The absurdity of Pretrib logic

[WPM]

The story of Lazarus and the rich man is a fable.

In your mind! You are a self-confessed heretic denying Jesus is God. This is just more evidence of who you are.

 

[WPM]

The story doesn't read like a true story. It is filled with fabulous language about spirits having the sense of touch, taste, and sight.

This is called figurative language. Scripture is full of that. Jesus is illustrating what a divided Hades looked like before the resurrection. This is a story about real people in a real place. The comfort and torment are real, but are described in a figurative way.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

This is called figurative language. Scripture is full of that. Jesus is illustrating what a divided Hades looked like before the resurrection. This is a story about real people in a real place. The comfort and torment are real, but are described in a figurative way.

This is obvious to anyone who has even a little bit of discernment, but, obviously, anyone who denies the deity of Christ has none.

He can't even discern that when the days of the Son of man are compared directly to the days leading up to the day Noah entered the ark and the days leading up to the day Lot went out of Sodom, it's referring to the days that lead up to the second coming of Christ.

I'm not sure if he is able to discern anything in scripture when he can't discern things as obvious as the deity of Christ and that the days of the Son of Man lead up to the day He returns rather than follow it as he falsely believes. Did the days of Noah follow the flood or come before it? Did the days of Lot follow Sodom being destroyed or come before it? The answers are obvious and he doesn't even get it. You can't hardly have less discernment than that.

 

[WPM]

This is obvious to anyone who has even a little bit of discernment, but, obviously, anyone who denies the deity of Christ has none.

He can't even discern that when the days of the Son of man are compared directly to the days leading up to the day Noah entered the ark and the days leading up to the day Lot went out of Sodom, it's referring to the days that lead up to the second coming of Christ.

I'm not sure if he is able to discern anything in scripture when he can't discern things as obvious as the deity of Christ and that the days of the Son of Man lead up to the day He returns rather than follow it as he falsely believes. Did the days of Noah follow the flood or come before it? Did the days of Lot follow Sodom being destroyed or come before it? The answers are obvious and he doesn't even get it. You can't hardly have less discernment than that.

Exactly! He cannot bring any Premil arguments to the table. All we have is his statements. That is it!

 

[CadyandZoe]

This is called figurative language. Scripture is full of that. Jesus is illustrating what a divided Hades looked like before the resurrection. This is a story about real people in a real place. The comfort and torment are real, but are described in a figurative way.

Figurative language is not the same thing as fabulous language. Fabulous language is used to illustrate a moral point or principle. Jesus uses fabulous language to illustrate the idea that some people will not believe the truth even if someone were to come back from the dead to tell them. And it also illustrates the idea that Moses is good enough to convict someone of sin.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Lol. You taunt us for opposing you for not being "willing to be convinced."

How about you? We could say the same about you.

Until you present some compelling biblical evidence you should desist from such unobjective rhetoric.

Think about it.

 

[CadyandZoe]

LOL. You, someone who denies the deity of Christ

Yes, I deny the deity of Christ for two reasons, it makes no sense and it isn't Biblical. Why do you believe a contradictory and unbilical doctrine promoted by the Catholic Church?

, can't expect to convince anyone of anything.

I assume you are speaking for yourself.

The context of "the days of the Son of man" are very obvious.

Your interpretation is "obvious" to you and you seem to lack the ability to suspend your own interpretation to discuss the interpretation of others.

Why should I take any more time arguing about something as obvious as this? It would be like taking a lot of time explaining to someone that 1 + 1 = 2. I'm not going to do that.

I doubt it. You can't help yourself.

 

[CadyandZoe]

In your mind! You are a self-confessed heretic denying Jesus is God. This is just more evidence of who you are.

A rebuttal without an argument is nothing more than argument for argument's sake.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yes, I deny the deity of Christ for two reasons, it makes no sense and it isn't Biblical. Why do you believe a contradictory and unbilical doctrine promoted by the Catholic Church?

LOL. Catholics believe Jesus died and rose from the dead. I think even you believe that, right? So, are they wrong about that? Don't use lame arguments like this. If they were literally wrong about everything, then you might have a point but you know they're not. This type of argument is extremely weak and just reveals your desperation.

I assume you are speaking for yourself.

Your interpretation is "obvious" to you and you seem to lack the ability to suspend your own interpretation to discuss the interpretation of others.

I doubt it. You can't help yourself.

I speak for anyone who has any discernment at all. It's that obvious. And you have none. That also is obvious.

I'm not going to argue any more about something as obvious as 1 + 1 = 2. Sorry to disappoint you.

 

[David in NJ]

LOL!!! Why fight the pre-trip rapture ask God I Think God will let you stay behind.

We, who trust the WORD, should always fight and expose deception(s) such as 'pre-fib' rapture.

BEST is to believe the LORD Jesus Christ who says:
"“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His [d]elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

We, who trust the WORD, should always fight and expose deception(s) such as 'pre-fib' rapture.

BEST is to believe the LORD Jesus Christ who says:
"“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His [d]elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

We especially don't need to put up with nonsense like he said, saying God should leave you behind even though it's clear that only unbelievers get left behind. We don't have to put up with that false doctrine or with those kinds of condemning comments.

 

[Keraz]

I speak for anyone who has any discernment at all. It's that obvious. And you have none. That also is obvious.

I'm not going to argue any more about something as obvious as 1 + 1 = 2. Sorry to disappoint you.

You do not speak for me and your belief that we are in the Millennium now, shows your lack of discernment as well as your inability to face reality.
You and all who think that the story of Lazarus the beggar and the rich man, is actual and true, are the deceived and confused ones.

Both of these false ideas are serious misinterpretations and both conflict with many other scriptures.
These truths have been presented to you, some many times; like the narrative of Chapter 20 of Revelation and how the dead 'sleep' in their graves.
But you refuse; or are unable to see and understand those truths and what is worse, castigate those who oppose your beliefs. Judgment is coming; one Day we will all stand before God and those who believed in Jesus and accepted His salvation will receive Eternal life. But there will be a loss of rewards for all those who failed to properly study the Bible and who promoted wrong doctrines.

Even worse is the pretentious and absurd belief of a pre-Trib rapture. I congratulate you for avoiding that trap.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You do not speak for me and your belief that we are in the Millennium now, shows your lack of discernment as well as your inability to face reality.
You and all who think that the story of Lazarus the beggar and the rich man, is actual and true, are the deceived and confused ones.

LOL. Have you even been following the discussion? Do you even know what I was talking about in that post? I was talking about his denial of the deity of Jesus Christ and his belief that "the days of the Son of man" refer to the thousand years rather than the days that lead up to His second coming. Do you agree with him about that? Jesus compared the days of Noah and the days of Lot to the days of the Son of man and the context was the days leading up to the flood and leading up to Sodom being destroyed and comparing that to the day He will return.

Both of these false ideas are serious misinterpretations and both conflict with many other scriptures.

Blah blah blah. You are so full of hot air. Always making claims without backing them up with clear scripture.

These truths have been presented to you, some many times; like the narrative of Chapter 20 of Revelation and how the dead 'sleep' in their graves.
But you refuse; or are unable to see and understand those truths and what is worse, castigate those who oppose your beliefs.

LOL. Do you think your opinion about this means anything to me? It does not. Not whatsoever. But, keep babbling and rambling on if that's what you want to do.

Judgment is coming; one Day we will all stand before God and those who believed in Jesus and accepted His salvation will receive Eternal life.

Yes, I look forward to that day.

But there will be a loss of rewards for all those who failed to properly study the Bible and who promoted wrong doctrines.

Yes, it will be a sad day for you in that sense.

Even worse is the pretentious and absurd belief of a pre-Trib rapture. I congratulate you for avoiding that trap.

As if it's hard to discern the fallacy of that false doctrine. But, thanks, anyway.

 

[CadyandZoe]

LOL. Catholics believe Jesus died and rose from the dead. I think even you believe that, right? So, are they wrong about that? Don't use lame arguments like this. If they were literally wrong about everything, then you might have a point but you know they're not. This type of argument is extremely weak and just reveals your desperation.

I'm sorry, I keep forgetting that you speak without knowledge. You don't know what deity is. You don't know about the Greek/Christian syncretism of the early church, and you don't know that what you believe isn't Biblical, it's philosophical. The same philosophers who told you that the eucharist is both bread and the body of Christ at the same time are those who told you that the son of God can be both a man a deity at the same time.

I speak for anyone who has any discernment at all. It's that obvious. And you have none. That also is obvious.

Really, you don't seem to know what discernment is.

Let me ask you this. Was Jesus a man or not?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Exactly! He cannot bring any Premil arguments to the table. All we have is his statements. That is it!

Are you kidding? Our debate went 429 pages. "22 major reasons to abandon the premil doctrine."

The idea that Christ rules on earth for a thousand years is evident from Revelation 20.

 

[rwb]

Are you kidding? Our debate went 429 pages. "22 major reasons to abandon the premil doctrine."

The idea that Christ rules on earth for a thousand years is evident from Revelation 20.

No it isn't!!!

 

[WPM]

Are you kidding? Our debate went 429 pages. "22 major reasons to abandon the premil doctrine."

The idea that Christ rules on earth for a thousand years is evident from Revelation 20.

Where does it teach that "Christ rules on earth for a thousand years ... [in] Revelation 20"? Quote actual text.

 

[WPM]

I'm sorry, I keep forgetting that you speak without knowledge. You don't know what deity is. You don't know about the Greek/Christian syncretism of the early church, and you don't know that what you believe isn't Biblical, it's philosophical. The same philosophers who told you that the eucharist is both bread and the body of Christ at the same time are those who told you that the son of God can be both a man a deity at the same time.


Really, you don't seem to know what discernment is.

Let me ask you this. Was Jesus a man or not?

Please keep your false charges and heresy away from this thread.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I'm sorry

Yes, that's true.

I keep forgetting that you speak without knowledge.

Says the one who has no understanding of scripture whatsoever.

You don't know what deity is.

Yes, I do. Don't lie. Did you know lying is a sin? I would not be surprised if you didn't even know that since you clearly have no understanding of the Bible whatsoever.

deity: the creator and supreme being (in a monotheistic religion such as Christianity).

Jesus is God and is the Creator of all things, according to scripture.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. 6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. 8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. 9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. 10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. 11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. 14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. 15 John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me. 16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. 17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

The Word is Jesus Christ and "all things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made". You deny this truth.

You don't know about the Greek/Christian syncretism of the early church, and you don't know that what you believe isn't Biblical, it's philosophical.

You don't know that what you believe is Satanic.

The same philosophers who told you that the eucharist is both bread and the body of Christ at the same time are those who told you that the son of God can be both a man a deity at the same time.

LOL. I don't believe that the bread is the literal body of Christ as they foolishly believe. Your attempt to lump me in with Catholics is a joke. This is all you have. You can't support your Satanic belief with scripture, so you resort to this instead.

Really, you don't seem to know what discernment is.

I absolutely do and you are so lacking in discernment that you can't even discern what discernment is. You are spiritually blind.

Let me ask you this. Was Jesus a man or not?

Yes, and God at the same time. You foolishly don't allow for this because you are carnal and don't accept spiritual and supernatural realities.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Are you kidding? Our debate went 429 pages. "22 major reasons to abandon the premil doctrine."

The idea that Christ rules on earth for a thousand years is evident from Revelation 20.

Where does Revelation 20 say anything about Christ ruling on earth?