End-Time Deception - Hebrew Roots/Messianic Movement

[Taken]

@josiahandamanda ~
Welcome to the forum and thanks for sharing your experiences, from disappointment in a Christian church to delving into the Hebrew Roots Messianic Movement.

The Hebrew Roots/ Messianic Movement is primarily madeup of Gentiles trying to not only identify with Hebrews/Jews, "ie", but be accepted "AS" ISRAEL and "Christian".

The fact is there ARE Christian Churches, that expressly "Preach" being under the new Covenant, YET "Teach" it's congregation IS STILL under the laws of SIN in the "Old Covenant", and carry on "rituals and traditions", AS IF, they need to cover all bases, (just in case !)

There are also, Christian Churches that "Preach" exclusively Salvation 'NOW" is Offered to all men BY, THROUGH, OF; Him WHOM God Sent;
In the "Likeness AS" a Son of man, for earthly men to HEAR, SEE, OBSERVE ... As a PERFECT Example for earthly men.
*Jesus, the Word of God, absolute Truth
*Christ, the Power & Wisdom of God
* His WAY, a perfect example, for men to follow and BECOME themselves, MADE, perfected "IN" Him.

Any individual, Accepting Gods Offering...do NOT become "MADE";
ISRAEL, HEBREWS: TRIBESMEN, JEWS, GENTILES, CHRISTIANS...
They DO become "MADE" CONVERTED "IN" Christ, BY, THROUGH, OF...the fulfillment "OF" Gods Promise....and THUS, so ALSO DOES,
....Gods Books and Records Testify of His Promise Fulfilled IN that "Converted" individual.
...Gods "Fulfillment IN an individual" is Effectively, A Spiritual "SEPARATION" unto God Himself of that individual, FROM all the "DIVIDED" men "OF" the World.
...WE who "are Spiritually Separated"...WAIT, to "SEE", (when risen IN Glory, Able TO SEE with Spiritual EYES) the "manifestation" of the Separation UNTO God.

Hebrews/Tribesmen do not become Gentiles, no matter how many rituals or traditions of Gentiles they follow or perform.

Gentiles do not become Hebrews/Tribesmen, no matter how many rituals or traditions of Hebrews/Tribesmen they follow or perform.

One Learning "ABOUT" the other, is benefitial for the individual.
God gave, Hebrews, Tribesmen...
* Laws (primarily called Mosaic Law, which were given orally, and later written)
* Curses (modernly called Penal laws, which is negative consequences for positive Law violations).
* Statutes first written By God Himself.
* Precepts (primarily found WITHIN the Mosaic Laws), pertaining to "beneficial Behaviors between and among men".

* The Mosaic Law, "was a training" guideline for do's and don'ts of ancient men.
* The Statutes, "are an express" guideline of Requirements FOR any man, who desire to KNOW Gods expectation for ANY man, to BE "WITH" God.
* The Precepts, "are Gods teaching of the most beneficial Behaviors among/between men, for a favorable outcome" (These ARE beneficial for ALL men ... Hebrew, Tribesmen, Gentiles)....and WHY, OT study IS beneficial for any man to learn.

Neh 9:
[14] And madest known unto them thy holy sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses thy servant:

There IS NO DIVISION of "(body, soul spirit of men in the Lord Gods Kingdom") of Respecting what men ON Earth call themselves.
IN Gods Kingdom, THEY are ALL, "Gods People, and He Their God".

Per your experience...in a particular Church, with the Hebrew Roots movement....
....you landed on OLD AGE understanding;
"Cunning trickery captures ones attention, Because; it has subtle hint of truth...explained in lies....which distorts the truth."

When one peels away the "tares / lies / distortion"...it becomes clear;
THE TRUTH is NOT the INTENT of their TEACHING...but rather like dangling a carrot before a rabbit to capture his attention, to SNARE him.

And Lastly I will mention another movement of made up of Jews, called Messanic Jews, who are learning the Word of God and accepting Christ Jesus as their Messiah and Savior. Praise God.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Jay Ross]

@Jay Ross
Do you have updates/recent info. - about 'Messianic Jews' in Australia?
---
I got some info. from online..

No, I am not that interested in following up about Messianic Jews in Australia.

The End Time prophecies are still seals up and not available to be understood by all at present. As such there is much confusion as to what is to happen during the end times.

Shalom

 

[michaelvpardo]

The Old Covenant that God had made with the Jews was the Kingdom of Priest, the Holy Nation, and His Possession Among the Nations Covenant, which the nation rebelled against while Moses was up on the Mountain with God for the first time for forty days.

In Jeremiah 31:31ff God is telling the nation of Israel that in the distant future, around 2500 years later after Jeremiah wrote this prophecy down, that He would once again re-establish the Kingdom of Priest, the Holy Nation, and His Possession Among the Nations Covenant with the house of Israel, but with a number of tweaks and make it feel like new again for them.

I have a very different take on what God has said He would do in our near future with regards to the nation/people of Israel. My paraphrase of the NKJV reads something like this: -

Ezekiel 11:14-21: - God Will Restore Israel

14 Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, 15 "Son of man, your brethren, your relatives, your countrymen, and all the house of Israel in its entirety, are those about whom the inhabitants of Jerusalem have said, 'Get far away from the Lord; this land/earth has been given to us as a possession/inheritance.'[1] 16 Therefore say, 'Thus says the Lord God: "Although I have cast them far off among the Gentiles, and although I have scattered them among the countries, yet I shall be a little sanctuary for them in the countries where they have gone."' 17 Therefore say, 'Thus says the Lord God: "I will gather you from the peoples, assemble you from the countries where you have been scattered, and I will give you the land/fertile field of Israel."' 18 And they will go there/come together, and they will take away/remove all its/the detestable things and all its/the abominations from there/amongst them. 19 Then I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within them, and take the stony heart out of their flesh, and give them a heart of flesh, 20 that they may walk in My statutes and keep My judgments and do them; and they shall be My people, and I will be their God. 21 But as for those whose hearts follow the desire for their detestable things and their abominations, I will recompense their deeds on their own heads," says the Lord God.​

Shalom
[1] Some work still needs to be done on this verse to get an understanding of what it means.

I don't believe in "replacement " theology at all and base my understanding on what the Holy Spirit teaches me through His word, but the Apostle Paul teaches very plainly that the law was as a tutor ( under the ministry of Angel's) until that time when the inheritor of all things appeared.
Clearly the law of God is eternal, but a covenant satisfied is a covenant completed and absolutely no one is saved by the works of the law or perfected by them.
The New Covenant, the covenant of peace (with God) is a much higher standard than the old, because it is the standard of perfection as revealed in His Son, not dependent upon inherently weak men, but upon El Shaddai Himself in the person of the Holy Spirit. There's a huge difference between the standard of the Old covenant and the New, because the old was dependent upon human behavior while the New is dependent upon God's mercy, grace, and ultimately God's fulfillment of it.

12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. Phillipians 2:12-13
These verses from the Apostle Paul could never be applied to the covenant made at Sinai. The New covenant is as different from the Old as day is to night, as substance is to shadow.
By all means, continue your study, but believe the Word of God and seek His righteousness, not your own.

The Old covenant was righteousness to those who kept it. The New Covenant is the Lord's righteousness to those who would receive Him, hence the name of the city of God "the Lord our Righteousness."
The Lord said,“Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God." From Luke 18:19
If you can apprehend this (or have), then it should be clear that there is no possibility of salvation except by simply receiving His righteousness in the person of His Spirit through faith in His Son. Anything else is just vanity.

25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”
26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

 

[amadeus]

...

Our Master went for forty days and forty nights without food or water.
After that time, was it GOD who came to him, or was it Satan?
...
Well so far, Im not seeing that a forty day fast guarantees that its GOD who speaks to you.

Read also read about Moses, who fasted 40 days twice just about back to back. At the end of the first 40 in anger he broke the tablets on which God had written with His finger...

“When I was gone up into the mount to receive the tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant which the LORD made with you, then I abode in the mount forty days and forty nights, I neither did eat bread nor drink water:
And the LORD delivered unto me two tables of stone written with the finger of God; and on them was written according to all the words, which the LORD spake with you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly
And it came to pass at the end of forty days and forty nights, that the LORD gave me the two tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant.” Deut 9:9-11

“And I took the two tables, and cast them out of my two hands, and brake them before your eyes.
And I fell down before the LORD, as at the first, forty days and forty nights: I did neither eat bread, nor drink water, because of all your sins which ye sinned, in doing wickedly in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger
For I was afraid of the anger and hot displeasure, wherewith the LORD was wroth against you to destroy you. But the LORD hearkened unto me at that time also.” Deut 9:17-19

Thus I fell down before the LORD forty days and forty nights, as I fell down at the first; because the LORD had said he would destroy you.
I prayed therefore unto the LORD, and said, O Lord GOD, destroy not thy people and thine inheritance, which thou hast redeemed through thy greatness, which thou hast brought forth out of Egypt with a mighty hand.” Deut 9:25-26

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

@josiahandamanda ~
Welcome to the forum and thanks for sharing your experiences, from disappointment in a Christian church to delving into the Hebrew Roots Messianic Movement.

The Hebrew Roots/ Messianic Movement is primarily madeup of Gentiles trying to not only identify with Hebrews/Jews, "ie", but be accepted "AS" ISRAEL and "Christian".

The fact is there ARE Christian Churches, that expressly "Preach" being under the new Covenant, YET "Teach" it's congregation IS STILL under the laws of SIN in the "Old Covenant", and carry on "rituals and traditions", AS IF, they need to cover all bases, (just in case !)

There are also, Christian Churches that "Preach" exclusively Salvation 'NOW" is Offered to all men BY, THROUGH, OF; Him WHOM God Sent;
In the "Likeness AS" a Son of man, for earthly men to HEAR, SEE, OBSERVE ... As a PERFECT Example for earthly men.
*Jesus, the Word of God, absolute Truth
*Christ, the Power & Wisdom of God
* His WAY, a perfect example, for men to follow and BECOME themselves, MADE, perfected "IN" Him.

Any individual, Accepting Gods Offering...do NOT become "MADE";
ISRAEL, HEBREWS: TRIBESMEN, JEWS, GENTILES, CHRISTIANS...
They DO become "MADE" CONVERTED "IN" Christ, BY, THROUGH, OF...the fulfillment "OF" Gods Promise....and THUS, so ALSO DOES,
....Gods Books and Records Testify of His Promise Fulfilled IN that "Converted" individual.
...Gods "Fulfillment IN an individual" is Effectively, A Spiritual "SEPARATION" unto God Himself of that individual, FROM all the "DIVIDED" men "OF" the World.
...WE who "are Spiritually Separated"...WAIT, to "SEE", (when risen IN Glory, Able TO SEE with Spiritual EYES) the "manifestation" of the Separation UNTO God.

Hebrews/Tribesmen do not become Gentiles, no matter how many rituals or traditions of Gentiles they follow or perform.

Gentiles do not become Hebrews/Tribesmen, no matter how many rituals or traditions of Hebrews/Tribesmen they follow or perform.

One Learning "ABOUT" the other, is benefitial for the individual.
God gave, Hebrews, Tribesmen...
* Laws (primarily called Mosaic Law, which were given orally, and later written)
* Curses (modernly called Penal laws, which is negative consequences for positive Law violations).
* Statutes first written By God Himself.
* Precepts (primarily found WITHIN the Mosaic Laws), pertaining to "beneficial Behaviors between and among men".

* The Mosaic Law, "was a training" guideline for do's and don'ts of ancient men.
* The Statutes, "are an express" guideline of Requirements FOR any man, who desire to KNOW Gods expectation for ANY man, to BE "WITH" God.
* The Precepts, "are Gods teaching of the most beneficial Behaviors among/between men, for a favorable outcome" (These ARE beneficial for ALL men ... Hebrew, Tribesmen, Gentiles)....and WHY, OT study IS beneficial for any man to learn.

Neh 9:
[14] And madest known unto them thy holy sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses thy servant:

There IS NO DIVISION of "(body, soul spirit of men in the Lord Gods Kingdom") of Respecting what men ON Earth call themselves.
IN Gods Kingdom, THEY are ALL, "Gods People, and He Their God".

Per your experience...in a particular Church, with the Hebrew Roots movement....
....you landed on OLD AGE understanding;
"Cunning trickery captures ones attention, Because; it has subtle hint of truth...explained in lies....which distorts the truth."

When one peels away the "tares / lies / distortion"...it becomes clear;
THE TRUTH is NOT the INTENT of their TEACHING...but rather like dangling a carrot before a rabbit to capture his attention, to SNARE him.

And Lastly I will mention another movement of made up of Jews, called Messanic Jews, who are learning the Word of God and accepting Christ Jesus as their Messiah and Savior. Praise God.

Glory to God,
Taken

What I have seen of them is that they have no love for Jesus Christ at all, it's all about the day that they get their own Jesus, just as it was back in the days before Jesus Christ.
So it's the Vineyard story once again, that's who they are. They sure as hell do not want to preach Jesus Christ at all, but they are all about the 2ed coming, that's what they peddle, because they truly reject Jesus Christ in fact.
If they truly believed in Jesus Christ then they would be Christians in fact, not to mention the fact that under true Christianity all people are the same under his roof. as their is no Greek or Jew, that worldly rubbish is eliminated.
True Christianity does not look to such as that racial prejudice madness, a True Christian has no time for such madness or boasting who some fool claims to be.

So some clown starts crowing about his so called race being the stage, just does not get it, it's not about you or your race at all, it's about your relationship in Christ Jesus that counts.
If one claims his race is the key, well then he drinks from another well, or is poisoning wells.

Idolising so called Jews is a grave Sin, they could do nothing all through their history by themselves in fact and they only were worthy of God when they abided in God, apart from that they always fell in fact. not to mention that's the case regardless of ones so called race. Look at the world nowadays, it's heading for Hellfire, a pathetic people who are lost as to God has no hope.
Fact is that Christ Jesus is the only way.

 

[Taken]

What I have seen of them is that they have no love for Jesus Christ at all, it's all about the day that they get their own Jesus, just as it was back in the days before Jesus Christ.

Individuals belonging to the same "groups", all still have their "individual" beliefs, that differ from the "whole of the groups".
* Groups identifying "AS"... this race, this religion, this political, this nation, this gender, this profession, whatever...all still have their "individual" beliefs. Only they and God knows what is in their "hearts".

A True Christian...

I have seen, several use that phrase;
"A True Christian"... which reflects my point.
Who defines what "A True Christian IS and Isn't?
Scripturally...Christian mentioned 3 times, was (Unbelievers of Jesus Being the Christ), WHO "gave JEWISH men" a "LABEL". (who believed Jesus IS the Christ.)

In it's essence...Christ-ian...simply means one "who Believes Jesus IS the Christ."
And from there...it gets "confusing"...(considering an Individual's knowledge and thereafter their "beliefs", which is always based on the individuals "depth of knowledge.")
...The "confusion" for every individual IS:
"Human Knowledge" is continually, changing, increasing, which means, So Also is an individual's BELIEFS, changing, based on the "their Knowledge changing".
...AND there IS the Condunrum OF HUMANS.
...Only an "individual" (and God), KNOWS "for sure", what they Believe, from day to day.
...Because it is the "individual" who daily gathers "new knowledge", (from multiply sources), and decides to Believe that "new knowledge" OR NOT.

The "crux" of the matter IS...THAT IS HOW the BRAIN, was designed to function.
The Brain "gathers information":
The Mind "dissects" the information...
Considers this, Unsure about this, Agrees with this, Rejects this.
And much of the "new information", an individual's MIND "lands on BELIEVING"...
IS directly related TO; Their "individual" "TRUSTING of the SOURCE" of their "new information".

Infants, TRUST, whoever "cares for them"...
IS "with" them, feeds them, cleans them, cuddles them, sooths them, talks to them, plays with them, teaches them, guides them, "protects them from harm", tends to them.
...Scripturally...that IS a parents role...(UNTIL the Infants, ARE "prepared" and "armed" in TRUTH, and "THEN sent" out INTO face the WORLD....which is full of lies and deceptions.
...SADLY, THAT ^ has been a little by little, Changing, generation by generation, Effecting; the Parents' ROLE, Worldly taught, advocated, promoted, and in many cases "as having no Choice"...
BUT TO: Send infants, babes, toddlers, little children, preteens, teens;...
OUT INTO the WORLD...to TRUST, whereever they ARE SENT.
...It's A Global nightmare.
...Hear tell of the Complaints of parents, when school closures were happening...Oh, oh, their children at HOME all day, under foot, bored, missing out ON..."sports"!!...or ya and the "academics thingy"...AND then inturn, "Complaining" of "WHAT", they recently "discovered", their children are being "Taught" in 'schools'....?? But Still want their "children", IN school (out of the home) 8 hours a day? (During the bulk of the day the child is awake!).
...AND enter in the factor....of the WORLD saying...uh, uh, no, no....that two hour weekly Religious teaching...for your children, is too HEALTH HAZARDOUS...STAY HOME...
But...don't touch or be in the vicinity of each other, that's also too HEALTH HAZARDOUS!
...Utterly INSANE! But, but, but....it is all what the "individual", has "chosen"...
TO TRUST!

...it's not about you or your race at all, it's about your relationship in Christ Jesus that counts.

IMO...God Himself Decided it was ALL ABOUT A "RACE"..."the HUMAN RACE" God called "a MAN-KIND" of thing.
And from the beginning of man-kind, God has been DIVIDING men "WITH" Him, FROM men "WITHOUT" Him.
And God Himself, Labeled, Identified, men "WITH" FROM men "WITHOUT" Him.
* And the beat goes on...from the beginning, to this day...'With' God, "without" God, 'with" God, "without" God..
* Men from the beginning to this DAY...waver back and forth (momentarily, daily, yeary)...
* Trust God, Believe God, Wonder, Distrust God, Disbelieve, Maybe, Unsure, Believe, don't believe....it's an "individual" deciding, according to the "information" they mull over in their MINDS, based on "new information" they gain, day by day. Nothing new.

Oh wait, there IS something "OLD" revealed in "NEW" WAY...
The OLD...the WORD of God.
The NEW...revealed in the LIKENESS as a "man-kind of thing"....called by What God declared...JESUS.
The NEW...a thing the Human Race could...SEE and HEAR...experience AND testify ABOUT.
The NEW...a thing, speaking wonderous things, doing miracles before their eyes, hearing testimonies of men's personal experiences of such miracles.....AND
* Back to the "basics"...WHO is hearing, reading, learning, trusting, verifying and (how much) of this 'NEW" "knowledge"?
* TRUTHFULLY...FEW. The "how much"...
IS very "LITTLE"...The "how often"...IS very "LITTLE"...The "verification" IS very "LITTLE".
* AND by no surprise...The "Trust" IS very "LITTLE"...AND the personal "experiences"...by default, IS very "LITTLE"...
AND by "consequences" of "all the Little"...
"The Consideration TO have an interest to Delve INTO, becomes MOOT.

It's a condunrum...The World is "teaching", and "promoting" and "rewarding" ...impatience, instant satisfaction, instant feel good, instant healing, "by, through, of"...
The "fast track" drugs, pills, fun, games, debt, money, greed, position, multiple sexual relationships, plowing through life without a care of what is stampeded under foot... obtains the prize of personal euphoria.

 

[Ancient]

I'm sorry, but I'm a little confused over all this.
I love my Master and Saviour, and find this a little strange what this person is talking about.

Our Master went for forty days and forty nights without food or water.
After that time, was it GOD who came to him, or was it Satan?

This probably won't be the only comment I make, as I have many questions.
Did not Jesus have to discern whether this was an evil one... or an angel of GOD?

First of all, satan said to him, " if you are the son of GOD, command that these stones become bread"
Jesus answers "it has been written, man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes out of the mouth of GOD".

I'm sorry if I'm a bit ignorant in all this, but Jesus said "it is written".
And also, he said "every word out of the mouth of GOD".

So I looked up where it is written, and found that it is in Deuteronomy 8:3.

Apparently, this is the Law, or what is called the Torah.
I have had to let that sink in, what Jesus said, because I had also remembered in my readings lately that GOD had said to Israel, that He was going to raise up a prophet like Moses. That He was going to put His words in his mouth, and that the person who did not take note of these, would be held accountable.

So that brought up a whole lot of other scriptures for me.
It's like, bang, bang, bang, one after the other, just like Jesus said it would happen. He said the the Holy Spirit would tell us concerning himself.

So I then went to Paul's account at Jerusalem, where he was told that the new gentiles coming into the faith of Jesus Christ, would go to the Synagogue and learn Moses every Sabbath it says.

Well so far, Im not seeing that a forty day fast guarantees that its GOD who speaks to you.


___________________________________________________________________________________________

You are on the right track if you are interested I can help you, or visit website.

Shalom

 

[michaelvpardo]

And when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. So it was that for a whole year they assembled with the church and taught a great many people. And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch. Acts 11:26
This verse tells us 2 things, the word Christian was first used to describe disciples of Christ in Antioch. The second is the implication that "true" Christians are disciples of christ.
Prior to the use of "Christian" to describe them as Christ like, the disciples were simply called followers of "the way."

4 And where I go you know, and the way you know.”
5 Thomas said to Him, “Lord, we do not know where You are going, and how can we know the way?”
6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:4-6

It may sound obvious, but you must be a disciple in order to be Christian (and I've known professing Christians that see no reason to learn the teachings or to become christ like.)

 

[amadeus]

Individuals belonging to the same "groups", all still have their "individual" beliefs, that differ from the "whole of the groups".
* Groups identifying "AS"... this race, this religion, this political, this nation, this gender, this profession, whatever...all still have their "individual" beliefs. Only they and God knows what is in their "hearts".



I have seen, several use that phrase;
"A True Christian"... which reflects my point.
Who defines what "A True Christian IS and Isn't?
Scripturally...Christian mentioned 3 times, was (Unbelievers of Jesus Being the Christ), WHO "gave JEWISH men" a "LABEL". (who believed Jesus IS the Christ.)

In it's essence...Christ-ian...simply means one "who Believes Jesus IS the Christ."
And from there...it gets "confusing"...(considering an Individual's knowledge and thereafter their "beliefs", which is always based on the individuals "depth of knowledge.")
...The "confusion" for every individual IS:
"Human Knowledge" is continually, changing, increasing, which means, So Also is an individual's BELIEFS, changing, based on the "their Knowledge changing".
...AND there IS the Condunrum OF HUMANS.
...Only an "individual" (and God), KNOWS "for sure", what they Believe, from day to day.
...Because it is the "individual" who daily gathers "new knowledge", (from multiply sources), and decides to Believe that "new knowledge" OR NOT.

The "crux" of the matter IS...THAT IS HOW the BRAIN, was designed to function.
The Brain "gathers information":
The Mind "dissects" the information...
Considers this, Unsure about this, Agrees with this, Rejects this.
And much of the "new information", an individual's MIND "lands on BELIEVING"...
IS directly related TO; Their "individual" "TRUSTING of the SOURCE" of their "new information".

Infants, TRUST, whoever "cares for them"...
IS "with" them, feeds them, cleans them, cuddles them, sooths them, talks to them, plays with them, teaches them, guides them, "protects them from harm", tends to them.
...Scripturally...that IS a parents role...(UNTIL the Infants, ARE "prepared" and "armed" in TRUTH, and "THEN sent" out INTO face the WORLD....which is full of lies and deceptions.
...SADLY, THAT ^ has been a little by little, Changing, generation by generation, Effecting; the Parents' ROLE, Worldly taught, advocated, promoted, and in many cases "as having no Choice"...
BUT TO: Send infants, babes, toddlers, little children, preteens, teens;...
OUT INTO the WORLD...to TRUST, whereever they ARE SENT.
...It's A Global nightmare.
...Hear tell of the Complaints of parents, when school closures were happening...Oh, oh, their children at HOME all day, under foot, bored, missing out ON..."sports"!!...or ya and the "academics thingy"...AND then inturn, "Complaining" of "WHAT", they recently "discovered", their children are being "Taught" in 'schools'....?? But Still want their "children", IN school (out of the home) 8 hours a day? (During the bulk of the day the child is awake!).
...AND enter in the factor....of the WORLD saying...uh, uh, no, no....that two hour weekly Religious teaching...for your children, is too HEALTH HAZARDOUS...STAY HOME...
But...don't touch or be in the vicinity of each other, that's also too HEALTH HAZARDOUS!
...Utterly INSANE! But, but, but....it is all what the "individual", has "chosen"...
TO TRUST!



IMO...God Himself Decided it was ALL ABOUT A "RACE"..."the HUMAN RACE" God called "a MAN-KIND" of thing.
And from the beginning of man-kind, God has been DIVIDING men "WITH" Him, FROM men "WITHOUT" Him.
And God Himself, Labeled, Identified, men "WITH" FROM men "WITHOUT" Him.
* And the beat goes on...from the beginning, to this day...'With' God, "without" God, 'with" God, "without" God..
* Men from the beginning to this DAY...waver back and forth (momentarily, daily, yeary)...
* Trust God, Believe God, Wonder, Distrust God, Disbelieve, Maybe, Unsure, Believe, don't believe....it's an "individual" deciding, according to the "information" they mull over in their MINDS, based on "new information" they gain, day by day. Nothing new.

Oh wait, there IS something "OLD" revealed in "NEW" WAY...
The OLD...the WORD of God.
The NEW...revealed in the LIKENESS as a "man-kind of thing"....called by What God declared...JESUS.
The NEW...a thing the Human Race could...SEE and HEAR...experience AND testify ABOUT.
The NEW...a thing, speaking wonderous things, doing miracles before their eyes, hearing testimonies of men's personal experiences of such miracles.....AND
* Back to the "basics"...WHO is hearing, reading, learning, trusting, verifying and (how much) of this 'NEW" "knowledge"?
* TRUTHFULLY...FEW. The "how much"...
IS very "LITTLE"...The "how often"...IS very "LITTLE"...The "verification" IS very "LITTLE".
* AND by no surprise...The "Trust" IS very "LITTLE"...AND the personal "experiences"...by default, IS very "LITTLE"...
AND by "consequences" of "all the Little"...
"The Consideration TO have an interest to Delve INTO, becomes MOOT.

It's a condunrum...The World is "teaching", and "promoting" and "rewarding" ...impatience, instant satisfaction, instant feel good, instant healing, "by, through, of"...
The "fast track" drugs, pills, fun, games, debt, money, greed, position, multiple sexual relationships, plowing through life without a care of what is stampeded under foot... obtains the prize of personal euphoria.

@Taken
@Penney

How does a man get past all of that and this?

"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts." Prov 21:2

And this?

"O LORD, I know that
the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23

But then Jesus explains the Way:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

And Peter in response to a question tells us how to get there:

"Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:37-39

 

[Taken]

And when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. So it was that for a whole year they assembled with the church and taught a great many people. And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch. Acts 11:26
This verse tells us 2 things, the word Christian was first used to describe disciples of Christ in Antioch. The second is the implication that "true" Christians are disciples of christ.
Prior to the use of "Christian" to describe them as Christ like, the disciples were simply called followers of "the way."

Yes, Jesus' disciples.....ie FOLLOWERS of Jesus were In Antioch.
Yes, "OTHER" men, who were NOT disciples, NOT followers of Jesus, NOT believers, NOT teachers....called the disciples' "CHRISTIANS".

Christ is what the Disciples were "CALLING" JESUS.
The suffix "ian", simply is identifying a person with the "word" Christ....ie Christian.

The FACT is, a person one day, can identify himself as a "Christ-ian"....and the next day Reject Christ, and denounce identifying himself with Christ.

It is the SAME as in the OT....of men following God, believing God, then denying God.
Men do the SAME with Jesus, with Christ...

The History show us Gods response...
WHEN a man is "WITH" God, God is "WITH" the man.
WHEN a man is "WITH" Jesus, Jesus is "WITH" the man.
WHEN a man is "WITH" Christ, Christ is "WITH" the man.

* Judas Iscarot was "WITH" Jesus, Jesus was "WITH" Judas. Judas was no longer "WITH" Jesus, Jesus was no longer "WITH" Judas.
Judas, never returned to Jesus.
Jesus, never returned to Judas.

* WHAT Jesus "offered" was a WAY, by, through, of Him, to BE "WITH" HIM always and forever.

* Jesus didn't call that "Christianity"...
* Jesus "called" that offering...
"Converted", by through, of Him...
By His Authority,
Through His Power,
Of Him, who is Christ.

Sure...some men identify "themselves" as "Christians"...and then "unidentify themselves" as "Christians.

Once a person is "CONVERTED IN CHRIST"...
Their "position" of Converted; is Forever.
Forever "WITH" Christ.

It may sound obvious, but you must be a disciple in order to be Christian (and I've known professing Christians that see no reason to learn the teachings or to become christ like.)

What is "Obvious" is calling oneself a "Christian" is ambiguous.

 

[Taken]

@Taken
@Penney

How does a man get past all of that and this?

"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts." Prov 21:2

And this?

"O LORD, I know that
the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23

But then Jesus explains the Way:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

God, created us. He knows the manner in which He created us. We "taste" before we "eat".
He gives us "tastes" little by little of His Knowledge, that we may experience, BEFORE we jump into a "permanent" commitment.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[amigo de christo]

@Taken
@Penney

How does a man get past all of that and this?

"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts." Prov 21:2

And this?

"O LORD, I know that
the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23

But then Jesus explains the Way:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

And Peter in response to a question tells us how to get there:

"Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:37-39

The beauty of the HOLY SPIRIT is .................IT IS HOLY . It would bring to our remembrance the things JESUS said
and later the apostles said .
Thus if any spirit , any man , anyone sayeth thus sayeth the LORD , or i have a word from the HOLY SPIRIT ,
ya better test it against bible doctrine . Cause one thing about the HOLY SPIRIT , it cannot CONTRADICT JESUS .
It would not contradict the biblical letters from apostels either .
AKA , we better KNOW OUR GOD , CHRIST and BIBLES WELL . Cause if we truly want to know about GOD ,
WELL those pages are FULL of TRUTH . Now i leave us with johns words ,
BELOVED BELIEVE NOT EVERY SPIRIT , BUT TRY , TEST, THE SPIRITS for many decievers , many false prophets abound .
TEST EM against that biblical word . TEST them against the FOUNDATION which IS CHRIST and the apostels and prophets .
GET IN THAT BIBLE and LEARN IT WELL . Lest any man decieve us and lest we are tossed to and fro
by the doctrines of men .

 

[michaelvpardo]

Yes, Jesus' disciples.....ie FOLLOWERS of Jesus were In Antioch.
Yes, "OTHER" men, who were NOT disciples, NOT followers of Jesus, NOT believers, NOT teachers....called the disciples' "CHRISTIANS".

Christ is what the Disciples were "CALLING" JESUS.
The suffix "ian", simply is identifying a person with the "word" Christ....ie Christian.

The FACT is, a person one day, can identify himself as a "Christ-ian"....and the next day Reject Christ, and denounce identifying himself with Christ.

It is the SAME as in the OT....of men following God, believing God, then denying God.
Men do the SAME with Jesus, with Christ...

The History show us Gods response...
WHEN a man is "WITH" God, God is "WITH" the man.
WHEN a man is "WITH" Jesus, Jesus is "WITH" the man.
WHEN a man is "WITH" Christ, Christ is "WITH" the man.

* Judas Iscarot was "WITH" Jesus, Jesus was "WITH" Judas. Judas was no longer "WITH" Jesus, Jesus was no longer "WITH" Judas.
Judas, never returned to Jesus.
Jesus, never returned to Judas.

* WHAT Jesus "offered" was a WAY, by, through, of Him, to BE "WITH" HIM always and forever.

* Jesus didn't call that "Christianity"...
* Jesus "called" that offering...
"Converted", by through, of Him...
By His Authority,
Through His Power,
Of Him, who is Christ.

Sure...some men identify "themselves" as "Christians"...and then "unidentify themselves" as "Christians.

Once a person is "CONVERTED IN CHRIST"...
Their "position" of Converted; is Forever.
Forever "WITH" Christ.



What is "Obvious" is calling oneself a "Christian" is ambiguous.

I don't believe in "conversions" unless that applies to being born again of the Holy Spirit and that is the work of God and according to His will, not of men.

 

[amigo de christo]

@Taken
@Penney

How does a man get past all of that and this?

"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts." Prov 21:2

And this?

"O LORD, I know that
the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23

But then Jesus explains the Way:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

And Peter in response to a question tells us how to get there:

"Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:37-39

you are being prayed for my friend . The LORD is with the lambs . He is our hope and our salvation .

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Individuals belonging to the same "groups", all still have their "individual" beliefs, that differ from the "whole of the groups".
* Groups identifying "AS"... this race, this religion, this political, this nation, this gender, this profession, whatever...all still have their "individual" beliefs. Only they and God knows what is in their "hearts".



I have seen, several use that phrase;
"A True Christian"... which reflects my point.
Who defines what "A True Christian IS and Isn't?
Scripturally...Christian mentioned 3 times, was (Unbelievers of Jesus Being the Christ), WHO "gave JEWISH men" a "LABEL". (who believed Jesus IS the Christ.)

In it's essence...Christ-ian...simply means one "who Believes Jesus IS the Christ."
And from there...it gets "confusing"...(considering an Individual's knowledge and thereafter their "beliefs", which is always based on the individuals "depth of knowledge.")
...The "confusion" for every individual IS:
"Human Knowledge" is continually, changing, increasing, which means, So Also is an individual's BELIEFS, changing, based on the "their Knowledge changing".
...AND there IS the Condunrum OF HUMANS.
...Only an "individual" (and God), KNOWS "for sure", what they Believe, from day to day.
...Because it is the "individual" who daily gathers "new knowledge", (from multiply sources), and decides to Believe that "new knowledge" OR NOT.

The "crux" of the matter IS...THAT IS HOW the BRAIN, was designed to function.
The Brain "gathers information":
The Mind "dissects" the information...
Considers this, Unsure about this, Agrees with this, Rejects this.
And much of the "new information", an individual's MIND "lands on BELIEVING"...
IS directly related TO; Their "individual" "TRUSTING of the SOURCE" of their "new information".

Infants, TRUST, whoever "cares for them"...
IS "with" them, feeds them, cleans them, cuddles them, sooths them, talks to them, plays with them, teaches them, guides them, "protects them from harm", tends to them.
...Scripturally...that IS a parents role...(UNTIL the Infants, ARE "prepared" and "armed" in TRUTH, and "THEN sent" out INTO face the WORLD....which is full of lies and deceptions.
...SADLY, THAT ^ has been a little by little, Changing, generation by generation, Effecting; the Parents' ROLE, Worldly taught, advocated, promoted, and in many cases "as having no Choice"...
BUT TO: Send infants, babes, toddlers, little children, preteens, teens;...
OUT INTO the WORLD...to TRUST, whereever they ARE SENT.
...It's A Global nightmare.
...Hear tell of the Complaints of parents, when school closures were happening...Oh, oh, their children at HOME all day, under foot, bored, missing out ON..."sports"!!...or ya and the "academics thingy"...AND then inturn, "Complaining" of "WHAT", they recently "discovered", their children are being "Taught" in 'schools'....?? But Still want their "children", IN school (out of the home) 8 hours a day? (During the bulk of the day the child is awake!).
...AND enter in the factor....of the WORLD saying...uh, uh, no, no....that two hour weekly Religious teaching...for your children, is too HEALTH HAZARDOUS...STAY HOME...
But...don't touch or be in the vicinity of each other, that's also too HEALTH HAZARDOUS!
...Utterly INSANE! But, but, but....it is all what the "individual", has "chosen"...
TO TRUST!



IMO...God Himself Decided it was ALL ABOUT A "RACE"..."the HUMAN RACE" God called "a MAN-KIND" of thing.
And from the beginning of man-kind, God has been DIVIDING men "WITH" Him, FROM men "WITHOUT" Him.
And God Himself, Labeled, Identified, men "WITH" FROM men "WITHOUT" Him.
* And the beat goes on...from the beginning, to this day...'With' God, "without" God, 'with" God, "without" God..
* Men from the beginning to this DAY...waver back and forth (momentarily, daily, yeary)...
* Trust God, Believe God, Wonder, Distrust God, Disbelieve, Maybe, Unsure, Believe, don't believe....it's an "individual" deciding, according to the "information" they mull over in their MINDS, based on "new information" they gain, day by day. Nothing new.

Oh wait, there IS something "OLD" revealed in "NEW" WAY...
The OLD...the WORD of God.
The NEW...revealed in the LIKENESS as a "man-kind of thing"....called by What God declared...JESUS.
The NEW...a thing the Human Race could...SEE and HEAR...experience AND testify ABOUT.
The NEW...a thing, speaking wonderous things, doing miracles before their eyes, hearing testimonies of men's personal experiences of such miracles.....AND
* Back to the "basics"...WHO is hearing, reading, learning, trusting, verifying and (how much) of this 'NEW" "knowledge"?
* TRUTHFULLY...FEW. The "how much"...
IS very "LITTLE"...The "how often"...IS very "LITTLE"...The "verification" IS very "LITTLE".
* AND by no surprise...The "Trust" IS very "LITTLE"...AND the personal "experiences"...by default, IS very "LITTLE"...
AND by "consequences" of "all the Little"...
"The Consideration TO have an interest to Delve INTO, becomes MOOT.

It's a condunrum...The World is "teaching", and "promoting" and "rewarding" ...impatience, instant satisfaction, instant feel good, instant healing, "by, through, of"...
The "fast track" drugs, pills, fun, games, debt, money, greed, position, multiple sexual relationships, plowing through life without a care of what is stampeded under foot... obtains the prize of personal euphoria.

By a True Christian I mean Truly born again.

Many people who claim to be Christians are not devoted to Jesus Christ, they are all about their Religion first and foremost.
Many people who claim to be Christians are what is called in the Bible as ones who can not handle Meat ? so they are Milk Christians if that and as the Bibles says that about the ones who will say lord lord ? but Jesus will say that he never knew them, remember.
So many have a false Jesus ! sadly because of the weeds choke such people who are of little faith, as the Bible says in the Parable of the weeds.

Christianity is not about Race at all, it's all about the Holy Spirit and you abiding, that's the Key ! the Holy Spirit will inform you not to trust Man at all.

When one is water baptised you are welcomed into a family, as were the Jews one could say as the blueprint their of is as such ? but that was not the end of the matter as in regards we see Moses is on about, The One ! who is to come ? that is the whole point ! and he did come and what did he give us to receive ? one has to pick up to receive, then it clicks who you are and who is who in the Zoo. but you have to reject this world due to it's delusions and deceptions.
The Kingdom of God is were it's all at, because that's were Israel is and all of the born again Saints are at, because they are worthy of the Name Israel in fact, just like it was said of Jacob by an Angel and of Nathaniel by Jesus Christ himself.

So we do have baby Christians who live in hope that they and others do become truly born again, but as it is the water Baptism has to suffice until that day that the lights truly come on. then they will understand who Jesus Christ truly really is and they will abide in him. because when one gets to that point one can not be snatched out of his hand. because you understand who he truly is, you can not go back, like a dog to it's vomit, as the Bible points such out.

 

[kcnalp]

The Israel wannabees seem determined to steal Israel's identity.

 

[Taken]

By a True Christian I mean Truly born again.

Thank you.

Many people who claim to be Christians are not devoted to Jesus Christ, they are all about their Religion first and foremost.

Agree.

Christianity is not about Race at all, it's all about the Holy Spirit and you abiding, that's the Key ! the Holy Spirit will inform you not to trust Man at all.

When I say Race, broadly I mean, (the modern term; ie Human Race) What Scripture calls Terrestrials, (meaning created out of the Earth, having Gods Breath of Life IN them), and the Specific Kind of Terrestrial, (God called a man-Kind of thing).
God divided, the "Human Race".
(The Division, Being Expressly, Dependantant Upon)...
WHO of the Human Race..."Yes was Yes".
(Meaning, WHO:
Heard the Word of God..."AND Agreed TO DO, as God said, THUS, "those IN AGREEMENT WITH GOD ...WOULD BE;
WITH God and God WITH THEM

IN BRIEF:
The Division...Began...
WITH...Land.."Garden of Eden"
WHO....Occupied the Land..."Adam & Eve".
WHO....Were the People "with" or "without" God...Doing or Not Doing...what God said.
....Man created "outside" of the "Garden."
....Man "put" in the "Garden", "with God".
....Man "did not do as God said".
....Man "put OUT of the "Garden".

The Division...Continued...
WITH...Land..."Canaan",
.....Occupied by
WHO...(several groups, their areas, their Head of families, ie kings, rulers, over their areas of land.)
WHO...was sent to Canaan...
Abram, named changed, to Abraham, and First to be called... A Hebrew

Abram...becomes the first noted...TO DO, as God commanded, and Rewarded, by God, name Changed and with Title....
Abraham; Father of many Nations.
We discover; Abram DOING, by Scriptural Testimony.

(It's a foreshadow...of Gods BIG PICTURE).
....Men...Hearing, as Gods Word says.
....Men...Agreeing, To Do, as Gods Word says.
....Men...With God, for doing as God says.
....God...With men, for doing as God says.
....Men...With God, changed names, changed position, changed expectation in Life beyond "natural life ON Earth".

The Increase of People...(more births).
The Movement of People...(other lands).
The Influence of People...(Governments, without God, power over People, with God, and complications, pressure, to acquiesce to Mans Law, or Remain true to Gods Law...the Difficulty, day to day.

Consequences...(Condunrum)
Persecution of Men toward Men WHO:
* Stand fast "With God", and "Reject Men as their god".
Persecution of God toward Men WHO:
* Stand fast "With Men", and "Reject God as their God".

Allegience....TO GOD...vow, "with YOUR WORD".....that your declaration ...."YES BE YES".

EXODUS from Bondage...
...A Particular Divided Race of People.
..From A particular Land, to A particular Land
Gods Word....given Via Moses...Peoples Response...
"WE WILL DO ALL THAT YOU SAY" Ex 19:18

Moving Forward...
The Division of People, Lands continue.
Enter ON EARTH...Gods Fulfillment of a Promise....
* Gods WORD will Appear in the LIKENESS of Men, Walk Among men, Be Seen by men, Be Heard by men:
* Gods WORD, will Teach, Preach, with Authority, TRUTH.
* Gods WORD, will REVEAL His POWER, for the Effects of His POWER, to be Seen by men.
* Gods WORD, will REVEAL, A WAY; BY HIS OFFERING;
FOR ALL MEN, (regardless of RACE DIVIDED people and BOUNDARY DIVIDED lands)....
TO BECOME MADE, "once and Forever" WITH God, and God WITH a man

* ANY MAN..."who", desires to ACCEPT, the OFFERING.... DOES SO, BY that "INDIVIDUAL" mans "AGREEMENT" which IS his own vow, of "HIS OWN WORD"....
According TO "the WAY" acceptable to God.
* THE WAY - ACCEPTABLE TO GOD
IS EXPRESSLY: A Confession, vow, testimony OF Belief IN God AND His Word...
EXPRESSLY...from the thoughts OF:
the Individuals..Hearts thoughts
* The Understanding IS EXPRESSLY..."NOT".
...NOT....a GROUP
...NOT....a PARTICULAR "RACE".
...NOT....a PARTICULAR "PEOPLE".
...NOT.....PARTICULAR "LAND" occupancy.
...NOT.....from an individuals MINDS thoughts
the Individuals...Hearts thoughts
...IS....expressly an INDIVIDUAL.
...IS....expressly a vow of AGREEMENT from the INDIVIDUALS...HEARTS thoughts.
...IS....expressly by the INDIVIDUALS...OWN WORD, declared.

*....THAT ^^^^ IS expressly...the Order and Way OFFERING of God, for ANY individual TO Freely Accept, Agree to, Declare...
OR freely choose to REJECT.

* ANY Individual WHO; freely accepts, agrees, delcares, ACCORDING TO Gods ORDER and WAY....Becomes ACCORDING TO Gods ORDER and WAY...Once and Forever...
WITH the Lord God Almighty....and the Lord God Almighty....Once and Forever WITH that individual.
* AND...the WAY THAT "seals" the "agreement", between One individual and the One Lord God Almighty.... IS: BY the BAPTISM of Gods Holy Spirit

* "John's prophetic revealing and introduction of Baptism OF WATER"...IS completely different, than the "Baptism OF Gods Holy Spirit".

There are, more Specifics about John's Baptism, Why, it's purpose, and it has "no relevance", to an individual WHO HAS accepted Gods Offering OF a Baptism of Gods Holy Spirit.

When one is water baptised you are welcomed into a family , as were the Jews one could say as the blueprint their of is as such ?

* Water Baptism, is a welcoming OF men, BY men..THROUGH...an "INDICATION" of a Heartfull "thought" that men CANNOT SEE,
Via a "WORD", men can HEAR, but such men KNOW NOT, for SURE, if that WORD, "IS"...
from the MIND...or the HEART.
(Only the individual and God KNOW for sure.)
* Water Baptism, "satisfies", the "EYES of men."
* Water Baptism: "is" a ritual, regularly performed..."with and without" an "individual's "Heartful" Confession of Belief in God, in Gods Word, in Gods Power, OR causing Gods Baptism of the Holy Spirit".
* Many, CLAIM...Water Baptism..."SAVED THEM"...and then later CLAIM...
...."they reject God"..."changed their MIND"
...."don't believe".
....Listen, pay attention... "changed their MIND"? That straight out IS NOTIFICATION, they DID NOT "Heartfully Confess"...thus, DID NOT "Receive Gods Baptism of Gods Holy Spirit.

THAT ^^ relates to the CONFUSION about, "WATER BAPTISM"...being taught, IS the means by which a man ALWAYS "receives" SALVATION.
Even In the Day, John Baptized with WATER, "that Water Baptism was NEVER the means or WAY, to "RECEIVE" Salvation...THEN...nor TODAY."

Salvation...was FIRST Offered the JEWS...
Salvation...thereafter was Offered the GENTILES.
Salvation...FIRST Offering...required the "stamina...Power of A MAN"...to KEEP his own Word..."called ENDURANCE"...to the end of his natural Life...to THEN be accounted...
WORTHY of SALVATION, and THEN SAVED by the POWER of GOD.

ONCE, SALVATION was "OFFERED to ALL" men...
THE Offering and "WAY", was revealed...
THAT..."THE POWER OF GOD...WOULD GIVE SALVATION, BEFORE a mans physical Death"...and "THE POWER OF GOD...WOULD KEEP the mans SALVATION secured Forever."

The term Christian...IS Confusing, to men calling themselves Christians...
and Particularly to men OUTSIDE of Christianity.
* One day a Christian, claiming to have BECOME SAVED, by the Baptism of the Holy Spirit....then the next day, CLAIMING they don't Believe and are UNSAVED, and essentially, "that God reneged on His Promise....or that God was too ignorant to KNOW, he gave Salvation to a man, that would Reject Him".
* My preference is NOT about the term "Christianity", but moreso precise..:
Converted IN Christ.
Born Again Christian.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Water baptism is a Christians duty to God to bring ones Child up as a Christian. That's what one is doing, entering them into the flock in the hope that they will be born again. if not well at least such a one has done their best.

Water baptism does not save a person, but it goes towards that direction. not to mention many a person does know that they were water baptised and that gave them strength at their lowest ebb, so it's more to it than one may think. Father John Corapi pointed out such once with a story about his life on drugs, that he was offered to end it all with a Jab with a mate and John remembered that he was baptised and that turned his life around to serve God and became a wonderful Priest for preaching the message of Jesus Christ as a strong no nonsense really devoted Preacher.

The most important thing in ones life is to be water baptised, because with that you truly have hope.


A mate of mine pushes as you say, the Saved line, that he is saved because he is born again, now when I investigate into what he is truly talking about, I find that the way he claims such is totally wrong !

He claims that he can save people himself by getting one to say words, that he says to you and then one says such back to him, and you are saved ?
Well that's how he got saved and he believes that's the way. well it's not at all, that's just like a water baptism of sorts given to people who are only bastards to God, like back in the Bible before Christianity was founded in Nations, but now we did have Nations that were Christian Nations in my time, not to mention that anyone outside of the family of Jesus Christ was a bastard to God.
Now I mean this word bastard in the sense of devoid of the family of God.

Now that the USA and Australia and the UK has become a Bastard Nations again, because they have clearly rejected Jesus Christ in fact, is another point, so in that the bastards who have no knowledge of who Jesus Christ is, because their Nation is a Bastard Nation and their parents are Bastards as to God, did not do as a Christian Nation did for their Children automatically.

So Bastards think from the angle that my mate is coming from, pre Christianity line ? not to mention this mate peddles the 2ed coming ? as tho Jesus Christ has not truly come in fact or that he is coming in the flesh the 2ed time ? and that for a fact means he is not truly born again, because he does not have a relationship with Christ Jesus in fact, and he is in fact of this world ranting like a mad man about mans works, what they are doing in the State called Israel, he is putting his whole into that filthy Whore. because he does not have Christ Jesus in his life.
People like him are like looking up a horses tail to see what's it's teeth look like.

 

[Davy]

I'm sorry, but I'm a little confused over all this.
I love my Master and Saviour, and find this a little strange what this person is talking about.
....

What it's about is the dangers that Judaizers can present to the body of Christ. Apostle Paul in his day had to contend with Pharisee converts to Christ who were commanding that Gentiles get flesh circumcised to be saved (see Galatians, and Acts 15). Those Pharisee converts to Christ were still following their old covenant culture, so they wanted the Gentiles to do the same.

This problem among the early Christians even became a problem between Apostle Paul and Apostle Peter. Per Galatians, Peter ate at table with Gentiles, but when Peter's brethren believing Jews came for a visit, Peter separated himself with them away from the Gentile Christians at table. Paul rebuked Peter for doing that.

What many brethren in Christ don't understand is that God ordained Judah to be keeper of His law, all the way up to Christ's future 2nd coming (see Genesis 49:10). So Jewish converts to Christ may still feel led to keep a lot of their people's culture, especially protecting and promoting God's laws, because Lord Jesus did not nail all... of God's laws to His cross. Apostle Paul indeed did show this in 1 Timothy 1, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, and in Galatians 5. Even the Christian doctrine that we are to love our neighbors as our self is from God's law back in Leviticus 19. So those who preach that all of God's laws are dead since Lord Jesus died on the cross are actually preaching lawlessness.

In 1 Timothy 1, Apostle Paul covered sins defined by God's law that we as Christians should not be doing. Some of those laws apply to civil law still today, like perjury, or murder, etc. God chose Judah to be keeper of those laws, as a lawgiver, even in the western Christian nations. It's the old covenant and old blood ordinances and religious ritual which Jesus nailed to His cross, not all of God's laws.

Thus the problem is the 2 extremes. One group wants us to keep all of God's law in order to be saved, which is against The New Covenant. Another group wants to throw away all of God's law and say that's per The New Covenant. Neither view is correct per God's Word.

Thus lawlessness, is about those who seek to live as their own god, the very temptation that the devil did upon Adam and Eve. That nature is about rebellion against The Father and The Son.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Water baptism is a Christians duty to God to bring ones Child up as a Christian. That's what one is doing, entering them into the flock in the hope that they will be born again. if not well at least such a one has done their best.

Water baptism does not save a person, but it goes towards that direction. not to mention many a person does know that they were water baptised and that gave them strength at their lowest ebb, so it's more to it than one may think. Father John Corapi pointed out such once with a story about his life on drugs, that he was offered to end it all with a Jab with a mate and John remembered that he was baptised and that turned his life around to serve God and became a wonderful Priest for preaching the message of Jesus Christ as a strong no nonsense really devoted Preacher.

The most important thing in ones life is to be water baptised, because with that you truly have hope.


A mate of mine pushes as you say, the Saved line, that he is saved because he is born again, now when I investigate into what he is truly talking about, I find that the way he claims such is totally wrong !

He claims that he can save people himself by getting one to say words, that he says to you and then one says such back to him, and you are saved ?
Well that's how he got saved and he believes that's the way. well it's not at all, that's just like a water baptism of sorts given to people who are only bastards to God, like back in the Bible before Christianity was founded in Nations, but now we did have Nations that were Christian Nations in my time, not to mention that anyone outside of the family of Jesus Christ was a bastard to God.
Now I mean this word bastard in the sense of devoid of the family of God.

Now that the USA and Australia and the UK has become a Bastard Nations again, because they have clearly rejected Jesus Christ in fact, is another point, so in that the bastards who have no knowledge of who Jesus Christ is, because their Nation is a Bastard Nation and their parents are Bastards as to God, did not do as a Christian Nation did for their Children automatically.

So Bastards think from the angle that my mate is coming from, pre Christianity line ? not to mention this mate peddles the 2ed coming ? as tho Jesus Christ has not truly come in fact or that he is coming in the flesh the 2ed time ? and that for a fact means he is not truly born again, because he does not have a relationship with Christ Jesus in fact, and he is in fact of this world ranting like a mad man about mans works, what they are doing in the State called Israel, he is putting his whole into that filthy Whore. because he does not have Christ Jesus in his life.
People like him are like looking up a horses tail to see what's it's teeth look like.

You tend to say a lot of things which aren't supported by scripture, so I'm just unable to take you very seriously. With regard to the second coming of Jesus Christ I recommend that you read and consider chapter 1 of the acts of the Apostles, giving special attention to verses 9 through 11.
Believe the scriptures.