-- No, you said you are "rarely serious."
Which means, by you own words, that anything you say on this board should rarely be taken seriously.
I would tend to agree.
Homosexuality
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-- No, you said you are "rarely serious."
Which means, by you own words, that anything you say on this board should rarely be taken seriously.
I would tend to agree.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
-- But not for falsely presenting what you said in previous posts in the very same thread.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
good news! For the record, I know you point of view on this subject - you are not going to change my mind so you might want to move along. Unless you have a question I have not already addressed.
-- I actually do have one question. Why would a person who feels so strongly about something to the point of repeatingly sharing that stance in detail, then turn around and tell everyone on this board that they "are rarely serious?"
Seems rather self-defeating...
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
I think you are reading too much into my comment about being 'rarely serious'. All I mean is that talking about ideas is a hobby of mine - I do not consider it witnessing or teaching - I am merely trying on ideas. Now, I am completely serious about serving people in real life and witnessing the love of Christ to them as much as possible. For me, ideas and doctrine and theology help me to understand my sanctification, which is sharing the love of Christ in real life, So, while I will often push ideas to the extreme online, you will probably not see me fighting to the death (hyberbole) for an idea - people are my focus.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
In other words Aspen, once you have been highlighted by a few of us "Christian types" for your stance regarding... "gay is a sin, but we must understand it, tolerate it, bond with it, and allow it"..... you then are too weak kneed to face the music that comes singing your way and instead you just hide your dandy little self behind the well worn.........."well, im just playing the devil's advocate here, and i dont really mean it fellas....squeak."....
K
The good news is Jesus Christ is Lord, that He died once for ALL MEN no longer is he on the cross, it is finished. It is just a shame that christians have not come to that realization, for if they did, this post would not exist.
In All His Love
This topic is not about wheter homosexualtiy is a sin or not, it is about wheter Christ has forgiven them or not, and it seems to me that most Christians do not think so.
Mat_6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
Mat_6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
In all His most abundant patients and Grace
In All His Love
This topic is not about wheter homosexualtiy is a sin or not, it is about wheter Christ has forgiven them or not, and it seems to me that most Christians do not think so.
Mat_6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
Mat_6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
In all His most abundant patients and Grace
In order to receive forgivness for sin you must:
1. Acknowledge your sin
2. Ask to be forgiven for it
3. Do your very best to avoid committing that sin in the future
If a person doesn't feel they are sinning and are not seeking forgiveness, men can forgive all they want....but God doesn't.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
It is true - homosexuality is a sin. Like any other sin, if the person is unrepentant, they will face judgment.
Of course, it is not going to make a difference for nonbelievers because they will already face judgment.
Of course, it is not going to make a difference for nonbelievers because they will already face judgment.
Christ meets us where we are at. If homosexuals love God and obey His commandments - who knows what God will do? The fact is, there are much worse things a homosexual can engage in than a monogamous same-sex relationship.
One of the most awe-inspiring thing about God is that His point / teaching always goes over our heads - the Pharisees missed it (to rigid and too right), the disciples didn't get it - Peter didn't even get when he provided the right answer "You are the Messiah". God is always cutting through our dualistic minds just like He did with the Pharisees - they hit Him with right and wrong - He cut through it with Love.
So who knows? Who are we to judge? We are all guilty - and guilty for repeated - lifestyle sin. It is not about who thinks they are righteous, anyway. It is about mercy, and love.
This hypie love message is dedicated to my good buddy Foreigner......
I think I've voiced this before on this forum, but 'abomination' is only used 8 times in the entire bible, and it pertains mainly to sacrilege or desecration in the temple. We need to stop treating sins WE find personally reprehensible, as special or more heinous. In God's eyes, they are not. The homosexual acts is wrong as far as God says, in Romans 1, but the homosexual has the same rights and freedoms as ANY Christian, if he confesses Jesus and turns away from a lifestyle of sin. God saves ALL from their sins, IF they confess Jesus and ask forgiveness. No difference between fornicator and homosexual. They both have to turn away from their sinful lifestyle. We need to stop being a church full of homophobes and start being a church of people who LOVE one another. There is NO excuse in the good news for ANYONE to foster hatred and paranoia against ANY group of people, saints or sinners, believers or unbelievers. We are called to convey the love of Jesus, NOT our disdain towards our fellow man/woman.
Amen?
We have been through this topic several times here, Stan.
People like Aspen feel that if you speak out against gay marraige, you are "singling them out."
He then demands to know why you feel that sin is worse than other sin.
He has been told and shown time and again that homosexual activity in no more a sin than adultery, stealing, bearing false withness, assault, etc. etc. etc.
But people who do those sins aren't pushing for America to tell them that lifestyle is acceptable.
People who do those sins aren't trying to force schools to teach that that activity is wrong and if you disagree you should be punished.
Every single solitary homosexual I have ever ended up sharing with have been told the exact same thing.
- God loves them just as much as he loves me or any other person
- God loves them enough to die for their sins and wants them to know happiness for all eternity in heaven.
- All are sinners and all are lost if they don't turn away from the sin in their lives
- God is just as displeased with a person who is unfaithful to his wife, cheats on his taxes, steals from his neighbor
- I had sin in my life and if I had not turned away, I would not go to heaven when I die.
- God wants them to turn to Him, give their lives to Him, and allow Him to change their hearts.
No singling out. No "you are worse than others." etc. etc. etc.
Homosexuals are welcome in my church. Some have become members. Some haven't but attend regularly. Some visit for awhile and leave.
Aspen doesn't want to hear this, instead criticizing "Conservative Christians" as a whole for their treatment of homosexuals.
I have yet to know or speak with or chat here with a single Christian who says that homosexual activity is worse than any of the other sins I have mentioned.
People like Aspen feel that if you speak out against gay marraige, you are "singling them out."
He then demands to know why you feel that sin is worse than other sin.
He has been told and shown time and again that homosexual activity in no more a sin than adultery, stealing, bearing false withness, assault, etc. etc. etc.
But people who do those sins aren't pushing for America to tell them that lifestyle is acceptable.
People who do those sins aren't trying to force schools to teach that that activity is wrong and if you disagree you should be punished.
Every single solitary homosexual I have ever ended up sharing with have been told the exact same thing.
- God loves them just as much as he loves me or any other person
- God loves them enough to die for their sins and wants them to know happiness for all eternity in heaven.
- All are sinners and all are lost if they don't turn away from the sin in their lives
- God is just as displeased with a person who is unfaithful to his wife, cheats on his taxes, steals from his neighbor
- I had sin in my life and if I had not turned away, I would not go to heaven when I die.
- God wants them to turn to Him, give their lives to Him, and allow Him to change their hearts.
No singling out. No "you are worse than others." etc. etc. etc.
Homosexuals are welcome in my church. Some have become members. Some haven't but attend regularly. Some visit for awhile and leave.
Aspen doesn't want to hear this, instead criticizing "Conservative Christians" as a whole for their treatment of homosexuals.
I have yet to know or speak with or chat here with a single Christian who says that homosexual activity is worse than any of the other sins I have mentioned.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
I think Aspen needs to speak for himself on this topic.
I believe that homosexuality is a sin
I believe that some conservative Christians criticize homosexuality more than other sins - I have postulated - like CS Lewis, that homosexuality is the easiest sin to single out because if you are not gay, you are not tempted by the sin.
I believe Foreigner is correct when he claims that homosexuals are looking to normalize the behavior.
I do not believe homosexual behavior is compatible with a Christian lifestyle and has no place within the church.
The reason I single out conservative Christians as people who emphasis homosexuality over other sins is because many liberal Christians do not see it as sin at all! Which is just as bad!
I freely admit that I have empathy for people who struggle with homosexuality because of my experience (no I am not a homosexual).
Unfortunately for our culture - most other sins are already mainstream - greed, gluttony, lying, stealing, and sex are all sins that fuel our economy. The only sin that is still shocking (although it is steadily becoming more accepted) is homosexuality.
Finally, I still fail to understand why some Christians are so opposed to nonbelievers engaging in homosexual behavior - especially when prostitution is legalized in Las Vegas and the internet is full of pornography and the only peep I hear about that from Christians is from in-house attempts to help fellow Christians rather than laws to outlaw the source.
And one last item - I find it impossible to believe that Foreigner has never seen the emphasis on the condemnation of homosexual behavior within some Christian circle - especially when he just confronted Kidron for starting, yet another homosexuality thread
I believe that homosexuality is a sin
I believe that some conservative Christians criticize homosexuality more than other sins - I have postulated - like CS Lewis, that homosexuality is the easiest sin to single out because if you are not gay, you are not tempted by the sin.
I believe Foreigner is correct when he claims that homosexuals are looking to normalize the behavior.
I do not believe homosexual behavior is compatible with a Christian lifestyle and has no place within the church.
The reason I single out conservative Christians as people who emphasis homosexuality over other sins is because many liberal Christians do not see it as sin at all! Which is just as bad!
I freely admit that I have empathy for people who struggle with homosexuality because of my experience (no I am not a homosexual).
Unfortunately for our culture - most other sins are already mainstream - greed, gluttony, lying, stealing, and sex are all sins that fuel our economy. The only sin that is still shocking (although it is steadily becoming more accepted) is homosexuality.
Finally, I still fail to understand why some Christians are so opposed to nonbelievers engaging in homosexual behavior - especially when prostitution is legalized in Las Vegas and the internet is full of pornography and the only peep I hear about that from Christians is from in-house attempts to help fellow Christians rather than laws to outlaw the source.
And one last item - I find it impossible to believe that Foreigner has never seen the emphasis on the condemnation of homosexual behavior within some Christian circle - especially when he just confronted Kidron for starting, yet another homosexuality thread
Homosexuality.... is it a sin? Yes.
But it is only a sin against God and against the body of the person committing that sin.
Are these things anything to do with the body of Christ? No.
You cannot do these things and claim to believe in Christ or love God.
But these are no different to any other sexual sin committed against the body,
All sin is an abomination to God just as adultery and any other sexual sin is no different in the eyes
of God. This is a worldly matter it is not Kingdom of God matter.
Whilst on earth we should never treat anyone differently because of a sin.
We should not treat homosexuals differently to adulterers or even theives.
We are not here to police the humans who do not belong to God.
Homosexuality like all sin is simply the way of the world. We know that the antichrist will rise in a Godless era. In the bible it says...
Daniel 11:36-39
King James Version (KJV)
[sup]36 [/sup]And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
[sup]37 [/sup]Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
[sup]38 [/sup]But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
[sup]39 [/sup]Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.
In our hearts the love of truth is paramount. Do you love Gold, silver, power, wealth or anything more than God?
Christ said:- " Set your hearts on the things which are heaven where rust and moths don't corrupt or decay them." There is no greater truth a man can possess than to know that God is real.
The only way to God is Jesus Christ. It isn't the sin you should be concerned with but the truth which saves them from these things. Christ is the only way to save these people but you can do nothing if they ignore the truth.
Homosexuality is a wordly issue and has nothing to do with believers.
But it is only a sin against God and against the body of the person committing that sin.
Are these things anything to do with the body of Christ? No.
You cannot do these things and claim to believe in Christ or love God.
But these are no different to any other sexual sin committed against the body,
All sin is an abomination to God just as adultery and any other sexual sin is no different in the eyes
of God. This is a worldly matter it is not Kingdom of God matter.
Whilst on earth we should never treat anyone differently because of a sin.
We should not treat homosexuals differently to adulterers or even theives.
We are not here to police the humans who do not belong to God.
Homosexuality like all sin is simply the way of the world. We know that the antichrist will rise in a Godless era. In the bible it says...
Daniel 11:36-39
King James Version (KJV)
[sup]36 [/sup]And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
[sup]37 [/sup]Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
[sup]38 [/sup]But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
[sup]39 [/sup]Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.
In our hearts the love of truth is paramount. Do you love Gold, silver, power, wealth or anything more than God?
Christ said:- " Set your hearts on the things which are heaven where rust and moths don't corrupt or decay them." There is no greater truth a man can possess than to know that God is real.
The only way to God is Jesus Christ. It isn't the sin you should be concerned with but the truth which saves them from these things. Christ is the only way to save these people but you can do nothing if they ignore the truth.
Homosexuality is a wordly issue and has nothing to do with believers.
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