Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it holy

[mjrhealth]

I know of no translation that says, "14 by having blotted the law-handwriting which was against us ..." The KJV certainly does not say that.


I am not an SDA, nor do I exalt tradition over the commandments.

Exo_31:15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.

I dont see you putting asnyope to death, it is after all a "commandment".

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

You think it is a tall story because you totally misunderstand that there is an evening before the sun sets. Also, one does not need to become a Christian to be saved. We are saved by grace through faith in Messiah Yeshua.

MJs have their salvation based on the soteriological fallacy of their idea that there is an 'evening before the sun sets' seen in the Old Testament, NO ONE denies, but which is not from the Greek word or phrase using the Greek word 'heh opsia' in the New Testament. NEVER!

And do not think I cannot see the innuendo Christians do not become saved, but if you believe MJ, you do. Thanks.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I totally agree the translation into understandable English is, "And now when the even was come." Why, then, did you direct me to the erroneous NIV which says, "So as evening approached"? When I wrote, "And now evening come", I was only giving a one word translation of each Greek word.

You do not give 'a one word translation of each Greek word'. You cannot. No one can. You gave no translation at all of the Aorist Participle which to be translated into English is impossible to do with a single English word and you know it.

I did not 'direct' you to the NIV. I proposed you compare it with the KJV "and see the difference" I think my words were.
What you did write, 'evening' according to you 'evening before sunset', 'come' - Present Participle, is the identical time of daylight before sunset which the NIV implies with 'evening approached'. You are not able to now all of a sudden call the NIV 'erroneous'; the NIV attaches the correct meaning of the word "evening" to it. You don't; now you're trying to save face for your blunder, your Present Participle, but you only get more and more egg on it.

 

[mjrhealth]

I know of no translation that says, "14 by having blotted the law-handwriting which was against us ..." The KJV certainly does not say that.

Did I miss something.

Col_2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Remembering that was to the Israelits not the gentiles who had no such ordinances

Could also add this

Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Rom 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

So even the Jews who choose Christ, are no longer under any laws. men just choose them to prove themselves.

Luk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luk 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luk 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

GE:
But suppose it's 'late afternoon'. What hour is 'late afternoon'? Any hour from NOON! So when was the burial according to the Catholics and you FINISHED? BY 'late afternoon' on the very day that Jesus died "the ninth hour", 2 to 3 hours after 'late afternoon'.

Correct. That would be the afternoon of Abib 14 before the sun set beginning the 15th.

You at first said that would be 'the afternoon' at 'late afternoon'. Now you say 'before the sun set beginning the 15th' framing your words to actually say 'evening before the sun set the 15th beginning' at the same time 'the afternoon' at 'late afternoon'.
Whichever way you twist words or their meanings, you say Joseph had closed Jesus' grave before or at least simultaneous with the hour of daylight that He died.
In other words, Joseph closed Jesus' grave in no time or quicker than in no time; according to you.

And you think you can sell your product? Who do you think is going to buy it?

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

The Jews ate the Passover on the night of Abib 15.

Yes, except That Night because it was the last ever Passover of Yahweh and Jesus was Our Passover Lamb of God sacrificed the day before That Night.
Anyway, yes! But tell us, Did Joseph and Nicodemus eat or would they have eaten after they buried Jesus' body? Tell me just that, please! Or do all four Gospels record they buried Him, LONG, AFTER they had eaten (or normally would have eaten)!

HOW DO YOU WANT TO DENY THESE FACTS?

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

?? John 19:38-42 takes place between 3:00 and sunset on the preparation day.

That is what you say. But the parallel Gospel texts are Mark 15:42 Matthew 27:57 John 19:31,38 Luke 23:50 all saying and implying
"Since / Because
after had started the Preparation which is the Fore-Sabbath
(Friday at Thursday night after sunset),
after having been evening already..." and
after "At That First Night" of ulb, and
"AFTER these things ... the Jews had asked Pilate" for, "Joseph came", and
after Joseph had negotiated for the body,
"there also came to him Nicodemus bringing spices..."
And so only BEGAN they to "prepare the body ... according to the custom of the Jews to bury".
But you tell us this and much more until the grave was closed was done by 'late afternoon ... before sunset evening'... come on now...

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Where do you find, "At the first night"?

In John 19, after 31-38, in verse 39a before 39b-42. Consult Nestle Aland. KJV contains a perversion, the word, 'Jesus'.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

His body needed to be buried the same day he was nailed to the tree (Deuteronomy 21:22-23).

Incorrect. The crucified according to Deuteronomy 21:22-23 and Joshua 8:29; 10:26,27 had to remain hung "not all night", but had to be removed "before sunrise"[*] and be buried the same day after sunrise.
Refer file:///C:/Users/Gerhard/Documents/Lord's%20Day/html/Taken%20Down%20Before%20Sunrise.htm

 

[Truth]

Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
But the seventh day is the Sabbath of YHWH thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
For in six days YHWH made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore YHWH blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it. Exodus 20:8-11
​

Are you among those who have forgotten the Sabbath day, who don't keep it holy and who have been losing out on the special blessing of rest for those who keep it?

I would like to help you understand the Sabbath commandment (the fourth of the Ten Commandments). Not that I know it all concerning the Sabbath, but I have learned much about it over my 32 years of keeping it. If you have any Scriptures that you believe abolish the Sabbath or change it to a different day (most commonly Sunday), feel free to post them here and we can hopefully discuss them in a mature way. One thing I would ask is that you don't throw multiple verses/passages at me. That accomplishes nothing. Post one or two verses or passages to discuss and then we can move on to the next one.

I have posted Exodus 20:8-11 to get us started. Does anyone here believe the blessing upon and holiness of the Sabbath have been removed by YHWH, Yeshua or any apostle? If so, please quote their words.

There is no conflict here with Me, I have been keeping the Sabbath for over 16 years, research the Scriptures about the death, burial, and Resurrection, in reverse. From the time that they come to the tomb after the weakly sabbath, then after they buy the Spices to Anoint His Body, After the High Sabbath of unleavened Bread which accrued after placing Him in the tomb, and the to the tree that they Impaled Him on, and last but not least, His Arrest on the Evening of the 14th of Aviv, or Nisson!!!! Our savior was Placed in the Tomb Before Sundown, On a Wednesday, according to the Pagan Calendar, But According to God's Calendar Sundown to Sundown! He Arose Before Sundown, On the Sabbath, the Lord Of the Sabbath was Raised on the Sabbath, and presented the First Fruit's on the First day,of the Week. Remember one thing And morning and evening was the first Day, At Sundown was the start of the next day, so early in the morning, was just after sundown!!

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

GE:
Suppose it's 'late afternoon'. Then when did everybody LEAVE the cross and in panic fled the sight? And when did they come back? And everybody came back who was there at the Crucifixion and saw the burial et cetera?

That depends on which verses you are referring to.

Only Luke 23:49 in so many words says everybody left the cross and in panic fled the sight of it and "returned to home"; but Mark and Matthew imply the same by the retrospective paraphrase that there were many women including those who came with Jesus from Galilea. In John 16:32, Jesus before it happened, prophesied, "Ye shall be scattered, everyone to his own (hiding place) and shall LEAVE ME ALONE!"

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I came against the NIV which you directed me to in support of your false teaching.

No, I came against the NIV which although it doesn't call it an 'evening before the sun sets', supports your, teaching of an 'evening before the sun sets' by saying the "evening" after sunset 'approached'.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Where do I find that "clear differentiation" in Scripture? I see one "Seventh Day Sabbath" in Scripture. Yeshua kept that day as per the 4th of the Ten Commandments. He is our example. Therefore, I endeavor to keep that day holy as commanded by YHWH.

Fine. But, by God's grace, in the first place I believe the Sabbath Day not 'as per' or because of, 'the 4th of the Ten Commandments', but only, because of and as per Jesus 'our example' in real life exclusively, because of and as per Jesus 'our example' in EVERLASTING LIFE OF HIS RESURRECTION from the dead and grave ON THE SABBATH DAY which "God thus concerning spake ... in times past through the prophets ... in these last days BY THE SON ... the day The Seventh Day", "Sabbath of the week" - ['Sabbatohn'] by Word-of-Act of his, having RAISED FROM THE DEAD "ON IT" - Genitive of time, kind, quality and belonging Matthew 28:1 -, "and God the day, The Seventh Day, from ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED" --rested in kind, in quality and in time IN CHRIST.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

"THE SABBATH OF THE LORD GOD" or more correctly, "The Sabbath of YHWH Elohim" is the 7th day Sabbath of the 4th commandment. There is NO difference.

There is no difference in day or time, but there is all the difference in kind and quality and belonging between the human, sinners', transgression never mind fulfilment, because of which God put the Sabbath into the Law. The Sabbath "was therefore added because of sin", our, "sin", our "transgression" of the Holy "Sabbath Day OF THE LORD (our) GOD".
But by Jesus' Resurrection "on the Sabbath", "Rest Day OF THE LORD GOD", He, after that "He had given them Rest", "the Rest of God", Himself, He in time and space "left for the People of God a keeping of the Sabbath Rest Day, remaining".

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Col_2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Remembering that was to the Israelits not the gentiles who had no such ordinances

Nonsense. That was Paul writing to the Christians not the Israelites in Colossae/Colossus what the heck.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

So even the Jews who choose Christ, are no longer under any laws.

If you are dead to the Law, you are under it as you are under its condemnation.

 

[mjrhealth]

If you are dead to the Law, you are under it as you are under its condemnation.

Nope in Christ the only Law is love, the law can only condemn those who "choose" to be under it. Law no grace simple.

Nonsense. That was Paul writing to the Christians not the Israelites in Colossae/Colossus what the heck.

The law was not against Us we where never under it, it was sin that condemned us, now it is unbelief by so many.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Luk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luk 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luk 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

What you actually say is that Jesus actually did not say what He meant but meant what He did not say, namely,
Two men went up into the church to pray; the one a Sabbath Day believer, and the other a Sunday believer. The Sabbath Day believer stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this Sunday believer. I go to church on the Seventh Day, I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. I am a good law-keeper

And the Sunday believer, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

I tell you, this Sunday believer went down to his house justified rather than the Sabbath Day keeper: for every one that exalteth himself like the Sabbath Day keepers shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself like the Sunday go to churchers, shall be exalted.

 

[mjrhealth]

What you actually say is that Jesus actually did not say what He meant but meant what He did not say, namely,
Two men went up into the church to pray; the one a Sabbath Day believer, and the other a Sunday believer. The Sabbath Day believer stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this Sunday believer. I go to church on the Seventh Day, I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. I am a good law-keeper

And the Sunday believer, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

I tell you, this Sunday believer went down to his house justified rather than the Sabbath Day keeper: for every one that exalteth himself like the Sabbath Day keepers shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself like the Sunday go to churchers, shall be exalted.

I dont keep any sabbath or any sunday, what are you on about...

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

There is no conflict here with Me, I have been keeping the Sabbath for over 16 years, research the Scriptures about the death, burial, and Resurrection, in reverse. From the time that they come to the tomb after the weakly sabbath, then after they buy the Spices to Anoint His Body, After the High Sabbath of unleavened Bread which accrued after placing Him in the tomb, and the to the tree that they Impaled Him on, and last but not least, His Arrest on the Evening of the 14th of Aviv, or Nisson!!!! Our savior was Placed in the Tomb Before Sundown, On a Wednesday, according to the Pagan Calendar, But According to God's Calendar Sundown to Sundown! He Arose Before Sundown, On the Sabbath, the Lord Of the Sabbath was Raised on the Sabbath, and presented the First Fruit's on the First day,of the Week. Remember one thing And morning and evening was the first Day, At Sundown was the start of the next day, so early in the morning, was just after sundown!!

So you have 'researched the Scriptures about the death, burial, and Resurrection, in reverse.'

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~From the time that they come to the tomb after the weakly sabbath~, about 'they'; the Scripture which says who are 'they' who 'come'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~then after they buy the Spices to Anoint His Body~, about 'buy'; the Scripture which says 'buy'; the Scripture which says who are 'they' who 'buy'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~then after they buy the Spices to Anoint His Body~, about 'the Spices'; the Scripture which says 'spices'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~From the time that they come to the tomb after the weakly sabbath then after they buy the Spices to Anoint His Body~, the Scripture which says 'they come to the tomb after the weakly sabbath'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~they buy the Spices to Anoint His Body, After the High Sabbath of unleavened Bread which accrued after placing Him in the tomb~, the Scripture which says 'they buy Spices... (a)fter the High Sabbath of unleavened Bread'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~the High Sabbath of unleavened Bread which accrued after placing Him in the tomb~, the Scripture which says 'the High Sabbath... accrued after placing Him in the tomb'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~After the High Sabbath ... and to the tree that they Impaled Him on~, the Scripture which says 'that they Impaled Him ... (a)fter the High Sabbath' which 'accrued after placing Him in the tomb'?
Alright, you don't have to answer this one it's too obvious an accident.

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~His Arrest on the Evening of the 14th of Aviv, or Nisson!!!!~, the Scripture which says 'His Arrest' was 'on the Evening of the 14th of Aviv'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~Our savior was Placed in the Tomb Before Sundown, On a Wednesday~, the Scripture which says, 'On a Wednesday'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~Our savior was Placed in the Tomb Before Sundown, On a Wednesday, Sundown to Sundown~, the Scripture which says, 'in the Tomb Sundown to Sundown'?

Let's see...
the Scripture about...
~was Raised on the Sabbath, and presented the First Fruit's on the First day of the Week~, the Scripture which says, 'First Fruit's on the First day of the Week'?