Please explain this.

[bbyrd009]

When you say "your whole world", do you mean "the whole world?" Like, do you mean say...the literal sun is a figment of my imagination?

i'm saying we define these by our perceptions and then become blind to any other definitions, when we know for a fact that we cannot even see almost 95% of what is directly in our faces, and our definitions are laughable at best.

 

[GodsGrace]

@farouk

see my post no. 744 for the questions.
Thanks.

 

[GodsGrace]

Did you forget that Jesus said that He NEVER knew them? Matthew 7:23--->"Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'" (emphasis mine)

But you forget WHY He never knew them.
Most people think because they weren't saved.

Where in that whole chapter does it speak about being saved?
NOWHERE!

Jesus said WHY He told them to depart from Him
"I NEVER KNEW YOU, DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS."

Practicing lawlessness means not practicing the law.
You have to read the N.T. and especially the words of Jesus with a clear mind and NOT with preconceived ideas.

Those who practice lawlessness will not enter into heaven.

 

[bbyrd009]

Not about the white man.
Maybe I've been gone too long.
But KILL 'EM WITH KINDNESS....yes.
But I could always tell when it's fake.
And I'm naturally kind...sometimes!
LOL

ha, well, any diff is pretty easy to detect, huh? Up,to a point tho, bc when i am genuinely interested in selling you something that you are already interested in, and if i am not a complete idiot, i will be attentive to any concerns, etc, and forthright about any drawbacks to any every choice, etc, blahblahblah, but the motive has changed from that of someone interested in finding truth.

Iow how susceptible am i as a buyer of "you might go up to heaven after you have died (as long as you are willing to dig a pit for others to fall into)." Bc that is the bargain, dont be deceived imo; he who seeks to save his soul will lose it cant get much plainer than that lol

 

[stunnedbygrace]

well, fwiw a better way to put that might be that i was just realizing the possibility right then, and i really shouldnt ascribe that as def being from God i guess

I was just showing that even you do what you say shouldn't be done. I don't agree with you that we can never know God is teaching us something, but I think its wise to realize it's not all there is to be learned.

I was only making the point of your saying we should never do such and such but then showing that you yourself do it. That's all. :)

 

[Grailhunter]

God is ALWAYS changing me through His Holy Spirit. But He will not change those who feel that they have no reason to change. Jesus wept over Jerusalem because they would not come to Him.

You might be surprised that God don't give up on people that easy. And a change of heart can be just a round the corner. The Apostles even had to deal this. The Jewish way was chiseled into their hearts. If we believe one way for a long time it can produce confidence, but it can also be a trap for a closed mind. As we get older we want things to be a certain way and we don't like change....don't give up on each other, I don't think God has.

 

[bbyrd009]

Not about the white man.

ha, so funny lol

 

[bbyrd009]

I was just showing that even you do what you say shouldn't be done. I don't agree with you that we can never know God is teaching us something, but I think its wise to realize it's not all there is to be learned.

I was only making the point of your saying we should never do such and such but then showing that you yourself do it. That's all. :)

yeh, shorthand is an obstacle too.

But i also gotta say there is a diff in suspecting something might be true and holding it as what we call a "belief" now, yeh?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

i'm saying we define these by our perceptions and then become blind to any other definitions, when we know for a fact that we cannot even see almost 95% of what is directly in our faces, and our definitions are laughable at best.

Well, the physical world does exist. The sun is the sun and all men see the sun (or at least feel it.)

But if you are trying to say the sun speaks of the Son, for instance, then yeah, a lot of people don't see that. They don't see any spiritual things hidden from the eyes we were born with. And we see some spiritual things. Some we haven't seen yet though.

 

[GodsGrace]

But, if you recall, I told you that I wasn't insulted--that I'd have to care what you said about me to be insulted and I don't.

You've done it again.
If you don't care what I say to you....it means you have NO VALUE for my comments. This is an insult.

why do you write to me then?

No, it was just true to the way I see you. Blunt perhaps, but it was meant kindly. I also said that we are ALL ignorant. Lauding one's "credentials" (as a "Bible teacher" and as one who "teaches new Christians") may impress the world, but do you really think God is impressed with your knowledge?

Are you upset because you think I'm boasting?
If someone states something true...it's not boasting..it's just stating something.
I NEVER said I was a bible teacher,,AND YOU'RE REPEATING IT AGAIN, after I've already told you once I never said this.

Yes. I have taught new Christians.
You're not impressed? Gee. How will I ever sleep tonight?
And you ask if God is impressed?

Do you realize, like many here that don't, that speaking words from the bible is SERIOUS BUSINESS. James 3:1
I had to be very careful of each word I said.
I had to be sure I was NOT teaching incorrect doctrine or heresy.
Did you know that here's no real way to teach the Trinity?
Any way you try to teach it will end up in heresy.
What heresy you may ask? That would make a nice study.
There's more than one.

And it's not very nice to call a person IGNORANT.

I can only "know" you by what you say about yourself and what you say to others.
Why is that "demeaning"? I tell myself to go and study the Bible every day of my life. Do you really think that anyone thinks that anyone here has "all knowledge"?

How can you know me by what I say here, if you think I'm boasting at times?
Am I supposed to censor myself for YOUR benefit?
You can tell youself to go study the bible,,,but you can't tell me that.
You don't know if I've ever studied it or not and for how long and to what degree.
I've told persons to study up on something they seem to know nothing about...but not to person who seem to have a doctrine under their belt.
It's DEMEANING to reply to me that I should study the bible,,, exactly because you don't know me.

And I don't have all knowledge and I've said this. I know very little about eschatology...but what I know, I know.

LOLOLOL Sorry if my laughter offends you--but I am genuinely amused by that remark. I don't think you understand what a hypocrite is. (By the way, you haven't "met" me.)

AGAIN! Another insult.
You think I don't know what a hypocrite is?
Does it seem to you that I don't speak correct English?
You just can't stop.

Sadly, that statement from you just confirms what I thought about you from the beginning of our "encounters". I am here to learn and you should be too. It's a pity, really--since you "teach Bible study" and all.

WHERE did I say I teach bible study?

It's really difficult to speak to you.

Have I given you any reason to assume that I do not obey Him? You really do sound like an angry parent or school teacher with your last remark--sorry to say. It sounds like the angry parent who takes a paddle to the backside of their five-year-old and yells, "I'll teach YOU that it is wrong to hit your brother!!"

How should I know if you listen and obey God.
You say it's not necessary...and, like you said, I can only go by what you say.
If I say ONE MUST OBEY GOD.
And you don't agree....what should anyone assume?
If you think we DO have to obey God,,,why are you debating me?

You end with another insult.
And, BTW, it's too late to paddle a kid when he's five.

1. Paddles don't work.
2. By the age of five the character is already formed.

As I've requested...IF you post to me,,,it should be about scripture...
NOT personal remarks...
AS THIS ENTIRE POST WAS.

 

[GodsGrace]

Did you forget that NO ONE is righteous ("no, not one") except those who have been made righteous by the indwelling Holy Spirit and certainly not of ourselves? God sends the rain on the just and the unjust--He really is kind to all. Those who "remain in His kindness" are those who are under grace and will forever be entirely grateful for His specific kindness of the astounding act of pouring Himself out in a
saving act of grace and love.

In Luke 31-32 (also Mark 2:17) Jesus also observed, “Healthy people don’t need a doctor—sick people do. I have come to call not those who think they are righteous, but those who know they are sinners and need to repent. " (emphasis mine). Peace.

NO NO.
You must go to my post no. 744 and exegete those verses I've given you and farouk.

He can't answer apparently.
Can you?

I don't like to play verse ping pong.

AFTER you've done that,,,
I'll reply to the above..
WITH NO PROBLEM-.

 

[GodsGrace]

Hebrews 6:4-8
"For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned."

Who is it that was "once enlightened"? The unsaved? No. This scripture clearly shows that one CAN walk away from Jesus. The work He began in us is completed IF we finish the race set before us.
"...and then have fallen away..." Fallen away from what?

John 15:10
"If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commands and remain in his love."

I don't want to bombard you with scripture verses as, there are so many cross references to these verses but...we might have to agree to disagree brother. ♥

AMEN sister!

 

[Lady Crosstalk]

But you forget WHY He never knew them.
Most people think because they weren't saved.

They obviously weren't saved. I have seen many "Christians" who were baptized (which does NOT save anyone) and raised in the church who fell into sexual sin and drunkenness (drugs and alcohol). Doesn't mean that they can't ultimately be saved but they are not saved currently. I fear for them, should they die in their sins. Believing that they are saved is just wishful thinking.

Where in that whole chapter does it speak about being saved?
NOWHERE!

No, but it is certainly implied (see verse 7:21) by the context of entering the Kingdom of Heaven--wouldn't you agree? If you recall, I was the one who said they are not saved--even though they protest His Final Judgment by citing their acts done "for Him". It is quite tragic that they believe they are saved.

Jesus said WHY He told them to depart from Him
"I NEVER KNEW YOU, DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS."

Okay--why would I have a problem with that? Even the most devout Christian practices lawlessness all the time. I would wager that you are lawless as well--unless you practice the entire Law of Moses (which is actually impossible today without the sacrificial system being in place).

Practicing lawlessness means not practicing the law.

Okay--by that standard, all Christians would be condemned since we do not practice the Law of Moses.

You have to read the N.T. and especially the words of Jesus with a clear mind and NOT with preconceived ideas.

Why would you think that I do otherwise? Because I disagree with you? How do you know that it is not your own preconceived ideas that are the problem?

Those who practice lawlessness will not enter into heaven.

Well, I guess that leaves you out since you cannot possibly fulfill the demands of the Law of Moses. On the other hand, Jesus fulfilled the entirety of the Law for everyone who truly believes in Him.

 

[GodsGrace]

Who can we be more than a student of Christianity? Who knows the mind of God? You two are good people. Change your course. Your differences are not that different and not un-reconcilable. Christ knelt in the garden and asked His Father, basically, is there any other way? There is another way for you two.

Who can we be more than a student of Christianity? Who knows the mind of God? You two are good people. Change your course. Your differences are not that different and not un-reconcilable. Christ knelt in the garden and asked His Father, basically, is there any other way? There is another way for you two.

See post 830.
GOOD NIGHT!

 

[bbyrd009]

What makes you think Abba is saying anything to you?

so, a redux here, i realize that there are now two points going on, and maybe the second one is more important than the first even satan appears as an angel of light bright right oh knight?

What did, you go out, into the wilderness, to see, sbg
well first you gotta id the wilderness right cuz your only visit to a desert was as a tourist maybe, in a car. what is or um was the wilderness, bc it morphed too i guess. Wilderness is a spiritual place, by which i mean a literal place that any one of us may encounter in a typical day, very mundane even. everything we do is spiritual, yeh?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

yeh, shorthand is an obstacle too.

But i also gotta say there is a diff in suspecting something might be true and holding it as what we call a "belief" now, yeh?

Well...like, you mean, for instance, we can only suspect that Jesus died to give us a way back to God, but we can't know for sure? Or...we can suspect that the things Jesus said and did might be true, but we can't know for sure or even know for sure that He wasn't just made up?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

so, a redux here, i realize that there are now two points going on, and maybe the second one is more important than the first even satan appears as an angel of light bright right oh knight?

What did, you go out, into the wilderness, to see, sbg

I went out into the wilderness to die.

 

[bbyrd009]

when one of our number is not present, and especially when the absence is remarked upon i guess, we have the habit of sharing a story about some thing they did that they did not call attention to and no one else likely noticed, that indicated their improved perception. Faith comes by hearing, right, and you cant hear when your saying. when ppl have to pry words out of you they will be asking you to talk all the time lol, we are so weird. want something? anything, doesnt matter what. then turn around, 180, and start walking the other way ha

 

[Nancy]

ha, so funny lol

 

[bbyrd009]

Well...like, you mean, for instance, we can only suspect that Jesus died to give us a way back to God, but we can't know for sure?

ah, no, Christ died for my sin, and just like the prophets earlier, who are you btw, you should be able to refer these to actual events in your life, i was the lying prophet in this situation, i was the unobservant prophet in that one, Christ i killed when i founded the world, and i actually even barely remember a memory of a memory of that now, but you can too, the day you first looked in a mirror...differently, that unresolved blob that you literally could not see before suddenly resolved and your world...founded. You ate from the tree of knowledge basically, that day or very soon after. goes the theory. that i just made up, ok lol
wanna google it and see? its in there, everything is in there, things you will never have the vocabulary to even request a look at, how trippy is that? you can search snips of that up there and enter a whole new world. might have to rephrase them i guess. there's some scientific term youll stumbleupon, "cortical recall of the pre-self-consciousness threshold" or something like that, but i just made most of that up, also i recall some pop search getting in the way, something about babies, hard to filter out.

"it's all in your head" in an extremely fundamental way, but getting there! ha!