Open Bible discussion questions and answers.

Nancy said:

I've come to think of taking God's Name in vain to mean someone who claims the Name of Christ/God yet lives in sin all the time.

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Many think that. Its origin was tied to bearing false witness, a prohibition against perjury. This explains why Proverbs teaches that God hates lying, generally and false witness, particularly (they are not the same thing as perjury swears ‘so help me God’ what you are about to say is true).

Proverbs 6:16-19
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16 There are six things the Lord hates,
seven that are detestable to him:
17 haughty eyes,
a lying tongue,
hands that shed innocent blood,
18 a heart that devises wicked schemes,
feet that are quick to rush into evil,
19 a false witness who pours out lies
and a person who stirs up conflict in the community.

trying to find god said:

I have been thinking lately, and I would like to put it out there and see what other people think. I am new to reading the Bible, having done so for maybe two years or so. When it comes to the Ten Commandments, I have been stuck on the phrase about not taking the Lord's name in vain. Whenever I hear someone referring to this, it’s usually God followed by other choice words. However, He says He is the one true God, and no other god is to come before Him or be equal to Him.
When reading that, I think of "God" as a title. The only time I have seen that God gives His name in the Bible was to Moses. When giving His name, He said, "I AM." So I'm wondering if maybe in the commandment He may have been talking about how we talk about ourselves—kind of like when people say, "I am dumb" or something along those lines.
I don’t know; maybe I'm way off base here, but I thought it would be worth seeing what others think. Feel free to share your thoughts or ask for further clarification!

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Welcome!

The "You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain" commandment is mostly and wrongly assumed to mean, "Don't curse" (or else)! But that is not it at all. On the contrary, He means we are not to refer to Him as if He were "vain" or unreal--because He is the only real God. In other words, don't take up His name, if you don't believe He even exists.

The commandments are for those who are God's people, as instruction on how to properly represent Him. Thus, we especially are not to act or speak as if God is not real, but rather as though He is, as a witness and a testimony to any and all who do not know of Him.

trying to find god said:

The only time I have seen that God gives His name in the Bible was to Moses. When giving His name, He said, "I AM."

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“I am” is not only not an accurate English translation of (I am what I am or I will be what I will) which is closer to “eternal” as the VOICE renders it, it is not what he said is name is. Eternal is Jesus’ God’s unique attribute. The divine name, he provided in the very next verse.
Exodus 3:15
God also said to Moses, “Say this to the children of Israel: ‘Yahweh, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.’ This is my name forever, and this is how I am to be remembered for generation after generation.

Notice the use of the word name?

It plainly means do not use God as a cuss word. No matter what name you use, God knows the intent.

trying to find god said:

I have been thinking lately, and I would like to put it out there and see what other people think. I am new to reading the Bible, having done so for maybe two years or so. When it comes to the Ten Commandments, I have been stuck on the phrase about not taking the Lord's name in vain. Whenever I hear someone referring to this, it’s usually God followed by other choice words. However, He says He is the one true God, and no other god is to come before Him or be equal to Him.
When reading that, I think of "God" as a title. The only time I have seen that God gives His name in the Bible was to Moses. When giving His name, He said, "I AM." So I'm wondering if maybe in the commandment He may have been talking about how we talk about ourselves—kind of like when people say, "I am dumb" or something along those lines.
I don’t know; maybe I'm way off base here, but I thought it would be worth seeing what others think. Feel free to share your thoughts or ask for further clarification!

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Hi and welcome…

We can understand that the sanctity of Gods name was attached to his sovereignty……his right as Creator to dictate the terms of life. In the beginning, the terms were very simple…..obey God and live a happy peaceful life free from the knowledge of evil…..or die, knowing it and practicing it.

Sin required God to add many laws because a knowledge of evil was now present with all mankind descended from Adam. There were laws about many things and the first of the Ten Commandments was not to have any other gods but Yahweh/Jehovah. (Exodus 20:3)

God’s name was also his reputation…a guarantee that all who respected God’s name would in turn be respected by him. The Israelites freed from slavery in Egypt were told the divine name in Exodus 3:13-15 by Moses after hundreds of years in slavery, yet they kept separate all that time from the proud Egyptians.

We are in no doubt about the existence of God‘s divine name as he is the sole possessor of it. (Psalm 83:18) Jehovah is “the Most High over all the earth”…..there is no one who is his equal. He alone is “God”. (Deut 6:4) But there seems to be dispute over what his name actually means. As you mentioned many believe that “I AM” is the meaning of God’s name, but reading Exodus 3:13-15 in the Jewish Tanakh, we see an alternative rendering that actually makes more sense in context.

Exodus 3:13-15 chabad.org

God’s people as descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob knew who their God was, but in this instance Jehovah was telling his people, about to be liberated after centuries of slavery, that their God’s name would have an added dimension…..he was not telling them that he existed, because they already knew that…..he was telling then what he would “BE” or “BECOME” to his people, one who would show them and the Egyptians his power over their useless gods.

The name “Jehovah” (Yahweh) is the causative form of the third person singular of the verb “to be” and literally means “He causes to be.” He “causes to be” according to his purpose. It was very appropriate for the name to be stressed to Moses on this occasion, for Jehovah was beginning to cause his purpose concerning his people in Egypt, to be accomplished. And this was four hundred and thirty years before he had promised Abraham that he would make of him a great nation. (Gen 12:2)

So Jehovah’s name was to be held in high esteem as it carried all that Jehovah was, and would become, to his people.

In the Lord’s Prayer, what was the first thing Jesus taught us to pray for….? “Hallowed be thy name”…..but when Jesus walked the earth, God’s name had not been mentioned among his people for a very long time….so long in fact that it’s pronunciation was lost. This was a failure to uphold Gods instructions to Israel through Moses…..”This is My name forever, and this is how I should be mentioned in every generation.”

God’s precious name was not mentioned at all, but substituted with a title “Lord” or “God”…..
You can see in the Hebrew that the divine name is there, but in the English translation, it is substituted with his title. A title is not a name, and God’s name is associated with his Sovereignty…..and his word….once you start messing with God’s name, trouble is sure to follow….as the Jewish nation found out.

I have read that one of the reasons why the Jews stopped uttering the divine name was because the people were making frivolous oaths in God’s name and then not keeping that oath…associating God’s name with falsehood and misrepresentation. Instead of punishing the offenders, the religious leaders simply made a law that stated that God’s name was unutterable (a lie of course) not because it was too sacred, but because it was easier to do that, than to punish the offenders. So taking God’s name in a worthless oath was taking it in vain, bringing reproach on God’s name and reputation as something of no account.

God is always true to his word…..but the faithless Jews were not.

Jesus said he had “come to make his Father’s name known”…and he did as he went about teaching everyone who would listen about the wonderful God and Father he served.

trying to find god said:

not taking the Lord's name in vain.

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Listen to how people around you talk. People are saying ' OMG! ' Oh God etc etc etc
They have no interest in worshipping that device being g they so casually call on.

Turn it around, if every time your colleagues made a mistake, we're surprised or annoyed they call out your name. How would you feel by the end of the day?
How do you think God feels about this abuse of him?

Wrangler said:

Many think that. Its origin was tied to bearing false witness, a prohibition against perjury. This explains why Proverbs teaches that God hates lying, generally and false witness, particularly (they are not the same thing as perjury swears ‘so help me God’ what you are about to say is true).

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OK, so this brings up a huge matter of discernment regarding truth telling. There are 3 categories:

1. Court testimony: To tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth - so help you God.
   • No false witness
   • No taking LORD's name in vain
2. Lying by Commission
3. Grace, (aka Lying by Omission or "White" Lies)

Many Pastors preach on the balance between truth and grace. "Grace" here is used to mean lie by omission. One must confess that the revealed word of God is a series of overcoming lying by omission, where we still do not have the whole story. To wit:
Revelation 3:12
12 All who are victorious will become pillars in the Temple of my God, and they will never have to leave it. And I will write on them the name of my God, and they will be citizens in the city of my God—the new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven from my God. And I will also write on them my new name.

The new name of Jesus of Nazareth has not been revealed. Hiding this is something short of court testimony standards of truth telling. So, we have to come to terms with why lie, why does even God not reveal everything? The basic reason to lie is to circumvent the fact that the truth is not always helpful.

Putting aside, "helpful" to whom and for what for a moment, we must humbly accept the limitations of the benefit of the truth. Both the truth and a lie serves a purpose. This purpose may be deemed good or bad. So, while the truth is absolute, the purpose it serves is contextual, relative and moral. Generally, lies are condemned when it is for the liars own benefit but lies are approved when it is for the benefit of someone else. Let's explore some examples.

Ex 1. My daughter struggling

As a parent, I told my daughters they did a task or reacted to a situation such that I approve of it. (The truth is they did NOT do the task well or they did not react to a situation as well as they could have). Their psychology, their confidence in themselves becomes more important than the truth about certain details along the way toward adulthood. (Perhaps this is why God still has not fully revealed all truth to us? We cannot yet handle it.)

Ex 2. Does this dress make me look fat?

Ladies have to admit you would not be in awe of your man's truth telling if he replied, "No, it is your fat that makes you look fat." Here, white lies are generally invoked and universally not condemned.

Ex 3. Prisons filled with innocent men

Almost no one in prison admits they did anything wrong. Many even say they plead guilty because their lawyer told them to, not because they actually did anything wrong. This lie is done to avoid responsibility and consequences. I've said for years that most people do not primarily lie to you; they primarily lie to themselves.

Two Biblical examples of acceptable lying are the midwives lied to Pharaoh about Hebrew women giving birth too quickly to kill the infant and Rahab misdirecting threats to Joshua's men. Blessing followed both because they lied. (Many Christians come up with convoluted explanations for these blessings if lies are always something God hates.)

Windmill Charge said:

Listen to how people around you talk. People are saying ' OMG! ' Oh God etc etc etc
They have no interest in worshipping that device being g they so casually call on.

Turn it around, if every time your colleagues made a mistake, we're surprised or annoyed they call out your name. How would you feel by the end of the day?
How do you think God feels about this abuse of him?

Windmill Charge said:

Listen to how people around you talk. People are saying ' OMG! ' Oh God etc etc etc
They have no interest in worshipping that device being g they so casually call on.

Turn it around, if every time your colleagues made a mistake, we're surprised or annoyed they call out your name. How would you feel by the end of the day?
How do you think God feels about this abuse of him?

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Just saying WC, if one worships the wrong, one true God of the Bible, then what does it matter whether one uses this god's name in vain?

I have been stuck on the phrase about not taking the Lord's name in vain. Whenever I hear someone referring to this, it’s usually God followed by other choice words. However, He says He is the one true God, and no other god is to come before Him or be equal to Him.

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If you're gonna use the Lord's name, it better be for his purposes and not for your own. IOW, it is the height of vanity to appropriate God's authority to further anything that is not of God - and thus such is a sin.

When reading that, I think of "God" as a title. The only time I have seen that God gives His name in the Bible was to Moses. When giving His name, He said, "I AM."

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Notice that both the noun ("I") and the verb ("AM") are in ALL CAPITALS upper case. This is what is known as a legal fiction. It is outside the bounds of proper English grammar. The translators did it that way because no one can name the name of God. Naming is an act of authority. For example, your offspring didn't name you; you named them. All the folks who involve themselves in the game of trying to figure out the "true name of God" are wasting their time, as they are not qualified to apply such a name if even if there was one. For that reason, the honest translators knew this and appropriately capitalized the phrase "I AM." FWIW, you will find other instances in the Holy Bible where all capitals are used, and for the same reason.

I will post a couple of scriptures , with just a short comment at the end...

“And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth. ”
Exodus 9:16 KJV

“And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the LORD before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy. ”
Exodus 33:19 KJV
Unfeigned Bible

“6 And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, 7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation. ”
Exodus 34:6-7 KJV
Unfeigned Bible

The bolded and italicised part above is the full name. It reflects God's character. Taking the Lord's name in vain is as others have previously mentioned, claiming the Christian faith as one's own, but living contrary to His character, or teaching doctrine contrary to His character... such as eternal torment.

Vanity is to make yourself greater than God. Someone who takes God's name in vain seeks recognition. Unfortunately, it is God who recognizes mankind as a whole as condemned. Thus, the cross. Using God's name to elevate ones self is like saying "look at me, I don't need God, He's just a word I throw around. Apart from God we're just dust, or in our generation...Toast! Practice giving God all the Glory, and don't grieve the Holy Spirit. Waring with the Holy Spirit is futile, did I mention vain?

APAK said:

Just saying WC, if one worships the wrong, one true God of the Bible, then what does it matter whether one uses this god's name in vain?

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There is only one God, the tribune God of God the Father, God ihe Son and God the Holy Spirit.
Yes there are false gods both in the bible and in the world.

This is basic reasoning something canotbe and not be at the same time example.
The light in your room is on. It cannot be both on and off at the same time. Or
If you run a race there is only one winner. Everyone else in the race has lost.

In the same way there is only one true God, there might be pretenders deceiving worshippers but only one God is true.

Windmill Charge said:

If you run a race there is only one winner. Everyone else in the race has lost.

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In the context of the way Paul uses racing as a metaphor, all who complete the race is a winner.

Brakelite said:

In the context of the way Paul uses racing as a metaphor, all who complete the race is a winner.

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No so 1 cor9:24 Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize. 25 Everyone who competes in the games goes into strict training. They do it to get a crown that will not last, but we do it to get a crown that will last forever. 26 Therefore I do not run like someone running aimlessly; I do not fight like a boxer beating the air. 27 No, I strike a blow to my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.

Only one wi s the prize.

Windmill Charge said:

There is only one God, the tribune God of God the Father, God ihe Son and God the Holy Spirit.
Yes there are false gods both in the bible and in the world.

This is basic reasoning something canotbe and not be at the same time example.
The light in your room is on. It cannot be both on and off at the same time. Or
If you run a race there is only one winner. Everyone else in the race has lost.

In the same way there is only one true God, there might be pretenders deceiving worshippers but only one God is true.

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So you did agree with my post then?

Windmill Charge said:

There is only one God, the tribune God of God the Father, God ihe Son and God the Holy Spirit.

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That’s 3 gods, not one. What Bible verse says there are these 3 Gods in one?

Wrangler said:

That’s 3 gods, not one. What Bible verse says there are these 3 Gods in one?

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The bible clearly teaches that there is God, there is the Spirit and that there is the Son.
If it doesn't why does Jesus instruct us in Matt28:Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

The word trinity is not I the bible, but it clearly teaches it.