A Closer Look at the Genesis Creation Account

[Cooper]

Cooper, you are another one who cannot back up what he claims.....what has that response got to do with what I posted? I simply gave you an account of Moses' history, which you did not seem to be aware of. Make sure of your facts before you post them.
How am I promoting Judaism when Jesus himself never once claimed to be what you said he is.

You too do not seem to understand the difference between 'divinity' and 'deity'....Jesus was divine, but he was not deity. God-like...but not God.

Perhaps it is a good idea to ignore me.....since you cannot defend your own beliefs. You disagree with most Christians here in what you post so how is that not just the most blatant hypocrisy? Good grief! You accused Yahweh of being a pagan god.

I do not need lecturing on things I already know. None of which has anything to do with Christianity, and this is a Christian forum. You can stop proselytising now, thank you.
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[Truth7t7]

I was raised in the Anglican church, but by my early twenties, (though I had been confirmed in the church at age 15) nothing that was said in that building made any sense to me. It was like having many pieces of a jigsaw puzzle in front of me, without knowing where to put the pieces because half of the puzzle was missing or the pieces were blank.
This frustrated me to no end because, if I am going to believe in something with my whole heart, then my whole mind has to go along for the ride.
What I was being told to believe 'blindly' never had any real backup, and there was never a big picture to show me where the pieces I did have, fitted in.

I didn't want to go to heaven and I came to understand why. God never intended for any humans to go to heaven originally....they were 'programmed' to live forever in paradise, which was intended to be right here on earth. Death was not supposed to happen and that is why it felt so wrong. Why were we grieving if it was such a blessed event? It was the sudden death of my father that prompted my search in earnest...I had to know where he had gone. If he was up in heaven missing us like we were missing him, how could heaven be a happy place?

I left the Anglican church and began an investigation into other denominations in the hope of finding the truth, which was always missing. But no matter what denomination I explored, the same unsupported doctrines kept coming up, and some so out of sinc with the Bible that I balked....so I expanded my search to explore other faiths.....Eastern religions had some merit but the idolatry was so off putting.....and science, including the theory of evolution....but in every path I took, there was a dead end and I failed to find the God that Jesus spoke about. Death was still an unanswered mystery...

I wanted the Bible's truth...the whole truth and nothing but the truth....but no denomination in Christendom gave that to me. They were all just different versions of the same unfulfilling story. Same platitudes, guesswork and assertions, but no real Bible truth.

Just when I was ready to give up, I believe that God found me...and he introduced himself to me by answering all my unanswered questions, straight from his word.....I then understood why Jesus sent his disciples out to spread his message. He said that "this good news of the Kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come". (Matthew 24:14; Matthew 10:11-14) This was part of his "sign" that we were in the "end times".

So right up until "the end" people would hear an unpopular message preached by a despised minority and it will be their undoing. (John 15:18-21)
When Jesus said that "few" are on the road to life....there is a reason. (Matthew 7:13-14; 21-23)

"Just like the days of Noah", Jesus said it would be when he was to return (Matthew 24:37-39)....and here we are. How many listened to Noah? He was like some 'fruitcake' building a gigantic box in the middle of a cleared field and telling the people that a flood was coming.....what fool could take him seriously?

Could people again be fooled by the appearance of the messenger, and miss the full import of the message?

Its a good question, don't you think?

Thanks for the response

A minority of people, preaching the kingdom in all the world?

A direct question, what group or person(s) writings do you follow?

Are you Jehovahs Witness?

Are you 7th day Adventist?

 

[JohnPaul]

Who did Jesus say was before Abraham?
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Jesus said unto them before Abraham was born I Am.

We know Jesus existed before he came to us in human form, he is still the son of God, not God himself.

 

[Cooper]

Jesus said unto them before Abraham was born I Am.

We know Jesus existed before he came to us in human form, he is still the son of God, not God himself.

Only the flesh was the Son and that was just 2000 years ago.

Before he was born of Mary, he was and is, the Lord of Genesis, the God of all creation, the God of heaven and earth. Your God and my God.

Jesus Christ is the same, yesterday, today and forever. That was said to the Hebrews in Hebrews 13:8. This was also said in Micah 5:2.

Micah is your Bible, which apparently you don't seem to know very well. Otherwise you would know Jesus was from old to everlasting. Failure to understand and not live, worship and act in accordance with the NEW COVENANT will result in millions of people finding themselves in the very place they did not want to be, come the rapture.
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[JohnPaul]

Only the flesh was the Son and that was just 2000 years ago.

Before he was born of Mary, he was and is, the Lord of Genesis, the God of all creation, the God of heaven and earth. Your God and my God.

Jesus Christ is the same, yesterday, today and forever. That was said to the Hebrews in Hebrews 13:8. This was also said in Micah 5:2.

Micah is your Bible, which apparently you don't seem to know very well. Otherwise you would know Jesus was from old to everlasting. Failure to understand and not live, worship and act in accordance with the NEW COVENANT will result in millions of people finding themselves in the very place they did not want to be, come the rapture.
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Sorry I don’t agree with you, Jesus is not God but the Son of God, you nor anyone else will convince me otherwise.

 

[farouk]

Sorry I don’t agree with you, Jesus is not God but the Son of God, you not anyone else will convince me otherwise.

@JohnPaul In Philippians 2, the Lord Jesus 'thought it not robbery to be equal with God'.

 

[marks]

@lforrest

We are open to folks who legitimately seek to learn and understand things, but we are not open to those who categorically deny a central tenant of the faith through willful choice.

Any questions may be asked here

So then, you are saying those who are inquiring about the doctrine of the Trinity, though perhaps not embracing it, but are open to consider it, are welcome to post, but that those who are settled in their view, and who consistently state that the doctrine of the Trinity is false, are not?

Much love!

 

[lforrest]

@lforrest
So then, you are saying those who are inquiring about the doctrine of the Trinity, though perhaps not embracing it, but are open to consider it, are welcome to post, but that those who are settled in their view, and who consistently state that the doctrine of the Trinity is false, are not?

Much love!

I don't enforce it to this degree. I only want to ensure that there is nothing overly critical of the Trinity and those who hold to it.

 

[Cooper]

Sorry I don’t agree with you, Jesus is not God but the Son of God, you nor anyone else will convince me otherwise.

Then there is no point in continuing.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Thanks for the response

A minority of people, preaching the kingdom in all the world?

A direct question, what group or person(s) writings do you follow?

Are you Jehovahs Witness?

Are you 7th day Adventist?

Who are known for preaching the good news of God’s kingdom in all the world? Who alone have been doing that consistently for over 100 years now? This was never promoted when I was in church...it was never even mentioned, and yet Jesus disciples were identified as those sent out to do exactly that. Why does Christendom neglect “the great commission”? (Matthew 28:19-20; Matthew 10:11-14)

This is not a work exclusively for missionaries sent overseas....the Jewish disciples of Jesus preached to their Jewish neighbors door to door (Acts 5:42; 20:20)....or to anyone who would listen. Some went to the market places, or anywhere that people congregated. Those who came to Jerusalem for the Festival of Pentecost from foreign lands, were privileged to hear the good news (gospel) in their own language. They then took that good news back home and told others about it.

How many members of Christendom’s churches participate in the work that Jesus commanded.....? It was not an option, but an obligation.....commanded, not simply recommended.

I came to realise that the reason why my church did not participate in this work is because they were ill equipped to carry it out. If you ask Christendom’s members what exactly is the kingdom of God, oftentimes all you hear is crickets......or vague attempts to define what they think it is.

That is mostly because church attendees have been lulled into believing that preaching is someone else’s job. And that one needs a degree in theology to even begin to understand or teach people about the Bible. None of Jesus’ twelve apostles were educated at the Rabbinical schools. Why? Because what they were teaching was the traditions of men, substituted for the word of God. (Matthew 15:7-9) History was going to repeat as Jesus forewarned. (Matthew 13:24-30: 36-42) Our worship is “in vain” unless it is founded on the truth. There cannot be many versions of the truth...there can only be one. (Luke 10:16)

Preaching the gospel doesn’t mean talking “at” people on a street corner, but rather talking “to” those who show interest...teaching them what was taught to you.

In order to preach about the Kingdom of God, you first have to know what it is, and why it’s good news. What will the kingdom mean for humankind and this earth? What is its purpose?

Can I ask you to define God’s Kingdom scripturally so that you can tell someone else in understandable terms exactly what it means?

 

[Truth7t7]

Who are known for preaching the good news of God’s kingdom in all the world? Who alone have been doing that consistently for over 100 years now? This was never promoted when I was in church...it was never even mentioned, and yet Jesus disciples were identified as those sent out to do exactly that. Why does Christendom neglect “the great commission”? (Matthew 28:19-20; Matthew 10:11-14)

This is not a work exclusively for missionaries sent overseas....the Jewish disciples of Jesus preached to their Jewish neighbors door to door (Acts 5:42; 20:20)....or to anyone who would listen. Some went to the market places, or anywhere that people congregated. Those who came to Jerusalem for the Festival of Pentecost from foreign lands, were privileged to hear the good news (gospel) in their own language. They then took that good news back home and told others about it.

How many members of Christendom’s churches participate in the work that Jesus commanded.....? It was not an option, but an obligation.....commanded, not simply recommended.

I came to realise that the reason why my church did not participate in this work is because they were ill equipped to carry it out. If you ask Christendom’s members what exactly is the kingdom of God, oftentimes all you hear is crickets......or vague attempts to define what they think it is.

That is mostly because church attendees have been lulled into believing that preaching is someone else’s job. And that one needs a degree in theology to even begin to understand or teach people about the Bible. None of Jesus’ twelve apostles were educated at the Rabbinical schools. Why? Because what they were teaching was the traditions of men, substituted for the word of God. (Matthew 15:7-9) History was going to repeat as Jesus forewarned. (Matthew 13:24-30: 36-42) Our worship is “in vain” unless it is founded on the truth. There cannot be many versions of the truth...there can only be one. (Luke 10:16)

Preaching the gospel doesn’t mean talking “at” people on a street corner, but rather talking “to” those who show interest...teaching them what was taught to you.

In order to preach about the Kingdom of God, you first have to know what it is, and why it’s good news. What will the kingdom mean for humankind and this earth? What is its purpose?

Can I ask you to define God’s Kingdom scripturally so that you can tell someone else in understandable terms exactly what it means?

Once Again

"A direct question"

Are you Jehovahs Witness?

Are you 7th Day Adventist?

 

[Aunty Jane]

Once Again

"A direct question"

Are you Jehovahs Witness?

Are you 7th Day Adventist?

How many SDA's have ever knocked on your door?
Mormons used to come knocking but they had nothing to tell us about God's Kingdom....

Direct answer?....drum roll.....yes I am a JW. After much study, I chose to become a disciple of Christ about 50 years.

Wait for it....

But perhaps now you can answer my direct question....
Can I ask you to define God’s Kingdom scripturally so that you can tell someone else in understandable terms exactly what it means?
What will the kingdom mean for humankind and this earth? What is its purpose?

I will be interested in your answer......

 

[Cooper]

How many SDA's have ever knocked on your door?
Mormons used to come knocking but they had nothing to tell us about God's Kingdom....

Direct answer?....drum roll.....yes I am a JW. After much study, I chose to become a disciple of Christ about 50 years.

Wait for it....

But perhaps now you can answer my direct question....
Can I ask you to define God’s Kingdom scripturally so that you can tell someone else in understandable terms exactly what it means?
What will the kingdom mean for humankind and this earth? What is its purpose?

I will be interested in your answer......

The Kingdom of God is where Jesus is. He has gone to prepare a place for us. John 14:1-3.
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[Aunty Jane]

The Kingdom of God is where Jesus is. He has gone to prepare a place for us. John 14:1-3.
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OK, so how would you define God’s Kingdom? What is it exactly that he went to prepare in this place for his elect?
What is the “good news” (gospel) about this Kingdom, since you know where it is....but do you know what it is, and how it will affect life on earth?
What is the purpose of the elect being taken to heaven?

 

[Aunty Jane]

@JohnPaul In Philippians 2, the Lord Jesus 'thought it not robbery to be equal with God'.

I would just like to correct that mistranslation which does not say that at all....

Can we examine the whole passage....?

“Have this mind in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: who, existing in the form of God, counted not the being on an equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in the likeness of men; and being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, becoming obedient even unto death, yea, the death of the cross. Wherefore also God highly exalted him, and gave unto him the name which is above every name; that in the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven and things on earth and things under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”
(Philippians 2:5-11 - ASV)

It only takes a little twist in interpretation to make the Bible say what it doesn’t.

So, first of all Jesus is said to have “existed in God’s form”, not that he was God.
So what “form” does God have? John 4:24 says that “God is a spirit” So Jesus was in the same “form” as his Father. He was a spirit being before coming to earth to be born as a human.

He did not count equality with his God as “something to be grasped” although when he received the power of God’s spirit at his baptism, and demonstrated his ability to perform miracles, he could well have grasped it if he had wanted humans to worship him...he never did.
As a human “he humbled himself becoming obedient even unto death“...so to whom was Jesus “obedient”? And why would one part of God need to be obedient to his other equal self?

But after he had finished his earthly course and faithfully given his life for mankind, he returned to heaven after his God resurrected him. (Acts 2:24) Then it says....”God highly exalted him, and gave unto him the name which is above every name”....how does one part of God “exalt” an equal part of himself? And how can one part of God give himself a name that is above what he already has as “the Most High” (Psalm 83:18)

So we can bend our knee in humble respect and appreciation to God’s Son, acknowledging him as our Lord and savior, but “every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.” If Jesus was God, then nothing in this passage makes any sense. All glory would have gone to Jesus, who went through the most awful trials for our sake and yet......it was his God and Father who sent him (John 17:3) and was glorified by his sacrificial course.....if God had not made that provision, we would have been without hope.....so credit where credit is due. Full credit goes to the Father, and full appreciation should go to his servant Jesus. (Acts 3:13, 26)

When you use a passage of scripture to prove something that the Bible does not teach, you end up proving the opposite. This is why we need to read more carefully.....often passages are interpreted in a way that gives a distorted impression....and we know whose interests that serves.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Death came as a result of sin. Sin didn't come until after the 7th day. So your theistic evolutionary theory falls seeing you have dinosaurs etc dying before man was made.
Also, it isn't only Genesis that stipulates a 6 day creation. Deuteronomy and Exodus state "for in 6 days the Lord created... And rested the 7th". No where in scripture is there any suggestion this is a metaphorical number.

People are going to believe what they are going to believe, but show me in scripture where God promised eternal life to animals. The only ones I see God promised eternal life to is mankind. That means that from the beginning when God first created all kinds of life before man, those animals grew old and died.

 

[Cooper]

OK, so how would you define God’s Kingdom? What is it exactly that he went to prepare in this place for his elect?
What is the “good news” (gospel) about this Kingdom, since you know where it is....but do you know what it is, and how it will affect life on earth?
What is the purpose of the elect being taken to heaven?

Those questions are beyond my understanding, I am sorry to say. All I know is that I will be with my redeemer, who is fully man and fully God, and I am content to know I will be with him in glory.
.

 

[Cooper]

I would just like to correct that mistranslation which does not say that at all....

Can we examine the whole passage....?

“Have this mind in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: who, existing in the form of God, counted not the being on an equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in the likeness of men; and being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, becoming obedient even unto death, yea, the death of the cross. Wherefore also God highly exalted him, and gave unto him the name which is above every name; that in the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven and things on earth and things under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”
(Philippians 2:5-11 - ASV)

It only takes a little twist in interpretation to make the Bible say what it doesn’t.

So, first of all Jesus is said to have “existed in God’s form”, not that he was God.
So what “form” does God have? John 4:24 says that “God is a spirit” So Jesus was in the same “form” as his Father. He was a spirit being before coming to earth to be born as a human.

He did not count equality with his God as “something to be grasped” although when he received the power of God’s spirit at his baptism, and demonstrated his ability to perform miracles, he could well have grasped it if he had wanted humans to worship him...he never did.
As a human “he humbled himself becoming obedient even unto death“...so to whom was Jesus “obedient”? And why would one part of God need to be obedient to his other equal self?

But after he had finished his earthly course and faithfully given his life for mankind, he returned to heaven after his God resurrected him. (Acts 2:24) Then it says....”God highly exalted him, and gave unto him the name which is above every name”....how does one part of God “exalt” an equal part of himself? And how can one part of God give himself a name that is above what he already has as “the Most High” (Psalm 83:18)

So we can bend our knee in humble respect and appreciation to God’s Son, acknowledging him as our Lord and savior, but “every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.” If Jesus was God, then nothing in this passage makes any sense. All glory would have gone to Jesus, who went through the most awful trials for our sake and yet......it was his God and Father who sent him (John 17:3) and was glorified by his sacrificial course.....if God had not made that provision, we would have been without hope.....so credit where credit is due. Full credit goes to the Father, and full appreciation should go to his servant Jesus. (Acts 3:13, 26)

When you use a passage of scripture to prove something that the Bible does not teach, you end up proving the opposite. This is why we need to read more carefully.....often passages are interpreted in a way that gives a distorted impression....and we know whose interests that serves.

If I may take the liberty of using the Queen of England as an illustration of someone who is both a mother at home and the sovereign of England, but is one person. In one role she speaks as a mother and in her public role she speaks as one having authority. That is how it is with Jesus who sometimes speaks as a man, and at other times speaks as one having authority. If Elizabeth goes abroad, she remains Queen of England and uses the "Royal We" the same as Jesus who remains God in heaven Lord of all he surveys wherever he is, whether on earth or in heaven.
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[Aunty Jane]

Those questions are beyond my understanding, I am sorry to say. All I know is that I will be with my redeemer, who is fully man and fully God, and I am content to know I will be with him in glory.
.

Really? You cannot tell me what the Kingdom of God is, and what the “good news” (gospel) of the Kingdom is? (Matthew 24:14)
Didn’t Jesus teach us to pray for God’s Kingdom to “come” so that God’s will is “done on earth as it is in heaven”? (Matthew 6:9-10) Yet you don’t know what you are praying for? Or how the Kingdom comes?

Then how can you as a Christian, supposedly of the elect, who will rule with Christ in his Kingdom, not know this most fundamental truth?
How can you then tell others the good news about this Kingdom when you know nothing about it yourself....or what it’s for....or what it will accomplish?

This IMO, is what separates the ‘sheep from the goats’....the ‘weeds from the wheat’......

This always happens when I ask these questions.....
What is the Kingdom of God?
What is it’s purpose?
What is the good news about it?.....

All I hear is....

Does God keep this vital knowledge to himself? Or does he only reveal it to those will actually rule with Christ in his Kingdom?

The Bible tells us exactly what it is, how it “comes” and what it will accomplish.

How is this beyond your understanding? Why is it?

 

[Cooper]

Really? You cannot tell me what the Kingdom of God is, and what the “good news” (gospel) of the Kingdom is? (Matthew 24:14)
Didn’t Jesus teach us to pray for God’s Kingdom to “come” so that God’s will is “done on earth as it is in heaven”? (Matthew 6:9-10) Yet you don’t know what you are praying for? Or how the Kingdom comes?

Then how can you as a Christian, supposedly of the elect, who will rule with Christ in his Kingdom, not know this most fundamental truth?
How can you then tell others the good news about this Kingdom when you know nothing about it yourself....or what it’s for....or what it will accomplish?

This IMO, is what separates the ‘sheep from the goats’....the ‘weeds from the wheat’......

This always happens when I ask these questions.....
What is the Kingdom of God?
What is it’s purpose?
What is the good news about it?.....

All I hear is....

Does God keep this vital knowledge to himself? Or does he only reveal it to those will actually rule with Christ in his Kingdom?

The Bible tells us exactly what it is, how it “comes” and what it will accomplish.

How is this beyond your understanding? Why is it?

I speak of what I know to those I know are born of God. Otherwise I stay silent.
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