Who can give an answer?

[face2face]

I ask again....Do you know why Elijah & Moses were chosen of all the OT faithful to encourage Jesus before his crucifixion? Mark 9

This question and its answer is precisely why this below thread is essential for the Christian to learn and follow.

I will send my messenger

Give it a go...I'll be very surprised if a correct answer can be gleaned - one thing is for sure the JW cannot answer it!

 

[Jack]

I ask again....Do you know why Elijah & Moses were chosen of all the OT faithful to encourage Jesus before his crucifixion? Mark 9

This question and its answer is precisely why this below thread is essential for the Christian to learn and follow.

I will send my messenger

Give it a go...I'll be very surprised if a correct answer can be gleaned - one thing is for sure the JW cannot answer it!

JW's have to get permission from Kingdom Hall.

 

[face2face]

JW's have to get permission from Kingdom Hall.

No that's not the reason though its possible.
They cannot answer this question or know its answer because of their teaching. Once you form a wrong doctrine it prohibits you from finding a right answer. For instance, the JW might say - there is no reason why God choose Moses and Elijah it was merely random and without meaning. Or they might come up with some other reason; whatever the case - Biblical truth is alluded from them because they hold a position of error. As we might see it was 100% critical for Moses and Elijah to be there for very sound reasons. As I said I doubt many here will know the answer - but I have been surprised before! There are some real thinkers in this forum.
Are you one of them?

 

[Enoch111]

Do you know why Elijah & Moses were chosen of all the OT faithful to encourage Jesus before his crucifixion?

Because these two will be the same two prophets who will preach during the reign of the Antichrist for 1260 days (Revelation 11). But he will have them killed, thinking that he got rid of two nuisances. But they will be resurrected and raptured to Heaven.

 

[face2face]

Because these two will be the same two prophets who will preach during the reign of the Antichrist for 1260 days (Revelation 11). But he will have them killed, thinking that he got rid of two nuisances. But they will be resurrected and raptured to Heaven.

Enoch the question relates to the type of encouragement Christ received in the mount and the work he is about to do - i.e. offer himself on the cross. Here's a tip.

What does Moses, Elijah and Jesus have in common?

And no Elijah & Moses are not the two witnesses of Revelation 11, so lets not get side tracked there.

You will recall Jesus was in great distress praying by the side of the road and he said this to his disciples:

Mark 8:27 Then Jesus and his disciples went to the villages of Caesarea Philippi. On the way he asked his disciples••, “Who do people say that I am?”

It was clear the cross was looming heavily on him and he could see his ministry was not turning hearts toward God (as he hoped) and his need for encouragement was at its greatest this far, so God gave him a future vision of the Kingdom on Earth and also two men to encourage him.

So the question relates to what these two men could offer Christ on that mount by way of encouragement to go on to Calvary?

Keep in mind ONLY these two men could provide this type of encouragement!

Big clue!

 

[Enoch111]

So the question relates to what these two men could offer Christ on that mount by way of encouragement to go on to Calvary?

Since the Greek text says that they spoke of His "exodus" (incorrectly translated as "decease") it would mean that they spoke of the resurrection and ascension of Christ. οἳ ὀφθέντες ἐν δόξῃ ἔλεγον τὴν ἔξοδον* αὐτοῦ ἣν ἔμελλεν πληροῦν ἐν Ἰερουσαλήμ (Luke 9:31)

*Strong's Concordance
exodos: a departure
Original Word: ἔξοδος, ου, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: exodos
Phonetic Spelling: (ex'-od-os)
Definition: a departure
Usage: (a) an exit, going out, departure from a place; the exodus, (b) death.

The death of Christ was definitely not His "departure". He was temporarily in Hades for three days and three nights, after which He rose again. Then after 40 days He ascended to Heaven (from just outside Jerusalem) and sat down at the right hand of God. Which meant that the crucifixion would not be the end of the story. So that would have been the encouragement to Christ.

 

[lightlysalted]

Moses represents the Law and Elijah represents the Prophets.

Mar 9:2 And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
Mar 9:3 And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
Mar 9:4 And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.

Mar 9:9 And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
Mar 9:10 And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.

Luk 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

They encouraged Him to go the mile.
Hugs
ziggy

 

[farouk]

Moses represents the Law and Elijah represents the Prophets.

Mar 9:2 And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
Mar 9:3 And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
Mar 9:4 And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.

Mar 9:9 And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
Mar 9:10 And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.

Luk 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

They encouraged Him to go the mile.
Hugs
ziggy

Ziggy: Interesting also that Romans 3.21 speaks of witness by the law and the prophets........

 

[face2face]

Since the Greek text says that they spoke of His "exodus" (incorrectly translated as "decease") it would mean that they spoke of the resurrection and ascension of Christ. οἳ ὀφθέντες ἐν δόξῃ ἔλεγον τὴν ἔξοδον* αὐτοῦ ἣν ἔμελλεν πληροῦν ἐν Ἰερουσαλήμ (Luke 9:31)

*Strong's Concordance
exodos: a departure
Original Word: ἔξοδος, ου, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: exodos
Phonetic Spelling: (ex'-od-os)
Definition: a departure
Usage: (a) an exit, going out, departure from a place; the exodus, (b) death.

The death of Christ was definitely not His "departure".

True!

He was temporarily in Hades for three days and three nights, after which He rose again.

True...though it was the grave nothing more or less - complete death..the cessation of life for three days.

Then after 40 days He ascended to Heaven (from just outside Jerusalem) and sat down at the right hand of God. Which meant that the crucifixion would not be the end of the story. So that would have been the encouragement to Christ.

You have opened the door to this mystery Enoch, well done!
Now you need to connect the dots!
What does Jesus' exodus (as per Ephesians 4:8) have to do with Moses and Elijah?
F2F

Note:
4:8 Therefore it says, “When he ascended on high he captured captives; he gave gifts to men.

Took captivity captive!

 

[face2face]

Moses represents the Law and Elijah represents the Prophets.
ziggy

Ziggy - you have opened the door as well...still need to connect the dots.
What did Moses, Elijah & Jesus have in common!

 

[lightlysalted]

Ziggy: Interesting also that Romans 3.21 speaks of witness by the law and the prophets........

Yes but this is written after the resurrection. Jesus still needed to fulfill all that was written in them during the transfiguration.
So I believe that Moses and Elijah came to give Him their support.
Days of Lawlessness are upon us.
History repeats itself.
They will try to destroy Judaism and Christianity. The Law and the Prophets.
We may not (as Christians) be required to live under the law, however in a world of lawlessness, things will only turn to chaos.
The world today is not living by faith. And only through faith is one freed from the law.
The world is still living under the law. And the law must be established for those who walk not by faith.

Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

There are two classes of people. Those that believe in Jesus Christ and those that do not.
Those that believe and have faith are no longer under the condemnation of the law.
Those that do not will be judged by it.

Until every soul has been converted to Christ, the law remains.
If this were not true then congress would be out of business of making more laws.

Hugs

 

[lightlysalted]

Ziggy - you have opened the door as well...still need to connect the dots.
What did Moses, Elijah & Jesus have in common!

The first thing that comes to mind is, their bodies were never found.
hugs

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

I ask again....Do you know why Elijah & Moses were chosen of all the OT faithful to encourage Jesus before his crucifixion? Mark 9

This question and its answer is precisely why this below thread is essential for the Christian to learn and follow.

I will send my messenger

Give it a go...I'll be very surprised if a correct answer can be gleaned - one thing is for sure the JW cannot answer it!

Elijah and Moses, the prophets and the law.
Which is why it is wrong to think Jesus put an end to the law. This chapter in scripture reminds us the heart of the law was substitution and atonement.

It's also why the blood of Jesus covers our sins eternally.

And why those Jews who called for Rome to kill Jesus after his illegal trial by the Sanhedrin cursed themselves and their children afterward saying, let his [Jesus] blood be upon our head and those of our children.

This is a short read but I think it may be deeply helpful in this area.

L24-8: 'HIS BLOOD SHALL BE UPON HIS OWN HEAD' does not mean what we think it means - WELCOME TO THE MESSIANIC REVOLUTION

 

[face2face]

The first thing that comes to mind is, their bodies were never found.
hugs

True, of Moses it is written:

He (God) buried him in Moab, in the valley opposite Beth Peor, but to this day no one knows where his grave is.

Be true of Elijah also.

But it's not so much in their death but in their purpose which they share a commonality.

Cheers
F2F

 

[face2face]

Elijah and Moses, the prophets and the law.
Which is why it is wrong to think Jesus put an end to the law. This chapter in scripture reminds us the heart of the law was substitution and atonement.

Not substitution, otherwise you make God a debtor and all must be saved!
Jesus "represented" mankind and revealed how a person must saved as per Galatians 5:24
F2F

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Not substitution, otherwise you make God a debtor and all must be saved!
Jesus "represented" mankind and revealed how a person must saved as per Galatians 5:24
F2F

Substitution is what occurred when Jesus,the propitiation for our sins, substituted himself, the last unblemished sacrificial lamb,on the last altar for the sins of the world/.

 

[Grailhunter]

I ask again....Do you know why Elijah & Moses were chosen of all the OT faithful to encourage Jesus before his crucifixion? Mark 9

This question and its answer is precisely why this below thread is essential for the Christian to learn and follow.

I will send my messenger

Give it a go...I'll be very surprised if a correct answer can be gleaned - one thing is for sure the JW cannot answer it!

Did Elijah & Moses encourage Yeshua during the Transfiguration? Do we know what was said? No...But if I remember correctly the Jehovah's Witnesses have weaved quite the tradition and meaning from this event.

What does medium'ing with the dead mean? Long story and a misunderstanding about "the dead". Yeshua did not "wake" them up. And why was it Elijah & Moses.....Two of the most well known figures in the Hebrew Bible. Moses was God's first and primary messenger and administrator of the Yahwehists. Elijah in Jewish tradition was the senior prophet, even senior to the prophesized Messiah which was to be a human military king that would dispose the Jewish oppressors and setup a kingdom that would last forever and teach the world to follow the 613 Mosaic Laws and have children.....so he would be married.

Things changed....the Messiah would need to be a God to take on Satan. And of course the Bible does not indicate that Yeshua was married or had children.

The purpose of the Old Testament Messiah was to save the Jewish people from their oppressors.....the terrible day of the Lord.... Yeshua's ministry was to save their souls from Hell and confront Satan and take on sin. The Jews did not believe in a devil or a hell, and still do not even today.

So the Jehovah's witnesses beliefs are more Jewish than Christian....believing that the Messiah was just a man and they do not believe in a Hell. Hence the name of their religion.

 

[face2face]

Did Elijah & Moses encourage Yeshua during the Transfiguration? Do we know what was said? No...But if I remember correctly the Jehovah's Witnesses have weaved quite the tradition and meaning from this event.

I would be interested to know how they twist that event.

Correct, we don't know what was said and their is good reason for that! They themsleves are the reason for the encouragement which the Lord received. Knowing who they are and what they represent is the mystery told. It's about unlocking the Word.

What does medium'ing with the dead mean? Long story and a misunderstanding about "the dead". Yeshua did not "wake" them up. And why was it Elijah & Moses.....Two of the most well known figures in the Hebrew Bible. Moses was God's first and primary messenger and administrator of the Yahwehists. Elijah in Jewish tradition was the senior prophet, even senior to the prophesized Messiah which was to be a human military king that would dispose the Jewish oppressors and setup a kingdom that would last forever and teach the world to follow the 613 Mosaic Laws and have children.....so he would be married.

Enoch has come the closest in opening the way to understanding Moses, Elijah & The Lord Jesus Christ. From God's perspective and given the context of the situation before the Master, he required men who were tasked with significant responsibilities and in many ways type the life of the Lord in ways only they can.

The thread is rather new, so I will hold off till more have a crack at the riddle.

Thanks for your response

F2F

Post #6 is certainly a key - btw it does inform us of their discussion.

 

[face2face]

Not substitution, otherwise you make God a debtor and all must be saved!
Jesus "represented" mankind and revealed how a person must saved as per Galatians 5:24
F2F

If you @Blue Dragonfly's want to start a new thread I can discuss this with you.
F2F

 

[PinSeeker]

I ask again....Do you know why Elijah & Moses were chosen of all the OT faithful to encourage Jesus before his crucifixion?

Well, this issue really their appearance at Christ's transfiguration. The transfiguration confirms Jesus’ appointment as a special messenger of God ~ like Moses and Elijah who received revelation from God on Mount Sinai, also called Mount Horeb (Exodus 19–24; 1 Kings 19), Jesus likewise meets with God on a mountain. Yet Jesus is greater than these because the Father’s declarations about Him make Him the object of revelation (Matthew 17:5), rather than merely the recipient of it. Also, Moses and Elijah represent the Law and the Prophets, respectively. Their appearance with Christ confirms His fulfillment of the old covenant revelation found in the Old Testament.

Grace and peace to you.