These false teachers even shocked other pagans.

NASB"for the practice of every kind of impurity with greediness"
NKJV"to work all uncleanness with greediness"
NRSV"greedy to practice every kind of impurity"
TEV"and all sorts of indecent things without restraint"
NJB"eagerly pursue a career of indecency of every kind"

This means more and more for me at any cost (cf. Col. 3:5). Fallen humanity has lost the sense of corporate good. Humans live only for themselves, for the moment. This is the curse of the Fall of Genesis 3. It is so clearly manifested in modern western society!

4:20 "but you did not learn Christ in this way" This is a strong contrast between Christ's preachers and the false teachers. Verse 17 implies a contrast between their previous life in paganism and their new life in Christ.

Who’s commentary have you pasted here?

 

[Johann]

Who’s commentary have you pasted here?

For me to know and you to find out--show me errors, and I will gladly correct-if you can't, hold your tongue.
Put on (endusasthai). First aorist middle infinitive of enduō (̇nō), for which see note on Col_3:10.
The new man (ton kainon anthrōpon). “The brand-new (see note on Eph_2:15) man,” though ton neon in Col_3:10.
After God (kata theon). After the pattern God, the new birth, the new life in Christ, destined to be like God in the end (Rom_8:29).
put on. Greek. enduo. See Rom_13:12, Rom_13:14. Gal_1:3, Gal_1:27.

the new man. The new nature.

which = that which.



is = was (Aor.)

created. Greek. ktizo. See Eph_2:10.

righteousness . . . holiness = true holiness and righteousness. Contrast Adam, Gen_1:27.

righteousness.

true. Literally of the truth. Greek. alstheia, as Eph_4:21.

holiness. Greek. hosiotes. Only here, and Luk_1:75.



1) "And that ye put on the new man" (kai endusasthai ton kainon anthropon) "And to dress up in, put on the new man, the new creature!" Outward reformation is to reflect an implanted new nature. Genuine morality is to be cultivated by inner power and influence of the new nature --- not by environmental social reform from without. Putting on and putting off are acts of choice while renewal is a process of inner change effected by the Holy Spirit, Joh_6:63. The Spirit quickens, makes alive, 2Co_3:6.

2) "Which after God" (ton kata theon) "Which according to God," God's pattern of creation or God's nature of holiness.

3) "Is created in righteousness and true holiness" (ktis henta en dikaiosune kai hosioteti) "Was created (the new man) in (a state or condition of) righteousness and or even holiness of being," 1Jn_3:9. His righteousness is in the new man, the new creature, 2Pe_1:4; Col_3:3-4; 2Co_5:17; Eph_2:10.

Now you were wrong in making this epistle solely to the Jews-correct?

 

[marks]

Jesus also told the religious dictates of his time, they look good on the outside.

That's nothing like @Lizbeth said however. We know we are His by His Spirit within us. This is how I know. It's not because we have good opinions of our behavior, it's not because we think we conform to some "Law", but because we know, that is, we have relationship with our Creator.

Why the need to cheapen this to be full of dead men's bones? The Holy Spirit gives us life, not death. It's a different life, not like the old life, and knowing Him. Otherwise, how are not not simply continuing in dead works?

Being Christian is about knowing God, and being alive in Him, and being a different person because of that.

Much love!

 

[Johann]

That's nothing like @Lizbeth said however. We know we are His by His Spirit within us. This is how I know. It's not because we have good opinions of our behavior, it's not because we think we conform to some "Law", but because we know, that is, we have relationship with our Creator.

Why the need to cheapen this to be full of dead men's bones? The Holy Spirit gives us life, not death. It's a different life, not like the old life, and knowing Him. Otherwise, how are not not simply continuing in dead works?

Being Christian is about knowing God, and being alive in Him, and being a different person because of that.

Much love!

Good night brother-2:13 AM-Morning.

Shalom
Johann.

 

[Episkopos]

I think the wonderful, priceless, life and heart changing work that God wrought in us deserves much better than a cynical attitude like that.

But is it really what should be building up a religious ego?

There is a great temptation to think we are doing God a service by uplifting ourselves and our status. The Pharisees thought they were needed to uphold the traditions of Moses.

But their self-importance got the better of them.

History continues to repeat itself.

 

[Waiting on him]

Now you were wrong in making this epistle solely to the Jews-correct?

I wasn’t trying too make you bite your tongue off,, it was merely a Question.

Did I say solely to Jews?

 

[ChristisGod]

But is it really what should be building up a religious ego?

There is a great temptation to think we are doing God a service by uplifting ourselves and our status. The Pharisees thought they were needed to uphold the traditions of Moses.

But their self-importance got the better of them.

History continues to repeat itself.

Reminds me of you online videos which you described to a tee in your post. So thanks .

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Precisely, you do realize this was written to religious dictators who had just escaped Judaism?

It was written to the Ephesians.

 

[Waiting on him]

It was written to the Ephesians.

It was written to the saints and to the those that were the faithful in Christ.

 

[Waiting on him]

It was written to the Ephesians.

And James was written too the twelve tribes of Israel.