The faithful and the saints: Bringing Calvinism and Arminianism together.

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
hmm…a diluted righteousness? That’s kind of interesting…like, it is possible to do something right but have some flesh mixed up in it? To have some of a purer motive and still some of a baser motive mixed in?

I had looked at more like I sometimes do the right think but I sometimes do the wrong thing but…

At any right, that’s not holiness. That is definite.
I don't think you can "dilute righteousness". I'm a black and white kind of guy, things are right or wrong. To say someone is a righteous man, when that someone does unrighteousness, there must be a source of righteousness that is not found in the man's actions.

Unless you abide by the Mosiac Covenent terms that when the righteous man does wickedly, his righteousness is forgotten.

Much love!
 

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,057
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
It's usually not worked out well in the past, but feel free!

Much love!

Yes, you’re right, it hasn’t! But when men are ready to bear a thing, they are ready. Not all will be able to accept that there may be some leaven they have been given. But some will. Even if only one or two!
 

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I’ve talked with you for a few years. Do you think it is what you do or don’t do that makes you righteous?
No. Do you?

I already think you don't.

The point is this.

I am rendered righteous by Jesus, through justification through baptism in His death and burial and resurrection. But self-control over my fleshy members is a training process, and though Jesus makes me righteous, yet it takes time for this to show in my life.

Holiness, we are set apart by God for His use, and that is being made holy. But it's as if God selected bent tongs, and a broom with hardly any bristle, and a bent basin, and is using these to serve His temple to show how it's all Him, not us. He's straightening me out, fixing the leaks, like that, and in His purposes, sometimes He works instantly, and sometimes over the course of years.

As we cooperate with Him, yielding ourselves to righteousness, we have fruit unto holiness, as the holiness He called us to is rendered into our lives.

So we are immediately holy in that God set us apart for Him. But we have to yield ourselves to righteousness - the part we see, the part we can better define to ourselves on a practical level - to produce fruit unto holiness.

We are rendered righteous and declared holy. We cooperate with righteousness, and we are rendered holy, which is to act in righteousness not as a matter of obedience, but as a matter of character, being conformed to Him image.

Much love!
 
Last edited:

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,057
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I don't think you can "dilute righteousness". I'm a black and white kind of guy, things are right or wrong. To say someone is a righteous man, when that someone does unrighteousness, there must be a source of righteousness that is not found in the man's actions.

Unless you abide by the Mosiac Covenent terms that when the righteous man does wickedly, his righteousness is forgotten.

Much love!

I don’t really think so either, but it was something to think about.
Well..if you do what is right, that’s righteous. If you do what is wrong, that’s unrighteous. You’re a mixture of both. Sometimes yes, sometimes no. But just because you have Christ’s blood on your door posts and will not be destroyed, is that any reason for you to say, I AM righteous! I AM holy! Why not be honest instead?
 

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Yes, you’re right, it hasn’t! But when men are ready to bear a thing, they are ready. Not all will be able to accept that there may be some leaven they have been given. But some will. Even if only one or two!
It's not the right idea, not a healthy situation.
 

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
But just because you have Christ’s blood on your door posts and will not be destroyed, is that any reason for you to say, I AM righteous! I AM holy! Why not be honest instead?
Is that all you have? His blood on your doorposts? Your ticket stamped, I'm going to heaven! Or do you have a new life in Christ, being born from God?

Much love!
 

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,057
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
OK. I didn't realize that.

Much love!

If a man does a wrong thing and a judge shows him mercy, it does not mean he didn’t do a wrong thing. It just means he was shown mercy by the judge.
 

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,057
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Is that all you have? His blood on your doorposts? Your ticket stamped, I'm going to heaven! Or do you have a new life in Christ, being born from God?

Much love!

Of course it’s not all. It’s a beginning.
But I wanted to deal with the danger of declaring oneself holy when they admit they are sometimes unrighteous, sometimes do the wrong thing.

If a man is speaking about himself, it’s best to be completely honest. After all, which of the two sinners praying walked away justified? It was the one who was honest. This is because God likes honesty.
It is right to tell the truth about yourself.
 
Last edited:

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
If a man does a wrong thing and a judge shows him mercy, it does not mean he didn’t do a wrong thing. It just means he was shown mercy by the judge.
I was speaking of righteousness, rather than mercy.

Much love!
 

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
If a man is speaking about himself, it’s best to be completely honest. After all, which of the two sinners praying walked away justified? It was the one who was honest. This is because God likes honesty.
It is right to tell the truth about yourself.
Which requires that we first understand the truth about ourselves.

Much love!
 

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
But I wanted to deal with the danger of declaring oneself holy when they admit they are sometimes unrighteous, sometimes do the wrong thing.
Which of us claim to be holy?

Which of us claim to be righteous?

Does God say we are holy or righteous?

Much love!
 

marks

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2018
36,701
24,032
113
SoCal USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
If a man does a wrong thing and a judge shows him mercy, it does not mean he didn’t do a wrong thing. It just means he was shown mercy by the judge.
Mercy is to treat an unrighteous man as though he were righteous. Mercy does not make one righteous.

Much love!