Secure Eternal Salvation

[Taken]

I think it's known as auto-theism. Self as God.
People that think God doesn't keep his promise for which he was sacrificed, died, are not people informed by God's spirit but their own ego instead.

That they have to help God to keep them saved is egocentrism. And denies God is sovereign and Omnipotent.
Basically, its Satanic.

Of course. You're still his, Satan's,if you stumble, don't work hard enough to retain God's favor, are still a damned sinner on the precepis of Hell,and must live insecure in Christ.

Eternal Salvation.
Two words one fact of God's irrevocable free gift.

I find it impossible for Elect Christians to argue it's not true. Because their pride is stronger than God's will and plan.

All Scripture IS True...However;
Throughout Scripture there is Applicability. For Example;
IF a person IS a Believer, A Converted Believer, particular Scriptures Apply TO that person...and Particular Scriptures Do NOT Apply To that Person.

Falling Away From Belief...IN God, IN Jesus, IN Christ, IN the Holy Spirit....
Absolutely CAN occur....UNTIL...such time....The man BECOMES;
Converted.

* A Converted man can Never Fall Away.

* A Converted man IS Spiritually Transformed And MADE a New Creature.

* Spiritually Transformed!!!
* Done Deal, OF Gods Works.
* Spiritual...INTERNAL...UNSEEN.
• the Manifestation OF SEEING the Transformation OF a mans Body, Comes Later.
• The soul and spirit within the man has Never been Seen by a bodily living man.
• The Converted mans Body is dead, and the Converted man “lives IN Christ Jesus’ Risen, Transformed, living Body...literally that man IS Called “IN” Christ.

• A man Converted IN Christ...ONLY Applies TO a Converted Man.

• Men CAN And DO...
Believe IN God, Believe IN Jesus, Believe IN Christ....Then Stop...Start Again Believing...Then Stop...Wonder...Maybe...Believe...Deny...
....WHY ?????
Basically...Because of outside words, experiences (which are endless to each individual)....but it IS specific to that individual....of his WHY.
...IS that man Converted? No.
...IS that man Sav-ED? No.
...IS that man Condemned? No.

Condemnation IS a “Sentencing” that Follows After “Judgement”.
Judgement has Not yet Occurred.

...Will that man “BECOME” SavED ?
.....MAYBE....MAYBE NOT!
....his Salvation IS Dependent ON...
WHAT he BELIEVES...At the moment OF his Bodily Death.
....he is Vacillator ...Believing, Not Believing, (no commitment)...”IF” he is Believing At the moment of his Bodily Death...he is called “endured” to his “end”.
His physical Bodily Life ENDS, With him Believing...and he “Will Be” Sav-ED”.

The Converted...(Freely, heart-fully, Committed, ARE Sav-Ed)...the Vacillators...Might or Might not BECOME Saved. <—— THEY are repeatedly WARNED in Scripture....THE World IS corrupt. Evil spirits roam about trying to convince men to Deny God. Wicked men (with power positions) continually advocate, to Believe IN THEM (and shut up about God)....
And the Fact is People do Not (broadly) Know the moment they Will bodily Die...
IF they Bodily at The moment ...they are Not Believing ...Oops...they Will Not be MADE SavED.
If they ARE believing at that moment of Bodily Death...The Will Become “MADE” SavED.
The Warning IS Because... of the RISK, the Gamble, the Odds...of what they Will Be Believing AT the precise moment...of their bodily Death...which they Do Not know When the moment Shall occur.

The Converted are Specifically IN Christ...and Shall Be Raised UP unto Christ...and occupy Christ’s millennial Kingdom With Christ.

After the millennial Reign of Christ...
A MASS “Raising Up Of The ones Made Sav-ED (because of Believing when their Body Died) Shall Be Risen BY God, Unto God, soul saved, spirit quickened, body glorified...and forever Be With God...in His entirely Restored World (void of all evil and Wickedness).

Rapture applies to those Converted IN Christ.
First “mass” Resurrection applies to all who Believed in God, in Jesus...but MADE not a Heartful Confessed Commitment TO the Lord God...Whole Alive IN their Body.

Not presently technology able to quote you difference “in Christ”...rise unto Christ...”in Jesus”...God “brings WITH Him....ie. First Mass resurrection raising of the dead after the 1,000 years have expired...been completed.

A word search of Scripture of “in Christ”, in Jesus”...will show up Thessalonians (2nd Thes I think)....and A search of “1,000 year expired” should take you to A passage in Revelations.

A huge denial of OSAS, IS pretending “Believers” ARE Sav-ED, then Not SavED.
The Fact is (speaking of bodily Alive men)....Only the Converted ARE SavED.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Ferris Bueller]

@Ferris Bueller ~
Isn’t that merry-go-round exhausting?

I hang on as long as I can, lol.

 

[robert derrick]

OSAS is gospel.

I'm certain those who have the Holy Spirit within know the import of the promise and the eternal irrevocable seal, as Jesus taught.
And no one shall ever take us from his hand.
Not even when detractors insist Christ died for a lie.

It's crystal clear. If we're not sealed for all time, we are not saved at all.
And simply put, no Christian would ever insist they're not saved.
Which, given the gravity of the Gospel message, is precisely what Once Sealed Always Sealed deniers are stating.

Nowhere in scripture does God say our actions can lead to his evicting himself, Holy Spirit, from within us.

Why is that?
For the reason the deniers don't understand the Gospel's first fact.

God chooses us!
We don't choose him. God's grace freely gifts his Elect with faith and eternal salvation.
He gifts. We can't lose what he gifts those he chose before the creation of this world.

No longer speechless, and now just more mantra speak.

The devil accused God from the beginning of being master over slaves with a whip, and so did you, because obedience is hateful and anathema to your salvation.

But to them that love Him, they love to obey Him for His eternal salvation.

You 'celebrate' a false faith and idolized grace, but the saints love obedience by grace:

We don't choose him.

I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

That thou mayest love the LORD thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto him.

I hate vain thoughts: but thy law do I love.

For your obedience is come abroad unto all men.

Once people leave Scripture of truth, they have absolutely no clue what they are talking about, but just a bunch of learned words to speak for soothing the guilty conscience.

We choose life in Christ. We choose to believe and obey Him, rather than to believe a lie to disobey Him: OSAS.

 

[robert derrick]

OSAS is gospel.

I'm certain those who have the Holy Spirit within know the import of the promise and the eternal irrevocable seal, as Jesus taught.
And no one shall ever take us from his hand.
Not even when detractors insist Christ died for a lie.

It's crystal clear. If we're not sealed for all time, we are not saved at all.
And simply put, no Christian would ever insist they're not saved.
Which, given the gravity of the Gospel message, is precisely what Once Sealed Always Sealed deniers are stating.

Nowhere in scripture does God say our actions can lead to his evicting himself, Holy Spirit, from within us.

Why is that?
For the reason the deniers don't understand the Gospel's first fact.

God chooses us!
We don't choose him. God's grace freely gifts his Elect with faith and eternal salvation.
He gifts. We can't lose what he gifts those he chose before the creation of this world.

Irrevocable, unconditional, unmerited: all words of man's doctrine. Never in Scripture.

We don't choose him.

Choose you this day whom ye will serve.

OSAS is the delusional doctrine of no choice, no responsibility, no 'cooperation', no judgment for sins of the heart and deeds of the body: they literally detach themselves, their hearts and souls, from any responsibility for what is done 'by their flesh', but not by their 'hearts'.

Choose ye this day whom you will serve.

Therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

That thou mayest love the LORD thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice

OSAS doesn't choose to love the Lord, because OSAS doesn't want to serve a Master.

OSAS just 'falls' into salvation like a swooning swan dive.

And no one shall ever take us from his hand.

IF any OSAS were ever in His hand, that walked away from it, when they believed the lie their sins of heart are not 'seen' by God, while the sins of the flesh go on still:

But God shall wound the head of his enemies, and the hairy scalp of such an one as goeth on still in his trespasses.

God's grace freely gifts his Elect with faith and eternal salvation.

Freely gifts. Who learns to talk like that? Eternal salvation is obtained by them that obey Him.

OSAS words are spread around like so much pollen in the wind. A bunch of flower child heart-speak only. Speaking into the air. Puffs of smoke and puffy clouds without water.

OSAS is gospel.

OSAS is another gospel.

Eternal salvation for them that obey Him is gospel of truth, for them that love the truth and love to obey the truth.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

This is the real reason for all this foolish talk about losing salvation. One only has to read verses like Romans 6:23 or Ephesians 2:8-10 to understand that salvation is God's gift to the one who believes on the Lord Jesus Christ (Rom 10:9-13; Acts 16:31).

At the same time Christians should understand that we are in a spiritual war, and one aspect of that is Satan casting doubts on the Gospel promises, or attacking the Gospel, so that people are constantly confused.

I don't subscribe to OSAS because I saw one day in scripture that the 'forever' in salvation is the permanence and superiority of Christ's ministry as opposed to the temporary and inadequate ministry of the Levites. And because his ministry is everlasting we are told to hold fast to it. The forever in justification/salvation is Christ, not your possession of it. You possess the forever ministry and life of Christ by continuing to hold fast to it in continued believing. That's how you have eternal life. The life is everlasting, not your possession of it...unless you keep believing.

 

[BreadOfLife]

As long as you realize your dogma is exclusively applied for and to Latin Rite Catholics, you're then correct.

Incorrect.
God doesn't "change" the rules just because YOU refused to listen to His Church.
Luke 10:16 says "WHOEVER" - not "just Latin Rite Catholics" . . .

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Apparently, you didn't learn a THING from the lesson I taught you back in post #494.

According to Protestant author, Philip Jenkins, in his book, Pedophiles and Priests - the problem is FAR WORSE in Protestant sects than in the Catholic church - and he lays out the legal statistics to prove it.

Sooooooo, instead of walling in hypocrisy - I suggest you clean up your OWM back yard before pointing fingers at anybody else . . .

Apparently, you're not reading my posts thoughtfully and attentively enough to know I don't defend any organized church on your side of the great divide or mine.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

The following apply to virtually EVERY Protestant denomination . . .
Evangelicals ‘worse’ than Catholics on sexual abuse

Evangelical Sex Abuse Record ‘Worse’ Than Catholic, Says Billy Graham’s Grandson

Protestants can no longer dismiss abuse as a ‘Catholic problem’

Child Sex Abuse More Prevalent Among Protestants Than Among Catholics

There Is More Sexual Abuse In The Protestant Churches Than Catholic

Catholic priests no guiltier of sex abuse than other clergy

Data Shed Light on Child Sexual Abuse by Protestant Clergy

Denial About Sexual Abuse In Evangelical Churches

Southern Baptists Apologize For Sex Abuse Coverups

U.S. Protestants’ Views Mixed about Extent of Clergy Sexual Abuse

Churchgoers Split on Existence of More Sexual Abuse by Pastors

Confronting Evangelical Enabling of Sexual Abuse

Child abuse a Calvinist problem, podcast says

I don't have any reason to not question the validity of any of these articles you've posted.

Now explain how these show that the Catholic church is the one and only authorized religious organization of God's, while everyone else's is not. I don't recall Protestants ever claiming moral superiority is the evidence that they are God's official religious organization on planet earth. As you're pointing out, there is no basis for that claim on either side. I certainly don't make that claim on behalf of Protestants. The theological and moral decay of both the Protestant and Catholic denominations tells us that God can not be identified in a religious organization, but only in the individual lives of believers as they grow and mature. That's the point you don't seem to be understanding.

 

[Pythagorean12]

Correct. God doesn't change. He also doesn't confirm to the christo-pagan dogma of the LRC.

Incorrect.
God doesn't "change" the rules just because YOU refused to listen to His Church.
Luke 10:16 says "WHOEVER" - not "just Latin Rite Catholics" . . .

 

[Pythagorean12]

Irrevocable, unconditional, unmerited: all words of man's doctrine. Never in Scripture.

We don't choose him.

Choose you this day whom ye will serve.

OSAS is the delusional doctrine of no choice, no responsibility, no 'cooperation', no judgment for sins of the heart and deeds of the body: they literally detach themselves, their hearts and souls, from any responsibility for what is done 'by their flesh', but not by their 'hearts'.

Choose ye this day whom you will serve.

Therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

That thou mayest love the LORD thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice

OSAS doesn't choose to love the Lord, because OSAS doesn't want to serve a Master.

OSAS just 'falls' into salvation like a swooning swan dive.

And no one shall ever take us from his hand.

IF any OSAS were ever in His hand, that walked away from it, when they believed the lie their sins of heart are not 'seen' by God, while the sins of the flesh go on still:

But God shall wound the head of his enemies, and the hairy scalp of such an one as goeth on still in his trespasses.

God's grace freely gifts his Elect with faith and eternal salvation.

Freely gifts. Who learns to talk like that? Eternal salvation is obtained by them that obey Him.

OSAS words are spread around like so much pollen in the wind. A bunch of flower child heart-speak only. Speaking into the air. Puffs of smoke and puffy clouds without water.

OSAS is gospel.

OSAS is another gospel.

Eternal salvation for them that obey Him is gospel of truth, for them that love the truth and love to obey the truth.

I won't bother to reply to all of your falsehoods though I will address the first one.

OSAS is scripture.As is what you falsely claim here.
"
Irrevocable, unconditional, unmerited: all words of man's doctrine. Never in Scripture."

For future, don't enter a Christian forum unaware of our faith and think cherry picked verses found on a bible site serves your anti-gospel purpose. Your transparency is blatant. And sad

 

[robert derrick]

I don't subscribe to OSAS because I saw one day in scripture that the 'forever' in salvation is the permanence and superiority of Christ's ministry as opposed to the temporary and inadequate ministry of the Levites. And because his ministry is everlasting we are told to hold fast to it. The forever in justification/salvation is Christ, not your possession of it. You possess the forever ministry and life of Christ by continuing to hold fast to it in continued believing. That's how you have eternal life. The life is everlasting, not your possession of it...unless you keep believing.

I saw one day in scripture that the 'forever' in salvation is the permanence and superiority of Christ's ministry as opposed to the temporary and inadequate ministry of the Levites.

Good point: Thou art a priest forever after the order of Melchisedec.

Which eternal priesthood and ministry of Christ is able to present them that obey Him faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy.

I.e. the believer doesn't obtain salvation and the crown of life, except they obey Him to the end of the race, having run lawfully.

Whether we are believing Jesus or not is proven by obedience to Him according to the Scriptures.

OSAS wilfully and seductively confuses believing Jesus with believing in a certain kind of salvation that they like.

They that are not obeying Him, cannot be believing Him, because both believing and obeying begin in the heart, by which we are eternally saved, so long as we continue believing and obeying Him from the heart.

Having a stranglehold on eternal life and salvation by faith alone only lasts to the grave.

No soul is excused from the deeds of the body. Every disobedience of the body comes from disobedience of the heart, which is sin of the soul.

 

[robert derrick]

I won't bother to reply to all of your falsehoods though I will address the first one.

OSAS is scripture.As is what you falsely claim here.
"
Irrevocable, unconditional, unmerited: all words of man's doctrine. Never in Scripture."

For future, don't enter a Christian forum unaware of our faith and think cherry picked verses found on a bible site serves your anti-gospel purpose. Your transparency is blatant. And sad

I won't bother to reply to all of your falsehoods though I will address the first one.

I.e. Back to speechless again.

All OSAS has is speechlessness or airy speeches.

Which of course is the result of faith alone that lives by words only, and rejects loving Jesus in deed and in truth, by obeying Him and the truth, as being heresy to the faith of unconditional salvation.

Which of course, it is.

Them that join the devil to accuse God of being a harsh Master whipping up on His slaves, show they are yet carnal and at enmity with the law of Christ.

But them that obey Him for eternal salvation, do so by love of Him and take pleasure with Him in it:

Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:

Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So, you don't know what determines which case of the 'if' is to be used in a passage?

I do, you don't! that is why you believe a false doctrine.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

What's so hard about doing that?

Why bother saving them in the first place? But now we are are in mens philosophy and not scripture!

 

[robert derrick]

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God.

Not all saints die in Christ by beheading.

The 'beheading' of all saints therefore is when them that obey Him to the end, are delivered of their vile bodies to the grave: they are freed of those bodies, as the head is when beheaded.

Only them that take up their own cross to crucify the old man thereon, and bring their mortal bodies under subjection to the end, will be beheaded of those bodies, to have blessed part in the first resurrection of the church.

Them that willfully disobey Him, trusting in faith alone, will go with their vile bodies to the grave for the resurrection of eternal shame.

OSAS literally believes they are already the 'dead in Christ', and so are already beheaded from their mortal bodies, so that their souls seated in heavenly places, are no longer accountable for the deeds of their bodies yet on earth.

God cannot 'see' the sin of their souls, which is known by the sinful deeds of their bodies.

They don't confess and claim the deeds of that old body anymore, because that old body is no longer theirs to rule, and so their souls can no longer be held accountable for those bodies!

It's the ultimate in dysfunctional dystopianism.

At least zombies still know their bodies are on their heads, doing what their dead heads tell them to.

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

I will recompense them according to their deeds, and according to the works of their own hands.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Because man has free choice.
He does not take away a person's free choice.

So you believe mans free choice overrules the sovereignty of God then. OK!

I guess you have a problem with Jeremish being appointed a prophet before he was born and Paul being set apart in his mothers womb then.

Unsaved man has no free will. They are incapable of choosing God on their own. Saved man has free will restored- but that is not a game of daisy where we choose and not choose, then choose and not choose. Free will has to do with with serving God as an obedient child, or being a disobedient child, but you are still a child.

If you really believed your parents were not you rparents anymore- that does not stop them from being your parents! Same with God- If one is truly saved and rebels for a season and rejects the Messiahship of Jesus- Jesus is still His savior. Like it is written- He will never leave us or forsake us and even if we lose faith- He doesn't, He cannot deny Himself!

Also if one is saved No one can pluck us out of Jesus hands or the Fathers hands- not even the false teachers that say you can do it! You are a man and you cannot pluck yorself out of HIs hands!

But believe this lie if you wish-As I said, God forbid it should happen, but in one sense I hope you do go through a season of unbelief, so you will learn the majestic glory of trhe riches of His love and grace and mercy.

Charles Hadden Spuirgeon said it beautifully in one of HIs sermons: "Those who believe they can lose their salvation for any reason, leaves me to wonder if they ever met the Savior in the first place."

 

[robert derrick]

Why bother saving them in the first place? But now we are are in mens philosophy and not scripture!

I.e. why both saving someone, if God is not going to turn a blind eye to their sins. After all, we in OSAS know our mortal bodies are going to continue in sin anyway. It's guaranteed.

Therefore, unless there is a pre-forgiveness for all those sins our bodies are certainly going to do, then why save our souls in the first place??

And that is exactly the carnal thinking contrary to Scripture that is never saved in the first place.

If that is the true OSAS philosophy about sins of the heart and the deeds of the body, then truly they are never saved by the faith and obedience of Jesus in the heart.

They still see sin as an unavoidable temporary pleasure, and obedience otherwise is a hard road not worth travelling.

Good understanding giveth favour: but the way of transgressors is hard.

But when the obedience of Jesus is born in our heart, then the yoke of the Lord is indeed easy, because obeying Him is not hard, but a pleasure and a joy, not to boast of, but to be eternally thankful for:

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

OSAS truly is a deceiving salvation for the unconverted carnal mind, where they are not made free from sins in the heart, but rather trust their sins to go unseen by God.

They trust in a made up idol that has eyes, but cannot see sin, and has hands, but cannot deliver from sin.

Wherefore should the heathen say, Where is now their God?

Where is now God's eyes? For they do not see the sins anymore.

 

[robert derrick]

I guess you have a problem with Jeremish being appointed a prophet before he was born and Paul being set apart in his mothers womb then.

Unsaved man has no free will. They are incapable of choosing God on their own. Saved man has free will restored- but that is not a game of daisy where we choose and not choose, then choose and not choose. Free will has to do with with serving God as an obedient child, or being a disobedient child, but you are still a child.

If you really believed your parents were not you rparents anymore- that does not stop them from being your parents! Same with God- If one is truly saved and rebels for a season and rejects the Messiahship of Jesus- Jesus is still His savior. Like it is written- He will never leave us or forsake us and even if we lose faith- He doesn't, He cannot deny Himself!

Also if one is saved No one can pluck us out of Jesus hands or the Fathers hands- not even the false teachers that say you can do it! You are a man and you cannot pluck yorself out of HIs hands!

But believe this lie if you wish-As I said, God forbid it should happen, but in one sense I hope you do go through a season of unbelief, so you will learn the majestic glory of trhe riches of His love and grace and mercy.

Charles Hadden Spuirgeon said it beautifully in one of HIs sermons: "Those who believe they can lose their salvation for any reason, leaves me to wonder if they ever met the Savior in the first place."

So you believe mans free choice overrules the sovereignty of God then. OK!

The you do not willfully sin and override His sovereignty over you??

 

[GRACE ambassador]

op: Secure ETERNAL Salvation!

Praise Be To God, TOTALLY agree with the OP: God's ETERNAL Salvation!!:

NOT men's philosophy/fantasy of some made-up idea of temporary SELF-salvation?:

Due to Prayerful/Careful study of ALL Of God's Word Of Truth! IF God Says
Something ONCE, we SURELY ought to believe HIM, Correct?

What IF God Says It 12 DOZEN Times? Should we DISbelieve HIM???:

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!
God's Eternal Assurance

Amen?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So you believe mans free choice overrules the sovereignty of God then. OK!

The you do not willfully sin and override His sovereignty over you??

If God willed I never sin again, I wouldn't. And in heaven He does and I won't!

You need to look further than just the words on the page in English, and a simple concordance. Will has many variations of meaning in Greek based on its construct. that is why in the past believing Scholars coined the terms "Gods' Sovereign will" and "Gods permissive will" It is all based on how God inspired the original writers to form teh word "will".