Interpretation by hallucination is endemic in the dispen domain.
You fit right in.
Daniels 70-Weeks Timeline
- Thread starter Christian Gedge
- Start date
-
- Tags
- 70 weeks artaxerxes cyrus daniel seventy
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
You fit right in.
David Boyer
Active Member
I seriously don't have a clue what you are referencing.
I just read a post that had a contextual error and I pointed it out.
That is the extent of it.
David Boyer
Active Member
The Light
Well-Known Member
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
Why would a generation pass away looking for the Second Coming, but not the first coming?
There were only 2 people still alive who remembered when the time was up, and still looking for the Messiah. They were the only 2 people expecting the baby Jesus, and could die in peace knowing they saw the Messiah.
Not sure why a bunch of people 2,000 years later are so dead set they think they know every thing to the second, how the first century worked. Yes the time was up 50 to 30 years before Christ was born. Daniel did not write that Jesus would be baptized the split second of some countdown. They had all given up on a Messiah, and rejected Jesus because he was born out of the time they were expecting.
All that was given was some time after the 69th week, the Messiah would be cut off. That happened, literally. The 69 weeks were over even before the birth, but Simeon and Annah understood that point. Why do you all seem to have it all figured out, but since it happened 2,000 years ago, why is this such a big deal?
The Light
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure why you are confused. We have the Word in Daniel prophesying a specific event, the coming of the Messiah. Then we have the fulfillment.
Where are you getting this incorrect information from. Jesus arrived as Messiah exactly as prophesied.
Agreed. Daniel wrote that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks:
Daniel 9
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
Where do you get this stuff? Jesus the Messiah arrived exactly on time riding a donkey as prophesied.
I'm not sure where you are getting your information, but it is wrong. The 69 weeks were not over before the Messiah was born. If that was the case, the Word would be wrong. That's totally and completely IMPOSSIBLE. Think about what you are saying. Peter tells us prophesy is more accurate than an eyewitness.
2 Peter 1
19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
Well, first off, not many seem to have it figured out, even though we have the prophecy and the fulfillment.
The Light
Well-Known Member
It's such a big deal because the correct information proves the Messiah entered Jerusalem and was cut off by His death. Hence, the 70th week of Daniel has not occurred.
This means that the fullness of the Gentiles will come in as prophesied, and part of the Jews will have their eyes opened and God will keep His promise to His people. God will bring both Gentile and Jew into one fold. It's all about timing. The Gentile first and then the Jews.
John 10
16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
No, the coming of Messiah was the birth. Here:
25 And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him.
26 And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen the Lord's Christ.
27 And he came by the Spirit into the temple: and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him after the custom of the law,
28 Then took he him up in his arms, and blessed God, and said,
29 Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace, according to thy word:
30 For mine eyes have seen thy salvation,
31 Which thou hast prepared before the face of all people;
32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.
33 And Joseph and his mother marvelled at those things which were spoken of him.
34 And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold, this child is set for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against;
35 (Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.
36 And there was one Anna, a prophetess, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Aser: she was of a great age, and had lived with an husband seven years from her virginity;
37 And she was a widow of about fourscore and four years, which departed not from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day.
38 And she coming in that instant gave thanks likewise unto the Lord, and spake of him to all them that looked for redemption in Jerusalem.
39 And when they had performed all things according to the law of the Lord, they returned into Galilee, to their own city Nazareth.
40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.
This was the fulfillment of prophecy.
Jesus was cut off after 69 weeks. There is not going to be a 7 year period of Messiah the Prince. The 3.5 years as Messiah was accomplished.
The last half will be accomplished as Prince at the Second Coming. Matthew 25:31 shows us Jesus as Prince sitting on a throne in Jerusalem during the final harvest, known as Jacob's trouble. The Trumpets and Thunders is the record in Revelation of this last half of the 70th week.
State the exact verse in Revelation showing the full 70th week of 7 years, since you demand exactness.
Last edited:
ScottA
Well-Known Member
State anywhere it is written: 69+1 that actually shows a major gap of unknown time in between the 69th and 70th weeks.
Last edited:
jeffweeder
Well-Known Member
You are forgetting that 70 weeks were decreed for Daniels people to bring in Atonement...,
24 “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city,
to finish the transgression,
to make an end of sin,
to make atonement for iniquity,
to bring in everlasting righteousness,
to seal up vision and prophecy
and to anoint the most holy place.
Jesus did this for the Jew first before the good news went to the Gentiles.
Mk 7
24 Jesus got up and left there and went to the region of Tyre [and Sidon, the coastal area of Phoenicia]. He entered a house and did not want anyone to know about it; but it was impossible for Him to be hidden [from the public]. 25 Instead, after hearing about Him, a woman whose little daughter had an unclean spirit immediately came and fell at His feet. 26 Now the woman was a Gentile (Greek), a Syrophoenician by nationality. And she kept pleading with Him to drive the demon out of her daughter. 27 He was saying to her, “First let the children [of Israel] be fed, for it is not right to take the children’s bread and throw it to the pet dogs (non-Jews).” 28 But she replied, “Yes, Lord, but even the pet dogs under the table eat the children’s crumbs.” 29 And He said to her, “Because of this answer [reflecting your humility and faith], go [knowing that your request is granted]; the demon has left your daughter [permanently].” 30 And returning to her home, she found the child lying on the couch [relaxed and resting], the demon having gone.
Acts 13:46
38 So let it be clearly known by you, brothers, that through Him forgiveness of sins is being proclaimed to you; 39 and through Him everyone who believes [who acknowledges Jesus as Lord and Savior and follows Him] is justified and declared free of guilt from all things, from which you could not be justified and freed of guilt through the Law of Moses. 40 Therefore be careful, so that the thing spoken of in the [writings of the] Prophets does not come upon you:
41
‘Look, you mockers, and marvel, and perish and vanish away;
For I am doing a work in your days,
A work which you will never believe, even if someone describes it to you [telling you about it in detail].’”
42 As Paul and Barnabas were leaving [the synagogue], the people kept begging that these things might be spoken to them on the next Sabbath. 43 When the congregation of the synagogue had been dismissed, many of the Jews and the devout converts to Judaism followed Paul and Barnabas, who, talking to them were urging them to continue in the grace of God.
And [at the same time] Paul and Barnabas spoke out boldly and confidently, saying, “It was necessary that God’s message [of salvation through faith in Christ] be spoken to you [Jews] first. Since you repudiate it and judge yourselves unworthy of eternal life, now we turn to the Gentiles.
70 weeks are over.
Romans 1:16
I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation [from His wrath and punishment] to everyone who believes [in Christ as Savior], to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
The Light
Well-Known Member
Great. It is a fulfillment of prophecy. But it is not a fulfillment of Daniel 9:25.
First off you do not have the right starting date of Daniel 9:25
Dan 9
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
Nehemiah 2
13 And I went out by night by the gate of the valley, even before the dragon well, and to the dung port, and viewed the walls of Jerusalem, which were broken down, and the gates thereof were consumed with fire.
14 Then I went on to the gate of the fountain, and to the king's pool: but there was no place for the beast that was under me to pass.
15 Then went I up in the night by the brook, and viewed the wall, and turned back, and entered by the gate of the valley, and so returned.
16 And the rulers knew not whither I went, or what I did; neither had I as yet told it to the Jews, nor to the priests, nor to the nobles, nor to the rulers, nor to the rest that did the work.
17 Then said I unto them, Ye see the distress that we are in, how Jerusalem lieth waste, and the gates thereof are burned with fire: come, and let us build up the wall of Jerusalem, that we be no more a reproach.
The rebuilding of Jerusalem was decreed on March 5, 444 BC. This is the beginning date of Daniel 9:25. Any other date is incorrect. That's the facts.
Neh 2
20 Then answered I them, and said unto them, The God of heaven, he will prosper us; therefore we his servants will arise and build: but ye have no portion, nor right, nor memorial, in Jerusalem.
Exactly as the Word proclaims.
Exactly. And yet the Messiah arrives on a donkey just as prophesied.
Zechariah 9
9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.
This 3.5 year number is a complete fabrication. Why don't you do a little research and find out how long Jesus ministry was?
And what of the beginning of sorrows and the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse?
There is no verse in Revelation showing a 70th week. We can certainly see that there is a 70th week as 70 weeks are determined on the people of Daniel. We can also go from the decree date to rebuild Jerusalem of March 5, 444 BC and to the end of the 69th week of March 27th 33 AD and realize that Messiah is cut off days later so this mystery 3.5 years are invalid as there is no way of arriving at the proper dates.
The Light
Well-Known Member
No, I'm not. And yet you are forgetting the 70 weeks are determined upon the people of Daniel to bring in everlasting righteousness.
Revelation 11
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
You seem to think that because Jesus said, "It is finished", that's the end of the story. Jesus comes first as a suffering servant. And when He comes again, it is then that everlasting righteous will be brought in.
You need to get "the rest of the story".
Why tell half the story? Jesus was sent to the Jews.
Matthew 15
24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
The Jews reject Jesus.
Mark 12
10 And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:
Then Messiah is cut off after 69 weeks.
The 70 weeks determined for the people of Daniel are NOT over. Only 69 weeks are complete. The Jews rejected Jesus as they have been blinded to the truth of the Messiah. When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, part of Israel will have its blindness removed.
Romans 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
We see clearly in the Word of God that the Jews were to be the first harvest, but they served other Gods. The Jews will not be the first harvest. Then Gentiles will be the first harvest. And when that happens, when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, part of Israel will see.
Romans 11
10 Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.
11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
The Jews will realize when the rapture of the Church happens that they are not saved. Blindness will be removed from part of Israel, and they will understand.
Jeremiah 8
20 The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved.
70 weeks are determined on the people of Daniel. There is NO POSSIBLE WAY that you can show any legitimate evidence that the 70 weeks are over.
So how do you figure that the 70 weeks are over? What is your evidence?
jeffweeder
Well-Known Member
So you agree that Jesus has made atonement once and for all?
Do You agree Jesus has entered the most Holy place having achieved Eternal redemption through his own blood?
How many weeks did God decree for these things to happen?
If even one of those 6points is seen to be fulfilled, then they all have in the allotted number of the decreed 70 weeks.
[ The Light] You seem to think that because Jesus said, "It is finished", that's the end of the story. Jesus comes first as a suffering servant. And when He comes again, it is then that everlasting righteous will be brought in.]
What was finished then? In Jesus we have his righteousness forever. No other way to possess everlasting righteousness. Its a finished work.
[ The Light] 70 weeks are determined on the people of Daniel. There is NO POSSIBLE WAY that you can show any legitimate evidence that the 70 weeks are over.
So how do you figure that the 70 weeks are over? What is your evidence?]
Jesus Accomplished the work he was sent to do and when comes a second time it won't be to deal with sin again. He is already victorious in saving all who will believe.
Heb 9
11 But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things to come, He entered through the greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this creation; 12 and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.
13 For if the blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkling those who have been defiled sanctify for the cleansing of the flesh, 14 how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
15 For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.
but now once at the consummation of the ages He has been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. 27 And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment, 28 so Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time for salvation without reference to sin, to those who eagerly await Him.
Is 53
Who has believed [confidently trusted in, relied on, and adhered to] our message [of salvation]?
And to whom [if not us] has the arm and infinite power of the Lord been revealed?
2
For He [the Servant of God] grew up before Him like a tender shoot (plant),
And like a root out of dry ground;
He has no stately form or majestic splendor
That we would look at Him,
Nor [handsome] appearance that we would be attracted to Him.
3
He was despised and rejected by men,
A Man of sorrows and pain and acquainted with grief;
And like One from whom men hide their faces
He was despised, and we did not appreciate His worth or esteem Him.
4
But [in fact] He has borne our griefs,
And He has carried our sorrows and pains;
Yet we [ignorantly] assumed that He was stricken,
Struck down by God and degraded and humiliated [by Him].
5
But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was crushed for our wickedness [our sin, our injustice, our wrongdoing];
The punishment [required] for our well-being fell on Him,
And by His stripes (wounds) we are healed.
6
All of us like sheep have gone astray,
We have turned, each one, to his own way;
But the Lord has caused the wickedness of us all [our sin, our injustice, our wrongdoing]
To fall on Him [instead of us].
7
He was oppressed and He was afflicted,
Yet He did not open His mouth [to complain or defend Himself];
Like a lamb that is led to the slaughter,
And like a sheep that is silent before her shearers,
So He did not open His mouth.
8
After oppression and judgment He was taken away;
And as for His generation [His contemporaries], who [among them] concerned himself with the fact
That He was cut off from the land of the living [by His death]
For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke [of death] was due?
9
His grave was assigned with the wicked,
But He was with a rich man in His death,
Because He had done no violence,
Nor was there any deceit in His mouth.
10
Yet the Lord was willing
To crush Him, causing Him to suffer;
If He would give Himself as a guilt offering [an atonement for sin],
He shall see His [spiritual] offspring,
He shall prolong His days,
And the will (good pleasure) of the Lord shall succeed and prosper in His hand.
11
As a result of the anguish of His soul,
He shall see it and be satisfied;
By His knowledge [of what He has accomplished] the Righteous One,
My Servant, shall justify the many [making them righteous—upright before God, in right standing with Him],
For He shall bear [the responsibility for] their sins.
12
Therefore, I will divide and give Him a portion with the great [kings and rulers],
And He shall divide the spoils with the mighty,
Because He [willingly] poured out His life to death,
And was counted among the transgressors;
Yet He Himself bore and took away the sin of many,
And interceded [with the Father] for the transgressors.
The Light
Well-Known Member
I think you are missing the obvious. Jesus is cut off after 69 weeks. The 70th week is yet to come.
Exactly. Now we're getting somewhere. Jesus is already victorious in saving all who believe. Agreed. Are there more that will believe tomorrow? Sure. And the next day will there be more that believe. Yes. So, there is more to come. When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, God will turn His attention to His Chosen as part of them will have their blindness removed. Yep. Pre 70th week rapture.
It looks like you could use a little help with your quotes. Just copy what you see between the brackets to open the quote and then close the quote. So if I was quoting you I would do this
QUOTE="jeffweeder, post: 1422984, member: 380"] THE SENTENCES OR PARAGRAPHS I WANT TO QUOTE [/QUOTE]
QUOTE="jeffweeder, post: 1422984, member: 380"] THE SECOND SENTENCES OR PARAGRAPHS I WANT TO QUOTE [/QUOTE]
To make it work I need an open bracket [ right before the word QUOTE in both examples. Now, I'll put the bracket in front of both examples.
Then I respond to the quote.
Second response to second quote.
When you are quoting me you will see my name and post number and member number between the brackets and then you need to close the quote with this [/QUOTE]
Hope that helps.
jeffweeder
Well-Known Member
You continue to avoid the obvious.
The whole 70week discourse is about the coming of the anointed one to bring atonement in 70 weeks AFTER 7 and 62 weeks have elapsed.
His forerunner would prepare his way that he be recognized for all Israel to see.... something you clearly reject in favor of a donkey.
It was at that point that he became the anointed one to take away the sins of the world , and was cut off at the end of his ministry accomplishing all the work the Father gave him to do regarding the full atonement for sin, and forgiveness of sins through repentance.
Our invitation to approach the very throne room of God through the veil speaks of a completed work regarding atonement for sin, transgression, iniquity, and having a cloak of everlasting righteousness to stand firm in his presence.
The Light
Well-Known Member
You can't make that work. Jesus comes as Messiah at the end of the 69th week. Then He is cut off. There is still a week to go. God is not thru with His Chosen. After the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, blindness will be removed from part of Israel.
I am avoiding nothing. The FACTS are that the decree to rebuild Jerusalem was given on March 5, 444 BC. There is no other decree to rebuild Jerusalem. Anyone that says differently is lying to themselves because facts are facts. There is a reason we are given the prophecy. Jesus entered Jerusalem as Messiah on March 27th, 33 AD. He died a few days later.
You can present nothing that can alter the facts. How can one understand scripture when they avoid provable facts.
jeffweeder
Well-Known Member
You are avoiding the truth. Scripture makes this work.
Jesus cannot possibly be cut off before he arrives as the anointed Messiah after 7 and 62 weeks.
25 So you are to know and understand that from the issuance of the command to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until [the coming of] the Messiah (the Anointed One), the Prince, there will be seven weeks [of years] and sixty-two weeks [of years]; it will be built again, with [a city] plaza and moat, even in times of trouble.
69 weeks pass before Messiah can actually arrive.
God told you by sending John the Baptist as the forerunner to announce the arrival of Messiah.. You continue to ignore this very important detail that was designed to prepare and pave the way for the people to recognize Messiah's arrival. You erroneously attribute a donkey to this at the end of our Lords ANOINTED ministry .
Makes no sense at all.
The disciples clearly recognized Jesus as the Messiah at the start of his ministry after his Baptism (Anointing)
Jn 1
29 The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, “Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world! 30 This is He on behalf of whom I said, ‘After me comes a Man who has a higher rank than I and has priority over me, for He existed before me.’
31 I did not recognize Him [as the Messiah]; but I came baptizing in water so that He would be [publicly] revealed to Israel.” 32 John gave [further] evidence [testifying officially for the record, with validity and relevance], saying, “I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and He remained upon Him. 33 I did not recognize Him [as the Messiah], but He who sent me to baptize in water said to me, ‘He upon whom you see the Spirit descend and remain, this One is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’ 34 I myself have [actually] seen [that happen], and my testimony is that this is the Son of God!”
Jesus’ Public Ministry, First Converts
35 Again the next day John was standing with two of his disciples, 36 and he looked at Jesus as He walked along, and said, “Look! The Lamb of God!” 37 The two disciples heard him say this, and they followed Jesus. 38 And Jesus turned and saw them following Him, and asked them, “What do you want?” They answered Him, “Rabbi (which translated means Teacher), where are You staying?” 39 He said to them, “Come, and you will see.” So they went [with Him] and saw where He was staying; and they stayed with Him that day, for it was about the tenth hour. 40 One of the two who heard what John said and [as a result] followed Jesus was Andrew, Simon Peter’s brother. 41 He first looked for and found his own brother Simon and told him, “We have found the Messiah” (which translated means the Christ).
Similar threads
