Why do you feel it is so hard to be good?

[Ferris Bueller]

If you can't show your faith by what you do you do not have the faith that justifies all by itself apart from works. John says to not let anyone deceive you about this!


If the Bible say that—and of course it does—it HAS to be TRUE......A man can “show and prove his Faith” by doing this “work” even if he does nothing else.....he can do the “ work” of moving his lips to say “Jesus is Lord”.......”If you will confess WITH YOUR MOUTH that ‘ Jesus Is LORD” and Believe in your Heart that God raised Him from the Dead,You will be Saved” ....

Granted, my example is a very small “work” , BUT......it IS a Work......Moving my lips is something that I * DO*.......”With the Heart a man Believes and with his MOUTH , Confession is made unto Eternal Life” .....it all kinda ties together, doesn’t it?

John is talking about discerning fake believers in the congregation (and their fake doctrines). Every fake believer has a confession of faith! So that 'work' is not the work that identifies the real believer from the fake.

 

[ThePuffyBlob]

<<<and yes it's obviously easy to do evil or to sin than to do good or not to sin>>>

I’d say, for the true Christian, it should be easier to do good than to do evil.

Tong
R4386

you must be a christian i am not

 

[ThePuffyBlob]

<<<what you have to do is not to do good but to do the will of God>>>

Yes, to do the will of God as Jesus did. That is the life of the true Christian, at least that is my conviction.

Tong
R4387

i live in sin everyday though that's probably why no one can understand me God is punishing me cause he still loves me and he wants me to repent

 

[Ferris Bueller]

i live in sin everyday though that's probably why no one can understand me God is punishing me cause he still loves me and he wants me to repent

Are you struggling with sin, or are you willingly embracing it with open arms?

 

[Tong2020]

Because the Bible speaks in terms of works being the ultimate indicator of salvation.

"land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless, and its curse is imminent. In the end it will be burned." Hebrews 6:9
​

This is about lifestyle, over time, not a moment in time as most here seem to be understanding the matter of discerning where salvation dwells and where it does not.

My post was:

“Some do make the mistake of taking the matter of fruitfulness as to be an absolute indicator of the salvation of one.”

Not the same as what you are saying.

Tong
R4392

 

[Tong2020]

It means works confirm salvation, not earn it. A lifestyle of righteous works, not a moment or two in time.
I think(?) this was to provoke GB to discussion and was directed to him, not you, but it's okay if you want to jump in.

I only commented on that part, for it just caught my attention. No intending to jump in to your dialogue with GB.

And you answered my question here.

So works confirms one’s salvation, not earn it. That’s clear. Thanks.

Is that an absolute?

Tong
R4393

 

[Tong2020]

you must be a christian i am not

Why do you say that?

Tong
R4394

 

[Tong2020]

i live in sin everyday though that's probably why no one can understand me God is punishing me cause he still loves me and he wants me to repent

Why do you live in sin? Or perhaps what you mean is that you still fall into sin everyday?

God chastise His legitimate children. Yes, for He loves them.

Tong
R4395

 

[Ferris Bueller]

love is not a physical property

these things are expressed in word and deed, but they do not reside in physical actions.

See, the problem is Christians think just having warm fuzzy feelings for someone is what constitutes the obedience of Christian love. That's just not true. John sets us straight about that. So does Paul. Love is something you 'do', not just something you 'feel'. Sometimes love compels you to 'do' nothing, sometimes it compels you to 'do' something. Either way, the obedience of Christian love is expressed in behavior, not just words.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

It “ should happen”..... 99% of the time it WILL happen.....it just doesn’t HAVE to happen....a man’s behavior should improve if you let the Holy Spirit “hang around” long enough .

Ultimately, in the end it DOES have to have happened.

"...land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless, and its curse is imminent. In the end it will be burned." Hebrews 6:8​

a man’s behavior should improve if you let the Holy Spirit “hang around” long enough .

EXACTLY! ...if you let the Holy Spirit hang around.
That's why not being a changed person signifies unbelief. You didn't persevere in the faith for the change to occur or remain.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

You “ Practice Righteousness” when you Rest in Paul’s Gospel , given to him personally by Jesus....a “ child of Satan is not a Gospel Believer....You “can’t practice Righteousness” and be a Gospel Rejector...

I see your theological sleight of hand. Hyper Grace deceives people into thinking that trusting in Christ is the only thing a Christian has to be obedient to to be considered a saved person. This is exactly the deceit that James addresses in his letter. Faith that is alone is not saving faith. The faith that justifies all by itself apart from works is the faith that gets expressed in the obedience to love others (Galatians 5:6). Ultimately, if your faith does not do that, you don't have the faith that justifies all by itself apart from works. You just think you do.

 

[marks]

Over 700 posts to keep insisting our salvation may not really save . . .

 

[marks]

I see your theological sleight of hand.

And you see yours, I'm certain of it.

 

[Gospel Believer]

Too bad for the rest of us.

How “ clever” of you......can you elaborate on why this is “ too bad” or do you just like to make pithy remarks

 

[Gospel Believer]

<<<what you have to do is not to do good but to do the will of God>>>

Yes, to do the will of God as Jesus did. That is the life of the true Christian, at least that is my conviction.

Tong
R4387

The “ Will Of The Father” was made clear by Jesus....it is to “ Believe in the One that He sent”

 

[Gospel Believer]

I'm not saying a person is saved by good deeds. I'm saying the changed/ changing life is the evidence of salvation. Because that's what the Bible says. Hyper Grace theology says that is not true.

Another Lie.....but fortunately for you.....the “ Hyper Grace” you mock will cover it....

 

[marks]

Hyper Grace deceives people into thinking that trusting in Christ is the only thing a Christian has to be obedient to to be considered a saved person.

You then deny salvation by grace through faith.

What obedience do you have to do to be saved? Being born again is something you buy with your wonderful obedience?

OH! You said, to be "considered" a saved person. "Considered" by whom? You? Right. There's a true judge! Not.

Considered by God? He knows who His children are. He gave them birth. Of course He knows them!

Considered by yourself? His spirit testifies with our spirits that we are children of God. Not "our opinions of our perceptions of ourselves". The just shall live by faith. Our walk is by faith and not by sight.

So what are you really saying here? Considered saved?

Considered by whom?

And why this qualification? Why do you need to speak of those "considered" saved? There's a red flag!

Much love!

 

[Gospel Believer]

Think of obedience more in terms of the fruit of the Spirit. The metric of the presence of saving faith is the presence of the fruit of the Spirit. If you remember that you won't be locked into a outward works only kind of mentality. Though, surely, the fruit of the Spirit is seen in what you do. It has to. But don't get bogged down into only thinking about obedience from a 'help the poor' kind of way. Restraining a spirit of rage is every bit a matter of obedience to God as giving a sandwich to a hungry person is.

This is what I have said all along.....Many of the “Fruits” that the self- Righteous “ Fruit Inspector” is looking for are inside of a man—— peace , Joy, Self- control ,patience ,faithfulness ,gentleness, etc.....they ant be seen and they can’t be measured....most Fruit Inspectors need to just shut up and mind their own business 99% Of the time......

 

[Tong2020]

See, the problem is Christians think just having warm fuzzy feelings for someone is what constitutes the obedience of Christian love. That's just not true. John sets us straight about that. So does Paul. Love is something you 'do', not just something you 'feel'. Sometimes love compels you to 'do' nothing, sometimes it compels you to 'do' something. Either way, the obedience of Christian love is expressed in behavior, not just words.

For me, love (agape) is something the Christian received from God. It is something that one have and not something one does. And love is of the Spirit and is spiritual. It is expressed by one who have it in many ways through words and actions/gestures, and is demonstrated in deeds. What better definition of love is there than is found in this ~ God is love? Also, let me quote what Paul says of love that is more easy to understand:

1 Cor.13:4 Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up; 5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; 6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; 7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

But there is a quality of love, that I guess not many put much notice and importance to. And because of that, many fails to really know and appreciate what love is. Though I think many here knows this quality.

Tong
R4396

 

[Gospel Believer]

It is the ultimate indicator of salvation.
Ultimately, it is the kind of fruit growing on a tree that determines what kind of tree it is.

The Ultimate Indicator of Salvation is this—- are you RESTING in the Gospel Of Grace or do you feel a need to ADD to it with something that YOU do ? God compares this Refusal to Rest to the “ Disobedience and Unbelief “ displayed by the ancient Hebrews that doubted God and could not enter the Rest to be found in the Land Of Milk and Honey.....” Believers “ are being tested everyday and do not even know it....Do you Rest in the Gospel as preached by Paul Plus NOTHING or do you Add such “ear ticklers” as having the “ Luck” to Repent Of ALL Willful Suns before you die? If you do,Gid says that you are “ Disobedient and guilty of Unbelief”......serious stuff, agreed?

“ Willful Sins?” .....no doubt about it.....they are not good....As any parent would a child—-they would administer much more severe Chastisement for a Willful Sin than they would an ordinary sin.....God does the same thing—— he will REALLY blister your behind , but He wont damn you for it.....some will make it to Heaven by the skin of their teeth “ like a man barely escaping a fire” is how the Bible puts it.....