What is the purpose of infant baptism?

[Fred J]

Know what Fred.....
@Augustin56 shouldn't give you the dignity of a reply.

Anyone that states that a Christian is satanic, as satan is, should be avoided because it is YOU sir that is disguising yourself.

YOU are the servant of the anti Christ.
We can safely say You ARE the anti Christ.
Not posting scripture since you apparently don't understand it well, but you are ...

Against the unity of Christ's church.
Against brethren in Christ.

The ANTI Christ.

And, I won't be replying to your tirades.

Thank you very much, sorry to burst your bubbles.

Looks like you're not well verse in the scripture yourself, for my writings are from the revelation of the scripture. Am to distinguish between the 'spirit of truth' and the 'spirit of error' within the church.

They are merely to 'expose' the 'counterfeits' and 'imposters' who testify apart from the scripture and doctrine, So they may repent and not influence babes in Christ like you.

But since you have another picture of me and personal, without even having any conversation with me, am not able to help 'itching ears'.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Highly doubt you KNOW the “understanding” of “the People” who lived in the FIRST century.

Catholics don't outright reject the historical evidence of the people of the first century. You do, which compels you to make stuff up.

I. “Born Again” Means Water Baptism

For Christ also said, ‘Except ye be born again, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.’ Now, that it is impossible for those who have once been born to enter into their mothers’ wombs, is manifest to all. And how those who have sinned and repent shall escape their sins, is declared by Esaias the prophet, as I wrote above; he thus speaks: ‘Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from your souls; learn to do well…And though your sins be as scarlet, I will make them white like wool; and though they be as crimson, I will make them white as snow…And for this [rite] we have learned from the apostles this reason. Since at our birth we were born without our own knowledge or choice, by our parents coming together, and were brought up in bad habits and wicked training; in order that we may not remain the children of necessity and of ignorance, but may become the children of choice and knowledge, and may obtain in the water the remission of sins formerly committed, there is pronounced over him who chooses to be born again, and has repented of his sins, the name of God the Father and Lord of the universe; he who leads to the layer the person that is to be washed calling him by this name alone…And this washing is called illumination, because they who learn these things are illuminated in their understandings. And in the name of Jesus Christ, who was crucified under Pontius Pilate, and in the name of the Holy Ghost, who through the prophets foretold all things about Jesus, he who is illuminated is washed.”
Justin Martyr, First Apology, 61 (A.D. 110-165).

Taken has nothing to do with the Church of 110 A.D.

more 1st century evidence here that Taken automatically rejects.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Ex. 29:4; Lev. 8:6 – Aaron and his sons were washed in holy water in their consecration to the priesthood. Thus, we see the use of holy water during the beginning of salvation history.

Ex. 30:18-19 – the Lord requires Aaron and his sons to wash their hands and feet in holy water before they offered sacrifices to Him. The Church uses holy water for various purposes, and holy water fonts are generally located at the entrance of Catholic churches to be used before the sacrifice of Christ is offered to the Father.

Num. 5:17 – here again, the priest uses holy water. God uses natural matter to convey the supernatural, just as God who is Spirit became flesh in Christ Jesus.

Num. 8:7 – the Lord says to “sprinkle them with the water of remission.” The Lord uses water, a physical property, to convey His supernatural property of grace.

1 Kings 7:38-39 – in King Solomon’s temple, there were ten large basins of holy water. Holy water has always been used in the context of worship.

John 9:6-7 – Jesus uses clay and spittle to heal the blind man’s eyes, and ordered him to wash in the pool of Siloam to effect the cure. Jesus did not need to use spittle, clay and water, but He does to demonstrate that God uses the material things He created to give graces and heal us.

John 13:4-10 – the Lord uses water to wash the apostles’ feet to prepare them for their sacramental priesthood.

John 19:34 – water and blood flowed from Jesus’ pierced side on the Cross. The Church uses holy water as a symbol of our Lord’s life giving water that flowed from His sacred Heart, and as the property which brings about the power of Jesus Christ Himself, in baptism, the Eucharist, and other sacred rites of the Church.

 

[RedFan]

Catholics don't outright reject the historical evidence of the people of the first century. You do, which compels you to make stuff up.

I. “Born Again” Means Water Baptism

For Christ also said, ‘Except ye be born again, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.’ Now, that it is impossible for those who have once been born to enter into their mothers’ wombs, is manifest to all. And how those who have sinned and repent shall escape their sins, is declared by Esaias the prophet, as I wrote above; he thus speaks: ‘Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from your souls; learn to do well…And though your sins be as scarlet, I will make them white like wool; and though they be as crimson, I will make them white as snow…And for this [rite] we have learned from the apostles this reason. Since at our birth we were born without our own knowledge or choice, by our parents coming together, and were brought up in bad habits and wicked training; in order that we may not remain the children of necessity and of ignorance, but may become the children of choice and knowledge, and may obtain in the water the remission of sins formerly committed, there is pronounced over him who chooses to be born again, and has repented of his sins, the name of God the Father and Lord of the universe; he who leads to the layer the person that is to be washed calling him by this name alone…And this washing is called illumination, because they who learn these things are illuminated in their understandings. And in the name of Jesus Christ, who was crucified under Pontius Pilate, and in the name of the Holy Ghost, who through the prophets foretold all things about Jesus, he who is illuminated is washed.”
Justin Martyr, First Apology, 61 (A.D. 110-165).

Taken has nothing to do with the Church of 110 A.D.

more 1st century evidence here that Taken automatically rejects.

You started quoting Justin Martyr a little too late in the paragraph! Here are the preceding sentences:

"As many as are persuaded and believe that what we teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly, are instructed to pray and to entreat God with fasting, for the remission of their sins that are past, we praying and fasting with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Saviour Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water."

 

[GodsGrace]

Thank you very much, sorry to burst your bubbles.

Looks like you're not well verse in the scripture yourself, for my writings are from the revelation of the scripture. Am to distinguish between the 'spirit of truth' and the 'spirit of error' within the church.

They are merely to 'expose' the 'counterfeits' and 'imposters' who testify apart from the scripture and doctrine, So they may repent and not influence babes in Christ like you.

But since you have another picture of me and personal, without even having any conversation with me, am not able to help 'itching ears'.

Your post tells me all I need to know about you.
And what I posted to the other member stands.

You are divisive and not even for good reasons...

1 Corinthians 1.10
10 I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

2 Corinthians 13:11
Finally, brothers, rejoice. Aim for restoration, comfort one another, agree with one another, live in peace; and the God of love and peace will be with you.


1 Peter 3:8
Finally, all of you, have unity of mind, sympathy, brotherly love, a tender heart, and a humble mind.


Philippians 2:2
Complete my joy by being of the same mind, having the same love, being in full accord and of one mind.


And there's more.

To discuss differences is one thing....
To degrade another Christian denomination and its followers is another.

 

[GodsGrace]

Ex. 29:4; Lev. 8:6 – Aaron and his sons were washed in holy water in their consecration to the priesthood. Thus, we see the use of holy water during the beginning of salvation history.

Ex. 30:18-19 – the Lord requires Aaron and his sons to wash their hands and feet in holy water before they offered sacrifices to Him. The Church uses holy water for various purposes, and holy water fonts are generally located at the entrance of Catholic churches to be used before the sacrifice of Christ is offered to the Father.

Num. 5:17 – here again, the priest uses holy water. God uses natural matter to convey the supernatural, just as God who is Spirit became flesh in Christ Jesus.

Num. 8:7 – the Lord says to “sprinkle them with the water of remission.” The Lord uses water, a physical property, to convey His supernatural property of grace.

1 Kings 7:38-39 – in King Solomon’s temple, there were ten large basins of holy water. Holy water has always been used in the context of worship.

John 9:6-7 – Jesus uses clay and spittle to heal the blind man’s eyes, and ordered him to wash in the pool of Siloam to effect the cure. Jesus did not need to use spittle, clay and water, but He does to demonstrate that God uses the material things He created to give graces and heal us.

John 13:4-10 – the Lord uses water to wash the apostles’ feet to prepare them for their sacramental priesthood.

Interesting.
Anything in the CCC about this?
I don't think so....
Although the OT priests are mentioned under Holy Orders.

John 19:34 – water and blood flowed from Jesus’ pierced side on the Cross. The Church uses holy water as a symbol of our Lord’s life giving water that flowed from His sacred Heart, and as the property which brings about the power of Jesus Christ Himself, in baptism, the Eucharist, and other sacred rites of the Church.

In mixing water with wine at the Consecration it also represents the people/community.
Can't remember where I learned this....

 

[Behold]

That would include the Catholic trick of the canon of Scripture,

From Genesis to Revelation (In a Bible), there is not a single case.........of an "infant, (baby)" being water baptized.

John the Baptist, didnt do it.
Jesus The Christ didnt do it.
Neither Paul, nor Peter, nor any Apostle or any person listed in the entire bible, "baptized infants".

Not once = .. not Ever.... = NEVER.

Yet, "the Cult of the virgin" says, its to be done, its "church tradition"., and if its not in a bible, well... who needs a bible when you have a Pope and "church fathers", and "Tradition".

And Here.... is a CATHOLIC Tradition, that (probably)... no Protestant knows anything about, and i'll share it..

A.) "The Cult of the Virgin", is into "RELICS".. They love antiquity related to past Saints, and so forth.

How much do they love gathering "relics'?
This "Cult of the Virgin" will exhume (dig up) a dead Christian, whom they defined as a canonized "SAINT".., and they will have a surgeon take parts of the body, as "relics". to collect., like you would collect stamps or coins.
This "cult of the Virgin" collects human parts...as found "inside the body".. or "pieces of the dead SAINT's thigh"... They will takes parts of the Body of a Saint they "dug up", and sometimes "dug up" a few times, and get some pieces of their body, that they want to keep...

They call these : "RELICS".
Im assuming the more famous body parts that have been removed from the more famous Catholic Saints, are in "The Vatican".

I call that situation..., = perverted demonic behavior,.... pretending to be "of God".

Can you imagine Jesus The Christ cutting off a part of some Apostle's dead body, to collect it?

So, WELCOME to "the cult of the Virgin".

Isn't it amazing,??? and not in a good way....

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

You started quoting Justin Martyr a little too late in the paragraph! Here are the preceding sentences:

"As many as are persuaded and believe that what we teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly, are instructed to pray and to entreat God with fasting, for the remission of their sins that are past, we praying and fasting with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Saviour Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water."

Thank you. The preceding sentences of 4 lines condenses my 11 lines nicely. People are more likely to read short posts as opposed to walls of text, which I try to avoid. The many Lavrovites in this thread won't admit Justin Martyr was a Christian in the first place, or they have never heard of him.

Most of his works are lost, but two apologies and a dialogue did survive. The First Apology, his most well-known text, passionately defends the morality of the Christian life, and provides various ethical and philosophical arguments to convince the Roman emperor, Antoninus, to abandon the persecution of the Church.

Justin was martyred, along with some of his students, and is venerated as a saint by the Catholic Church,[6] the Eastern Orthodox Church,[7] the Oriental Orthodox Churches, Lutheran Churches, and in Anglicanism.[8]
(wiki)

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Interesting.
Anything in the CCC about this?
I don't think so....

CCC1668

Although the OT priests are mentioned under Holy Orders.

In mixing water with wine at the Consecration it also represents the people/community.
Can't remember where I learned this....

Neither can I, but it's captivating to watch.

Here's a trick to find things in the massive catechism. In the address bar, key in a subject or topic, followed by "catechism", followed by ".va". Like this: holy water catechism .va
You will get this at the top of the list.
Catechism of the Catholic Church - Paragraph # 1668
click that
look at the fine print and click on "enter the catechism at this paragraph" and get the full page.
The notes at the bottom of each page is usually peppered with scripture.

 

[Truther]

There is no church in existence that can rattle a chain of succession all the way back to the first century. The only way any of us can know that we are in the original church is, if we adhere to the original doctrine and experience as the original church had in the first century. It simply comes down to the individual.
An organization cannot be trusted to get us back to Pentecost.
Organizations are laced with extra biblical doctrines and creeds.

 

[Taken]

Thank you very much, sorry to burst your bubbles.

Didn’t happen.

Looks like you're not well verse in the scripture yourself,

I am not subject to WHAT YOU BELIEVE by YOUR SIGHT.

for my writings are from the revelation of the scripture.

My writing, is From SEEING, READING, STUDYING Scripture…
My understanding, is a Blessed Gift FROM the Lord God.
My standing IS a Blessed Gift “with” AND “in” the Lord God and His Spirit “with” AND “in” me.

Am to distinguish between the 'spirit of truth' and the 'spirit of error' within the church.

Distinguishing is faulty, when you are void of the TRUTH and UNDERSTANDING, according to the Lord God.

They are merely to 'expose' the 'counterfeits' and 'imposters' who testify apart from the scripture and doctrine, So they may repent and not influence babes in Christ like you.

You react in a VAGUE manner, Tongue wagging, YET fail to Challenge Particular Points.

PROPER CHALLENGE EXAMPLE…

. “Born Again” Means Water Baptism

Disagree.
Born Again means a mans NATURAL SPIRIT, born of a MANS SEED…
IS:
A mans natural spirit becoming MADE Born AGAIN of Gods SEED, by, through, the Power (Holy Spirit) of God.
God IS SPIRIT…
Gods Being, Word, Power, Seed…IS SPIRIT.

(Next you should, read, study, learn…WHAT Gods Spirit IS….what a mans NATURAL spirit IS…and what CHANGES when God “MAKES” a natural mans spirit, BORN AGAIN of Gods Supernatural SEED. )

But since you have another picture of me and personal, without even having any conversation with me, am not able to help 'itching ears'.

LOL…I do not know you, nor do you know me…but I did disagree with your post….AND did notice your PERSONAL accusations Against me…that you now complain ONLY perpetuated by me…

Beware of swinging doors!

 

[RedFan]

There is no church in existence that can rattle a chain of succession all the way back to the first century.

How about this? List of patriarchs of Antioch - Wikipedia

 

[Truther]

How about this? List of patriarchs of Antioch - Wikipedia

Nope. Again, there is no movement or chain of succession that is of any organizational type that has roots from Pentecost till now. It is all about the individual doctrine and experience that we personally have. Organizations have failed at every level.

 

[Truther]

This is precisely why when somebody asks me what church I go to, I tell them I am of the 3000 at Pentecost. That is my church. The church of 3000.

 

[Truther]

The church of 3000 were all baptized in the name of Jesus on the day of Pentecost and were accepted of the apostles.

 

[RedFan]

Nope. Again, there is no movement or chain of succession that is of any organizational type that has roots from Pentecost till now. It is all about the individual doctrine and experience that we personally have. Organizations have failed at every level.

I thought you were saying that no church could rattle off a chain of succession going back to the First Century. The Greek Orthodox Church in Antioch does so. That was my only point, without getting into what "organizational type" may be present. (I'm not sure what you even mean by that phrase.)

 

[Truther]

I thought you were saying that no church could rattle off a chain of succession going back to the First Century. The Greek Orthodox Church in Antioch does so. That was my only point, without getting into what "organizational type" may be present. (I'm not sure what you even mean by that phrase.)

The GO church does not obey Acts 2:38.

Chain broken.

Only individuals have the guts to obey Acts 2:38.

This is what we do.

 

[Truther]

The GO church....

… pouring or sprinkling water over the child's head three times saying, "The servant of God (name) is baptized in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of

…epict fail

 

[GodsGrace]

CCC1668

Neither can I, but it's captivating to watch.

Here's a trick to find things in the massive catechism. In the address bar, key in a subject or topic, followed by "catechism", followed by ".va". Like this: holy water catechism .va
You will get this at the top of the list.
Catechism of the Catholic Church - Paragraph # 1668
click that
look at the fine print and click on "enter the catechism at this paragraph" and get the full page.
The notes at the bottom of each page is usually peppered with scripture.

Thanks Jude!
I know a lot of it, but I use the index and it's not too helpful OR it just takes a lot of time to check out each paragraph given.

I just read 1668.
It doesn't state anything of the washing of the feet aligned with the OT washings.

If you don't find it right away,,,,just forget about it.

It's just that I never heard of this....but OK.

 

[RedFan]

The GO church does not obey Acts 2:38.

Chain broken.

Sure it does. It baptizes in the name of the Father and the Son (= Jesus Christ) and the Holy Spirit. We've been through this before. The GO simply disagrees with your position that mouthing the two words "Jesus Christ" at a baptism ceremony is a required incantation for which no synonym (like "the Son") is allowed. So do I.