Run AWAY from Calvinism!

[Lifelong_sinner]

Show me in 1 John of "regeneration before faith.


1Jn 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;
1Jn 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;)
1Jn 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.
1Jn 1:4 And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
Walking in the Light
1Jn 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Please bro, show me.
J.

i had explained this in another topic earlier tonite, so here it is again;

1 john is full of explaining this, texts from 1 John demonstrate that regeneration precedes faith. The texts are as follows:
“If you know that he is righteous, you may be sure that everyone who practices righteousness has been born of him” (1 John 2:29). “No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God” (1 John 3:9). “Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God” (1 John 4:7). “Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves whomever has been born of him” (1 John 5:1).
no christian would say that before we are born again we must practice righteousness, for such a view would teach works-righteousness. Nor would we say that first we avoid sinning, and then are born of God, for such a view would suggest that human works cause us to be born of God. Nor would we say that first we show great love for God, and then he causes us to be born again. No, it is clear that practicing righteousness, avoiding sin, and loving are all the consequences or results of the new birth. But if this is the case, then we must interpret 1 John 5:1 in the same way, for the structure of the verse is the same as we find in the texts about practicing righteousness (1 John 2:29), avoiding sin (1 John 3:9), and loving God (1 John 4:7). It follows, then, that 1 John 5:1teaches that first God grants us new life and then we believe Jesus is the Christ.

 

[Johann]

what did he add exactly??

I can show you, but that would be a waste of my time since you will "dismiss" it.
Make a study in "will" "choose"...There are brothers and sisters here who have shown you the error of your ways yet you are persistent...
J.

 

[Johann]

It follows, then, that 1 John 5:1teaches that first God grants us new life and then we believe Jesus is the Christ.

Do you believe that Jesus is the Christ?
J.

 

[Johann]

I can show you, but that would be a waste of my time since you will "dismiss" it.
Make a study in "will" "choose"...There are brothers and sisters here who have shown you the error of your ways yet you are persistent...
J.

INVITATIONS-WARNINGS
(A) THE "COMES" OF GOD'S WORD
Come into a place of Safety
Gen_7:1
Come to a Goodly Fellowship
Num_10:29
Come for Personal Cleansing
Isa_1:18
Come for a Satisfying Portion
Isa_55:1
Come for Rest of Soul
Mat_11:28
Come at the King's urgent Invitation
Mat_22:4
Come to the Gospel Feast
Luk_14:17
Come at the Three-fold Call
Rev_22:17
--SEE Salvation (4), SALVATION
(B) DIVINE PLEADINGS
Pro_1:24; Isa_1:18; Isa_55:1; Eze_18:31; Mic_6:3
Mat_23:37; Rom_10:21; 2Co_5:20
--SEE Repentance (1), PENITENCE
(C) DIVINE CALL
(1) To Repentance and a Righteous Life
Jer_35:15; Eze_33:11; Hos_6:1; Mat_22:3; Luk_14:17; 2Co_5:20
Rev_3:20
--SEE Wisdom's Call, WISDOM
Discipleship, DISCIPLESHIP
Repentance (1), PENITENCE
(2) Call to Leadership, examples of
Abraham
Gen_12:1
Moses
Exo_3:10; Exo_28:1; Exo_31:2
Gideon
Jdg_6:14
Elisha
1Ki_19:19
Isaiah
Isa_6:8; Jer_1:4; Jon_1:2; Act_13:2; Act_16:10
Paul
Act_26:16
--SEE Apostles Called, LEADERS
Chosen Instruments, LEADERS
Ministers, LEADERS
(3) Universality of
Isa_45:22; Isa_55:1; Mat_22:9; Joh_7:37; Rom_10:12; 1Ti_2:4; Rev_22:17
--SEE Whosoever (2), WHOSOEVER
Salvation (4), SALVATION
Impartiality (1), JUSTICE
(4) Refused by Men
Psa_81:11; Pro_1:24; Isa_65:12; Isa_66:4; Jer_7:13; Hos_9:17
Mat_22:3; Joh_5:40; Rom_10:21
--SEE Impenitence, IMPENITENCE
& IMPENITENCE
Spiritual Deafness, DEAFNESS
Stubbornness, SELF-WILL
& SELF-WILL
Hardness of Heart, IMPENITENCE
& IMPENITENCE
(5) To Decision
Deu_30:15; Jos_24:15; Rth_1:15; 1Ki_18:21; Mat_27:17; Mar_10:21
Luk_16:13; Joh_6:67
--SEE Choose, SPECIAL
Exhortations, EXHORTATIONS
(D) WARNINGS
(1) The Duty of Giving
2Ch_19:10; Isa_58:1; Eze_3:18; Eze_33:9; 1Th_5:14
--SEE Reproof, REPROOF
Admonition, REPROOF
(2) Examples of
Gen_19:17; Deu_29:20; Jos_24:20; 1Sa_12:15; Isa_28:14; Jer_13:16
Jon_3:4; Heb_12:25; 2Pe_3:17
--SEE Take Heed, WARNINGS
Death (9), DEATH
Threatenings, THREATENINGS
MISCELLANEOUS TOPICS containing warnings
(E) BE NOT DECEIVED
Mat_24:4; 1Co_6:9; 1Co_15:33; Gal_6:7; Eph_5:6; 2Th_2:3; 1Jo_3:7
(F) BEWARE of Evil
Deu_6:12; Luk_12:1; Luk_12:15; Act_13:40; Phi_3:2; Col_2:8; 2Pe_3:17
(G) SHUN EVIL
Job_28:28; Psa_34:14; Psa_97:10; Pro_4:27; Pro_14:16; Zec_7:10
Rom_12:9; 1Co_10:6; 1Th_5:22; 1Pe_3:11
--SEE Sin Forbidden, SIN
Forsake Sin, SIN
(H) TAKE HEED to conduct
Mat_6:1; Mat_18:10; Mat_24:4; Mar_4:24; Mar_13:9; Mar_13:33; Luk_8:18; Luk_11:35; Luk_12:15
Luk_21:8; 1Co_3:10; 1Co_10:12; Col_4:17; 1Ti_4:16; 2Pe_1:19
--SEE Watchfulness, WATCHFULNESS
Keep Thyself, CONDUCT

...there is always a choice, which is not pagan or humanistic as you put it..choose life! An Imperative from our Lord for..why will you die?


Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
J.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

INVITATIONS-WARNINGS
(A) THE "COMES" OF GOD'S WORD
Come into a place of Safety
Gen_7:1
Come to a Goodly Fellowship
Num_10:29
Come for Personal Cleansing
Isa_1:18
Come for a Satisfying Portion
Isa_55:1
Come for Rest of Soul
Mat_11:28
Come at the King's urgent Invitation
Mat_22:4
Come to the Gospel Feast
Luk_14:17
Come at the Three-fold Call
Rev_22:17
--SEE Salvation (4), SALVATION
(B) DIVINE PLEADINGS
Pro_1:24; Isa_1:18; Isa_55:1; Eze_18:31; Mic_6:3
Mat_23:37; Rom_10:21; 2Co_5:20
--SEE Repentance (1), PENITENCE
(C) DIVINE CALL
(1) To Repentance and a Righteous Life
Jer_35:15; Eze_33:11; Hos_6:1; Mat_22:3; Luk_14:17; 2Co_5:20
Rev_3:20
--SEE Wisdom's Call, WISDOM
Discipleship, DISCIPLESHIP
Repentance (1), PENITENCE
(2) Call to Leadership, examples of
Abraham
Gen_12:1
Moses
Exo_3:10; Exo_28:1; Exo_31:2
Gideon
Jdg_6:14
Elisha
1Ki_19:19
Isaiah
Isa_6:8; Jer_1:4; Jon_1:2; Act_13:2; Act_16:10
Paul
Act_26:16
--SEE Apostles Called, LEADERS
Chosen Instruments, LEADERS
Ministers, LEADERS
(3) Universality of
Isa_45:22; Isa_55:1; Mat_22:9; Joh_7:37; Rom_10:12; 1Ti_2:4; Rev_22:17
--SEE Whosoever (2), WHOSOEVER
Salvation (4), SALVATION
Impartiality (1), JUSTICE
(4) Refused by Men
Psa_81:11; Pro_1:24; Isa_65:12; Isa_66:4; Jer_7:13; Hos_9:17
Mat_22:3; Joh_5:40; Rom_10:21
--SEE Impenitence, IMPENITENCE
& IMPENITENCE
Spiritual Deafness, DEAFNESS
Stubbornness, SELF-WILL
& SELF-WILL
Hardness of Heart, IMPENITENCE
& IMPENITENCE
(5) To Decision
Deu_30:15; Jos_24:15; Rth_1:15; 1Ki_18:21; Mat_27:17; Mar_10:21
Luk_16:13; Joh_6:67
--SEE Choose, SPECIAL
Exhortations, EXHORTATIONS
(D) WARNINGS
(1) The Duty of Giving
2Ch_19:10; Isa_58:1; Eze_3:18; Eze_33:9; 1Th_5:14
--SEE Reproof, REPROOF
Admonition, REPROOF
(2) Examples of
Gen_19:17; Deu_29:20; Jos_24:20; 1Sa_12:15; Isa_28:14; Jer_13:16
Jon_3:4; Heb_12:25; 2Pe_3:17
--SEE Take Heed, WARNINGS
Death (9), DEATH
Threatenings, THREATENINGS
MISCELLANEOUS TOPICS containing warnings
(E) BE NOT DECEIVED
Mat_24:4; 1Co_6:9; 1Co_15:33; Gal_6:7; Eph_5:6; 2Th_2:3; 1Jo_3:7
(F) BEWARE of Evil
Deu_6:12; Luk_12:1; Luk_12:15; Act_13:40; Phi_3:2; Col_2:8; 2Pe_3:17
(G) SHUN EVIL
Job_28:28; Psa_34:14; Psa_97:10; Pro_4:27; Pro_14:16; Zec_7:10
Rom_12:9; 1Co_10:6; 1Th_5:22; 1Pe_3:11
--SEE Sin Forbidden, SIN
Forsake Sin, SIN
(H) TAKE HEED to conduct
Mat_6:1; Mat_18:10; Mat_24:4; Mar_4:24; Mar_13:9; Mar_13:33; Luk_8:18; Luk_11:35; Luk_12:15
Luk_21:8; 1Co_3:10; 1Co_10:12; Col_4:17; 1Ti_4:16; 2Pe_1:19
--SEE Watchfulness, WATCHFULNESS
Keep Thyself, CONDUCT

...there is always a choice, which is not pagan or humanistic as you put it..choose life! An Imperative from our Lord for..why will you die?


Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
J.

dude, i’ve grown tired of your arguing. You aint gonna change my mind, and im not here to change yours. So on ignore you go.

 

[Johann]

So on ignore you go.

To your peril...
J.

 

[Brakelite]

dude, i’ve grown tired of your arguing. You aint gonna change my mind, and im not here to change yours. So on ignore you go.

Interesting. You've taken on the character of the god you believe in. One who devised a method of salvation whereby He doesn't listen to anyone who wants it, needs it, or seeks it, but only to himself and his own wants, needs, desires. One that completely negates the many teachings, thoughts, and Spirit in which Jesus taught his parables... Such as...
KJV Luke 11:5-13
5 And he said unto them, Which of you shall have a friend, and shall go unto him at midnight, and say unto him, Friend, lend me three loaves;
6 For a friend of mine in his journey is come to me, and I have nothing to set before him?
7 And he from within shall answer and say, Trouble me not: the door is now shut, and my children are with me in bed; I cannot rise and give thee.
8 I say unto you, Though he will not rise and give him, because he is his friend, yet because of his importunity he will rise and give him as many as he needeth.
9 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
10 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
11 If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent?
12 Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?
13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

And yet all the apostles had faith before their new births with the Spirit.

which has been ignored twice because glassyeyed indoctrination can’t see it.

Not ignored, but confused that you dont understand how the Holy Spirit worked before Jesus’ death.

john 7:37-39
John 14:12

bottom line? It is extremely important to notice that Psalm 51:11 reveals King David pleaded that the Holy Spirit not be taken from him after he had sinned in having sexual relations with Bathsheba. Consequently, we must understand that the Holy Spirit did not permanently dwell in the Old Testament individuals.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

Interesting. You've taken on the character of the god you believe in. One who devised a method of salvation whereby He doesn't listen to anyone who wants it, needs it, or seeks it, but only to himself and his own wants, needs, desires. One that completely negates the many teachings, thoughts, and Spirit in which Jesus taught his parables.

Wait…… what?????
you seem to think that those saved, chose to be saved themselves. Is that what you’re saying? Thats not how salvation works. At all.

 

[Brakelite]

Wait…… what?????
you seem to think that those saved, chose to be saved themselves. Is that what you’re saying? Thats not how salvation works. At all.

If you say so.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

If you say so.

it wasnt me that said it, Jesus said it. John 6:44

 

[Johann]

Is that what you’re saying? Thats not how salvation works. At all.

Thats not what @Backlit is sayin'
J.

 

[Grailhunter]

 

[Johann]

it wasnt me that said it, Jesus said it. John 6:44

ἑλκύω / ἕλκω
helkuō / helkō
Total KJV Occurrences: 8
draw, 4
Joh_6:44, Joh_12:32, Jas_2:6 (2)
drew, 4
Joh_21:10-11 (2), Act_16:19, Act_21:30

Listen, after the resurrection of Christ Jesus our Lord all men/women/ are "drawn". yet not "all" would receive the free dorean of salvation!..for not "all" have faith..
You have put me on ignore..was it your "freewill" that decided to do that?
Lol!
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Not ignored, but confused that you dont understand how the Holy Spirit worked before Jesus’ death.

john 7:37-39
John 14:12

bottom line? It is extremely important to notice that Psalm 51:11 reveals King David pleaded that the Holy Spirit not be taken from him after he had sinned in having sexual relations with Bathsheba. Consequently, we must understand that the Holy Spirit did not permanently dwell in the Old Testament individuals.

Okay, but the other part was ignored too, and it is NOT from the OT, was that Paul asked some believers, did you receive the Holy Spirit when you first believed? And he said, no…we haven’t even heard of this Holy Spirit…so, how was it possible they believed/had faith before being born of the Spirit when you say faith absolutely cannot come first. And you yourself believe but haven’t received the new birth yet, so you ARE a case of one who believes but who hasn’t been regenerated yet, according to you.

 

[Brakelite]

it wasnt me that said it, Jesus said it. John 6:44

Uh huh. Isn't that what I said in my the post you rejected?

 

[Brakelite]

Wait…… what?????
you seem to think that those saved, chose to be saved themselves. Is that what you’re saying? Thats not how salvation works. At all.

There are many who don't know their need of salvation. They just want an escape from the bondage. Are you saying that God blocks His ears from their desperate cries for help?

 

[Brakelite]

ahhhhh yes, another pagan belief of your free will. You think your free will would ever side with God??

Does a slave ever side with the slave master?

 

[Johann]

it wasnt me that said it, Jesus said it. John 6:44

Since you have not shown love to anyone in this group especially me, why would I embrace the god of Calvinism?
By their fruit they shall be known...
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

faith is, in the case of religion, a belief in something unseen.

Once again, this then means you have faith since you believe in what you haven’t seen. So, once again, you have faith but not the new birth, so how can you still say faith cannot precede regeneration?