1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Only unintentional sins from immature fruit of the Spirit which we will grow out of. But our born again nature will live up to the light we have until we receive more and advance in our maturity. Philippians 3:16
The Popular False Justification and False Sanctification View Today.
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Only unintentional sins from immature fruit of the Spirit which we will grow out of. But our born again nature will live up to the light we have until we receive more and advance in our maturity. Philippians 3:16
James is saying that faith accompanied by works "proves" your salvation.
Paul is saying, and has said numerous times that works has nothing to do with salvation.
You can carry on with your misunderstanding of James if you like, but you will have to part ways with Paul if you do!
This is where we disagree. Unintentional sin will not be forgiven. Believers must root out all sins that the Bible talks about that is tied with hellfire or condemnation. This would be murder, theft, hate, etcetera. There is no clause of exception of forgiveness for murder or rape if you do so unintentionally. That would also be a license for immorality that is no different than Protestantism that justifies sin and evil.
The same word “justified” is used for both faith and works in James 2:24. Are you saying there is a faith that does not save or justify?
Anyways, the real problem I have with your belief is that it is no different than Satanism. You can live like the devil (1 John 3:8), and also enter the Kingdom. This is wrong. You also cannot truly support that which is moral and good by what you believe, either. There is no consistent standard of morality in your belief. Sin and evil is regulated to mistakes or boo boos (like accidentally dropping a glass of milk).
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1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Reason this out. How can anyone commit murder or rape unintentionally? What I'm talking about is lack of knowledge altogether. Murder, rape and other sins of lawlessness are sins unto death. Unintentional sins unknowingly committed are sins NOT unto death.
Care to give an example of some unintentional sins?
Note: Some could say that they did not set out to lie today, but they lied when they were forced into a situation where they might lose their family member or their job. Yet, Revelation 21:8 says all liars will have their part in the Lake of Fire. There is no clause of exception on another group of liars who were okay because they did not set out to lie that day.
Some may not set out to lust that day, but they lusted after seeing a person that was not dressed appropriately. Jesus said that to look upon a woman in lust is to be cast bodily into hell fire. Jesus did not give us a clause of exception on this point saying it was okay if we do so unintentionally (not setting out to do that sin that day).
Bob Carabbio
Well-Known Member
Translation: "Salvation is BY WORKS, and NOT by faith in the perfect SIN offering of Jesus at Calvary. Standard heretical pronouncement.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
You don't have to overcome sins that lead to death. You can't. That desire is the first thing that Jesus takes away out of our nature when we first come to Him. It is all His doing, not anything you have to "overcome"! That's ridiculous to think the old sin nature can overcome sins unto death. We cannot make ourselves born again! Our new nature is the only nature that can overcome sin, but they are sins not unto death, but just plain old immature fruit. Do this to overcome those sins. Do you recognize the fruit of the Spirit?:
But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
cc: @Bob Carabbio
Bob, This is what is meant by not by works. That doesn't mean that we don't do anything. 1 John 5:18 tells us that when we are born again we cannot sin (those sins unto death that Jesus has taken away), but we must "keep ourselves." Think on that. We must keep growing...and never grow stagnant in our walk in the Spirit.
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@Ferris Bueller
I still look for Sarah Jessica Parker when I see Matthew's face..........(((((((((((Hugs)))))))))
And
SMILES!
I still look for Sarah Jessica Parker when I see Matthew's face..........(((((((((((Hugs)))))))))
And
SMILES!
Carry on with your works supporting your salvation instead of proving your salvation, making Paul a liar.
As long as you've been on these boards you should know better BH!
Care to give an example of some unintentional sins?
Note: Some could say that they did not set out to lie today, but they lied when they were forced into a situation where they might lose their family member or their job. Yet, Revelation 21:8 says all liars will have their part in the Lake of Fire. There is no clause of exception on another group of liars who were okay because they did not set out to lie that day.
Some may not set out to lust that day, but they lusted after seeing a person that was not dressed appropriately. Jesus said that to look upon a woman in lust is to be cast bodily into hell fire. Jesus did not give us a clause of exception on this point saying it was okay if we do so unintentionally (not setting out to do that sin that day).
This is the problem I have with your belief.
The opposite can be said of your belief. Carry on with your sin and still be saved type belief. Try being fruitless like the Revelation 3 churches and see where that gets you. I know it will not help you. Just read Revelation 3. Does not sound like works are not necessary as a part of salvation (After we are saved by God’s grace). Of course you have to twist Scripture to your own destruction.
Not at all. Salvation is initially and foundationally by God’s grace through faith without works (Ephesians 2:8-9), and then one enters the secondary aspect of salvation called Sanctification of the Spirit to live a holy life (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13). That’s salvation. The Protestant understanding on sin and salvation is the one that is heretical and purely imaginary. Many of the insane statements that they make are NOT found in the Bible.
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1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Believing a false doctrine and acting on it innocently, even preaching that if others don't believe it they are damned.
Are you aware that false doctrine can be a salvation issue?
For example:
2 Timothy 2:17-18 says:
“And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.”
What was it Paul said, something like, "not of works, lest any man should boast?"
Are these posts of yours showing us your boasting of how you have taken part in your own salvation?
So I guess Paul is also lying when he says "it's a free gift" but I see you are maintaining your own salvation.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Paul mentioned this because of the problem of Circumcision Salvationism that was invading the church.
In Acts of the Apostles 15:1 it says that that there were certain men (Jews) who were trying to deceive Gentile Christians that they had to first be circumcised in order to be initially saved. See also Acts of the Apostles 15:5, and Acts of the Apostles 15:24.
Paul also said that if you seek to be circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. Why? Because if one thought they had to be first circumcised to be saved, then they would be making a WORK or the LAW the entrance gate or foundation of their salvation (INSTEAD of being saved by God’s grace and mercy in their Initial Salvation - which is a process of salvation without the deeds of the law because a person is seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ by way of prayer, and they are believing the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 for salvation). So the Circumcised Salvationist will boast in their work of being saved. They will point back to their circumcision. They will boast in their circumcision. Paul is not talking about how no works are necessary after we are saved by God’s grace without works. In verse 10: Paul says that we are created unto Christ Jesus for good works. In Titus 1:16, Paul says one can deny God by being reprobate unto every good work.
You said:
All the good works a believer does is God doing the good work through them. But we have to abide in the love of God and love our brother. Everything hinges on love if we want to overcome sin in this life.
You said:
Work out your salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12).
Fight the good fight of faith and lay hold on eternal life (1 Timothy 6:12).
We cannot pick and choose which verses in the Bible we want to believe in.
We must believe the whole counsel of God’s Word.
Looks to me like a whole lot of reasoning and supposing! Better get it together BH!
Rom. 11:5-6
"Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."
When you add works to Grace, Grace is no longer Grace!
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