How the idea of Immortal Soul got into the Church

[Hobie]

I am a theologian educated in 5 countries and on this topic I can say that there is no agreement. Don’t we wish things were explained with more detail, what are Souls…. spirits…. Spiritual bodies …..eternal….etc

“bodies” resurrected and “something” of us can go to heaven forever. Heaven is important but not well explained.

Much of the devils lies has brought about much confusion, but those who seek and love the truth can find it, with God's help..

 

[pepper]

The soul isn't immortal?

Well,so much for our hoping for Heaven,huh?

Daniel 12:2​

 

[Hobie]

The soul isn't immortal?

Well,so much for our hoping for Heaven,huh?

Daniel 12:2​

If it was, why would you need Christ. Think about it.

 

[Lizbeth]

The Bible doesn’t teach that people have immortal souls but many believe it. So how did this teaching enter Christian thinking, where did this corruption originate and how did it spread into the churh. As God made man in his own image, but did not make him immortal or of the same substance that he possesses. Our Creator is composed of spirit and is eternal, they are not in anyway immortal of their own self. Humans were made out of the dust basically theground or organic substance that constitutes the earth. Adam only became a living being, but not an immortal soul, when God breathed life into him

The first lie, in the Garden of Eden, the devil wanted Eve to believe revolves around the concept of an immortal soul. Eve stated she was instructed not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil or else she would die.

Satan countered that God was lying and that she would not perish. We see that this lie has spread even into Christians today. God's justification for casting Adam and Eve out of the Garden was, "lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever".

If all humans automatically have a soul that is immortal then barring them from the Tree of Life would not make a difference since they would already possess something that would keep them alive into the future. If, however, Adam and Eve did not possess an immortal soul that allowed them to live forever, then God's concern about them acquiring this ability is justified.

Here is one of the best explanation I have come across and every believer should carefully go through it and understand how this deception came into the church from what can only be called pagan Greek thought. 'Secular history reveals that the concept of the immortality of the soul is an ancient belief embraced by many pagan religions. But it's not a biblical teaching and is not found in either the Old or New Testaments....

"Despite widespread use of the phrase immortal soul, this terminology is found nowhere in the Bible. Where did the idea of an immortal soul originate?

The concept of the soul's supposed immortality was first taught in ancient Egypt and Babylon. "The belief that the soul continues in existence after the dissolution of the body is...speculation...nowhere expressly taught in Holy Scripture...The belief in the immortality of the soul came to the Jews from contact with Greek thought and chiefly through the philosophy of Plato, its principal exponent, who was led to it through Orphic and Eleusinian mysteries in which Babylonian and Egyptian views were strangely blended" (Jewish Encyclopedia, 1941, Vol. 6, "Immortality of the Soul," pp. 564, 566).
Secular history reveals that the concept of the immortality of the soul is an ancient belief embraced by many pagan religions. But it's not a biblical teaching and is not found in either the Old or New Testaments.

Plato (428-348 B.C.), the Greek philosopher and student of Socrates, taught that the body and the "immortal soul" separate at death. The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia comments on ancient Israel's view of the soul: "We are influenced always more or less by the Greek, Platonic idea that the body dies, yet the soul is immortal. Such an idea is utterly contrary to the Israelite consciousness and is nowhere found in the Old Testament" (1960, Vol. 2, "Death," p. 812).

Early Christianity was influenced and corrupted by Greek philosophies as it spread through the Greek and Roman world. By A.D. 200 the doctrine of the immortality of the soul became a controversy among Christian believers.

The Evangelical Dictionary of Theology notes that Origen, an early and influential Catholic theologian, was influenced by Greek thinkers: "Speculation about the soul in the subapostolic church was heavily influenced by Greek philosophy. This is seen in Origen's acceptance of Plato's doctrine of the preexistence of the soul as pure mind (nous) originally, which, by reason of its fall from God, cooled down to soul (psyche) when it lost its participation in the divine fire by looking earthward" (1992, "Soul," p. 1037).

Secular history reveals that the concept of the immortality of the soul is an ancient belief embraced by many pagan religions. But it's not a biblical teaching and is not found in either the Old or New Testaments."

Think mankind likes to flatter himself with thoughts of immortality like gods at times.....God's word says (fallen) man is like the beasts that perish and what is man that God is mindful of him? Jesus said to fear Him who is able to destroy both body and soul in Hades (the grave, place of the dead). Eternal life is an inheritance not all men will be granted.

 

[Lizbeth]

Matthew 25:46
“Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

Could eternal punishment mean that death/destruction of the soul will be eternal (for those who aren't granted eternal life), ie, there will be no coming back from it after the judgment....?

 

[pepper]

If it was, why would you need Christ. Think about it.

You think about it.

What is it with all these people here who align and insist the Scriptures are false?

 

[Rightglory]

The Bible doesn’t teach that people have immortal souls but many believe it. So how did this teaching enter Christian thinking, where did this corruption originate and how did it spread into the churh. As God made man in his own image, but did not make him immortal or of the same substance that he possesses. Our Creator is composed of spirit and is eternal, they are not in anyway immortal of their own self. Humans were made out of the dust basically theground or organic substance that constitutes the earth. Adam only became a living being, but not an immortal soul, when God breathed life into him.....

Immortality has always been within Christian theology, even Jewish in the OT.
Man was created to be immortal. God did not create man immortal but good with two elements, body and soul. It was this created being, made from dust, that was given life.
God created man to be a participant in this created universe which was created specifically for man. Man was to cooperate with God in a free and mutual existence. He was to perfect himself. If he was faithful Adam would have attained immortality. If he was not faithful he would die.
We know that Adam sinned and God met him in the Garden and told him he would die and return to dust - Gen 3:19. However Christ did provide an answer for man's fall. God made a promise to Eve in Gen 3:15 that someone, sometime would crush the seed of the serpent.

All through the OT there is a place either called hades, or Sheol where the souls of men would go when the died. The best example of this is in the discourse of Samuel, who was already dead, was speaking to Saul, and told him they would be together that day.

All through the OT there is a promise of a redeemer, The minor and major prophets make this very clear.

When Christ came, he came as an Incarnate human being. The Son of God, Christ, our redeemer took upon Himself our human nature for the sole purpose of saving mankind from the curse of death, the result of the fall. He came fully man, body and soul, in every respect that we as human beings exist in this fallen world. When Adam fell, the curse of death came to all of creation because all of creation was existent in man. When Christ died, the human aspects of His existence separated, body and soul. The thief would be with Him that same day in Paradise. When He arose, He arose with a physical body and soul. Mary was not to touch Him because He was not yet glorified. By the time, a few days later He was glorified and appeared to the disciple with a physical body but could come through the walls. this is also referred to as a spiritual body. We will all have the very same body, soul, existence as Christ had at His ascension in His Human nature.

Now more specifically regarding immorality. We will receive immortality from Christ by His resurrection. The summary of the fall of Adam (mankind) in found in I Cor 15:21 the redemption of mankind is found in I Cor 15:22. I Cor 15:52-53 explains the universality of immortality to all of mankind at the coming of Christ at His second coming.
Mankind is not destroyed, He will exist forever, immortal. The question is where one spends that immortal existence.
Whatever hell or heaven is does not exist in the eschaton. Revelations is quite clear that also because of the resurrection God has made all things new. He redeemed this world and there will be a New Heaven and a New Earth.

 

[pepper]

The idea of a perishable soul is not in Scripture. Soul is immortal.

 

[Grailhunter]

Much of the devils lies has brought about much confusion, but those who seek and love the truth can find it, with God's help..

I think you are right that the devil does that with a lot of topics, but that is not issue with this topic When it comes to the spirit world….like Heaven, Hell, and Shoal, the details are left vague because probably could not comprehend the details. But even though an eternal heavenly reward is well established in the scriptures, what will that existence be like is not well defined?

 

[Rightglory]

The idea of a perishable soul is not in Scripture. Soul is immortal.

Theologically, it cannot be considered immortal. If you so believe, then man's soul existed from beginning with God. His soul would not be created. Even with Christ's resurrection it is not immortal as God is immortal but a created immortality. Man will always be a created creature who is upheld immortal by His Grace.

 

[Bob]

Theologically, it cannot be considered immortal. If you so believe, then man's soul existed from beginning with God. His soul would not be created. Even with Christ's resurrection it is not immortal as God is immortal but a created immortality. Man will always be a created creature who is upheld immortal by His Grace.

Thank you for a rather limiting definition of “immortal.”

Does it make any sense to speak of God, and God alone, as immortal?

Will God gather us to Him until He decides to cast into oblivion? (Interesting questions, but surely not giving anyone anxiety.)

Exodus 3:
13 Moses said to God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ Then what shall I tell them?”

14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

Blessings.

 

[Hobie]

Immortality has always been within Christian theology, even Jewish in the OT.
Man was created to be immortal. God did not create man immortal but good with two elements, body and soul. It was this created being, made from dust, that was given life.
God created man to be a participant in this created universe which was created specifically for man. Man was to cooperate with God in a free and mutual existence. He was to perfect himself. If he was faithful Adam would have attained immortality. If he was not faithful he would die.
We know that Adam sinned and God met him in the Garden and told him he would die and return to dust - Gen 3:19. However Christ did provide an answer for man's fall. God made a promise to Eve in Gen 3:15 that someone, sometime would crush the seed of the serpent.

All through the OT there is a place either called hades, or Sheol where the souls of men would go when the died. The best example of this is in the discourse of Samuel, who was already dead, was speaking to Saul, and told him they would be together that day.

All through the OT there is a promise of a redeemer, The minor and major prophets make this very clear.

When Christ came, he came as an Incarnate human being. The Son of God, Christ, our redeemer took upon Himself our human nature for the sole purpose of saving mankind from the curse of death, the result of the fall. He came fully man, body and soul, in every respect that we as human beings exist in this fallen world. When Adam fell, the curse of death came to all of creation because all of creation was existent in man. When Christ died, the human aspects of His existence separated, body and soul. The thief would be with Him that same day in Paradise. When He arose, He arose with a physical body and soul. Mary was not to touch Him because He was not yet glorified. By the time, a few days later He was glorified and appeared to the disciple with a physical body but could come through the walls. this is also referred to as a spiritual body. We will all have the very same body, soul, existence as Christ had at His ascension in His Human nature.

Now more specifically regarding immorality. We will receive immortality from Christ by His resurrection. The summary of the fall of Adam (mankind) in found in I Cor 15:21 the redemption of mankind is found in I Cor 15:22. I Cor 15:52-53 explains the universality of immortality to all of mankind at the coming of Christ at His second coming.
Mankind is not destroyed, He will exist forever, immortal. The question is where one spends that immortal existence.
Whatever hell or heaven is does not exist in the eschaton. Revelations is quite clear that also because of the resurrection God has made all things new. He redeemed this world and there will be a New Heaven and a New Earth.

So sinners get eternal life, no my brother, Gods Word does not teach that...

 

[Magdala]

The Bible doesn’t teach that people have immortal souls but many believe it. So how did this teaching enter Christian thinking, where did this corruption originate and how did it spread into the churh. As God made man in his own image, but did not make him immortal or of the same substance that he possesses. Our Creator is composed of spirit and is eternal, they are not in anyway immortal of their own self. Humans were made out of the dust basically theground or organic substance that constitutes the earth. Adam only became a living being, but not an immortal soul, when God breathed life into him

The first lie, in the Garden of Eden, the devil wanted Eve to believe revolves around the concept of an immortal soul. Eve stated she was instructed not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil or else she would die.

Satan countered that God was lying and that she would not perish. We see that this lie has spread even into Christians today. God's justification for casting Adam and Eve out of the Garden was, "lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever".

If all humans automatically have a soul that is immortal then barring them from the Tree of Life would not make a difference since they would already possess something that would keep them alive into the future. If, however, Adam and Eve did not possess an immortal soul that allowed them to live forever, then God's concern about them acquiring this ability is justified.

In Gen. 2:7, we read, "God formed the man of dust of the earth [...]". What are bones? A proof of the power of God Who made man with dust, but nothing else. Therefore, it's the physical body that returns to dust (Gen. 3:19, Ecc. 3:20).

Gen. 2:7 goes on to say, "[...] and breathed upon his face the breath of life [...]". The act of having "breathed the breath of life upon" indicates giving something that makes a man who he is: a creature bearing the image and likeness of God (Gen. 1:26). In Jn. 4:24, we read, "God is Spirit", and thus the "breath of life" is a spirit (soul): God's image and likeness. This wonderful thing which is a soul, a thing created by God to give man His image and likeness as an unquestionable sign of His Most Holy Paternity, shows signs of the qualities characteristic of Him Who creates it. It is therefore intelligent, spiritual, free, immortal, and so on, like the Father Who created it.

"Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: as the spirit [soul] shall return to God Who gave it" (Ecc. 12:7)

"They stoned Stephen as he called out, saying, 'Lord Jesus, receive my spirit [soul]!'” (Ac. 7:59)

A spirit, e.g., the soul, etc., is incorporeal, and thus is not subject to the limits of physical death, which is the definition of the word "immortal" [Note: While all spirits are immortal, the only Spirit Who is eternal, as in "without beginning or end", is God.] Eve's and Adam's first act of disobedience (sin) is what brought death into the world, not just physical death of the body, but a spiritual death of the soul which is separation from God (Rom. 5:12), and thus Satan did lie when he told them that they would not die.

With God's sacrifice, Heaven was reopened to mankind, and all just souls past, present and future live with Him eternally in Heaven, and the unjust souls undergo a spiritual death, which means living in eternal separation from God in Hell, of their own free will. Therefore, upon the death of our physical body, our immortal soul will go on and receive judgement. Upon Jesus's Second Coming, our pysical body will be resurrected and reunited with our soul, where we will then receive our final judgement (Ezek. 18:4;5;17, Matt. 25: 31:46, I Cor. 15:35-58).

 

[MonoBiblical]

Lazarus and the Rich man is not a parable.

It is a comparison, and it did happen.

 

[MonoBiblical]

In Gen. 2:7, we read, "God formed the man of dust of the earth [...]". What are bones? A proof of the power of God Who made man with dust, but nothing else. Therefore, it's the physical body that returns to dust (Gen. 3:19, Ecc. 3:20).

Gen. 2:7 goes on to say, "[...] and breathed upon his face the breath of life [...]". The act of having "breathed the breath of life upon" indicates giving something that makes a man who he is: a creature bearing the image and likeness of God (Gen. 1:26). In Jn. 4:24, we read, "God is Spirit", and thus the "breath of life" is a spirit (soul): God's image and likeness.

"Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: as the spirit [soul] shall return to God Who gave it" (Ecc. 12:7)

"They stoned Stephen as he called out, saying, 'Lord Jesus, receive my spirit [soul]!'” (Ac. 7:59)

A spirit, e.g., the soul, etc., is incorporeal, and thus is not subject to the limits of physical death, which is the definition of the word "immortal" [Note: While all spirits are immortal, the only Spirit Who is eternal, as in "without beginning or end", is God.] Eve's and Adam's first act of disobedience (sin) is what brought death into the world, not just physical death of the body, but a spiritual death of the soul which is separation from God (Rom. 5:12), and thus Satan did lie when he told them that they would not die.

With God's sacrifice, Heaven was re-opened to mankind, and all just souls past, present and future live with Him eternally in Heaven, and the unjust souls undergo a spiritual death, which means living in eternal separation from God in Hell, of their own free will. Therefore, upon the death of our physical body, our immortal soul will go on and receive judgement. Upon Jesus's Second Coming, our pysical body will be resurrected and reunited with our soul, where we will then receive our final judgement (Ezek. 18:4;5;17, Matt. 25: 31:46).

Hellenistic writings are full [of] man being made from immortal sparks; Valentinus seems to have copied, and the church followed at the way.

 

[Magdala]

Hellenistic writings are full man being made from immortal sparks; Valentinus seems to have copied, and the church followed at the way.

As shown, the immortal spirit (soul) in man is spoken of in the Book of Genesis, long before the Hellenistic culture and Valentinus.

 

[MonoBiblical]

The immortal spirit (soul) of man is spoken of in the Book of Genesis.

Human breath is not immortal. And also, the Greeks believed it contained human intelligence.

 

[Magdala]

Human breath is not immortal.

We're not talking about oxygen. Gen. 2:7 says, "[...] and breathed upon his face the breath of life [...]". The act of having "breathed the breath of life upon" indicates giving something that makes a man who he is: a creature bearing the image and likeness of God (Gen. 1:26). In Jn. 4:24, we read, "God is Spirit", and thus the "breath of life" is the breath of God which is the soul, the soul as life. It is the breath of the Spirit of God that becomes a living spirit in man: God's image and likeness. This wonderful thing which is a soul, a thing created by God to give man His image and likeness as an unquestionable sign of His Most Holy Paternity, shows signs of the qualities characteristic of Him Who creates it. It is therefore intelligent, spiritual, free, immortal, and so on, like the Father Who created it.

"Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: as the spirit [soul] shall return to God Who gave it" (Ecc. 12:7)

"They stoned Stephen as he called out, saying, 'Lord Jesus, receive my spirit [soul]!'” (Ac. 7:59)

 

[MonoBiblical]

We're not talking about oxygen. Gen. 2:7 says, "[...] and breathed upon his face the breath of life [...]". The act of having "breathed the breath of life upon" indicates giving something that makes a man who he is: a creature bearing the image and likeness of God (Gen. 1:26). In Jn. 4:24, we read, "God is Spirit", and thus the "breath of life" is a spirit (soul): God's image and likeness. This wonderful thing which is a soul, a thing created by God to give man His image and likeness as an unquestionable sign of His Most Holy Paternity, shows signs of the qualities characteristic of Him Who creates it. It is therefore intelligent, spiritual, free, immortal, and so on, like the Father Who created it.

"Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: as the spirit [soul] shall return to God Who gave it" (Ecc. 12:7)

"They stoned Stephen as he called out, saying, 'Lord Jesus, receive my spirit [soul]!'” (Ac. 7:59)

Spirit and Soul are 2 different things. Spirit is directed force, and only God can preserve it.

 

[Magdala]

Spirit and Soul are 2 different things. Spirit is directed force, and only God can preserve it.

The spirit given to each man by God as shown in Gen. 2:7 is what is commonly called "the soul", and He preserves it with His Grace.