What Is "Salvation" In 1 Corinthians 10?

[Eternally Grateful]

I'm not going to fall into your drama.

Its not my drama, You cause the dram by refusing to listen, then bearing false witness. because you can not understand/

1. Salvation, as I've proven, doesn't encompass what you dream it encompasses.

You have not proven anything but you failure to understand what we are saved from. and how

Separately, yep, salvation isn't of works. Never said it was.

lol. Read your posts man. read your posts..

2. When someone walks by faith, that is God's righteousness, not "works" whereby one establishes their own righteousness. You wrongly categorize walking in faith as "works". You do not comprehend the distinction. I was correct in my assertion.

no. You vcan never seem to get this right.

Gods righteousness is imputed to you. Like it was imputed to abraham in Gen 14 (see romans 4)

When we walk in faith. we are walking in righteousness. But not Gods.

When we are walking and working trying to get saved, maintain our salvation, or keep from losing salvation. We are not working in Gods righteousness, we are walking in self righteousness. We are trying to work to earn salvation. Not work because we are saved.

One day I pray you will see the difference.

 

[GracePeace]

No. I have adressed it. You do not like my answer. so like always, you throw around the accusation I have not addressed it.

You confused the matter, as you always do. You are always confused--and, again, I would ask you to interact with the answers that were supplied you, which you persist in refusing to do, even until now.

Just because we go outside does not mean we do not adress the subject. You have been screaming at people for doing that. Now your backtracking.. Typical

Yes, it is "typical" of me to keep my thread in order.
To you, that's a flaw? LOL
You can't find any legitimate way to look right, so you actually nitpick about orderliness. LOL
You really are lost.

No it does not. Because the jews were not saved.. You can say they were until your blue in the face. They did not believe. You can not be saved if you continue in unbelief.

I stand by the multitudinous times I've already answered this.

He who BELIEVES is not condemned, he who does not believe is condemned already..

Romans 1:17, 14:5, 23 includes walking in faith in that, apparently.

The people of 1 cor 10. did NOT believe, hence they continued in condemnation.

When you finally understand this FACT, You may start to understand 1 cor 10.

Everything I've said on the matter is inscrutable--anyone can find it here and decide for themselves.
I won't keep repeating myself.

That does not change the fact. Whoever is born of God DOES NOT LIVE IN SIN.

Yeah, actually, it does put a question mark on how to apply the statement.
That single statement of John isn't the entire Christian doctrine on the matter, it's a statement against gnosticism.
The other statement against gnosticism is "any spirit that confesses Christ is come in the flesh is of God"... yet, in Galatians 5:8, we see that the Judaizers were promulgating a persuasion that was not from God, and, yet, they had never denied that Christ had come in the flesh--which, for you would have meant that the spirit they spoke from was from God.
So, clearly, when John is making statements against gnosticism, you have to be careful how you're applying them--especially when your application causes rifts in Scripture so that it becomes incoherent.

God did not save them from wrath in egypt. where you you get this nonsense?

The Lamb of God, Christ, fulfills the types and shadows in the Law.
If Christ the Passover saves from wrath, then the first Passover saved from wrath.
When we look back, we see that the Passover did save from death, which is a form of God's wrath.
That's just a surface level observation.

You are saying non believers are saved.

Now there is an inconsistency.

yet you can not see this because of your hatred of OSAS..

I made a whole lot of points that these three answers aren't sufficient to answer--again, as stated, you are not thorough in your responses--and, actually, all of your answers are insufficient, not thought out.

 

[GracePeace]

No. Because God told him if he sinned he would die.

Right, Adam lost what God gave by sinning--therefore, sin can make you lose a gift that you didn't earn by doing anything right.

This was not said to anyone else. we are born dead, as being in adam. so it does not fit.

Romans 8
12So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.
13For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live

I invite them to also.. My words are open for all to see. I have no fear..

LOL

It does not way what you think, this is for sure. Again, your saying non believers are saved, hence they are no longer condemned. that is not in scripture my friend..

Not sure how you confused yourself into thinking I said non believers were saved.

But I am fully convinced of this, He who began a good work in me WILL (not might) Continue until the day of Christ.

Like everything else, you rip that verse out of context.
Paul justifies and qualifies that statement by saying he had observed their righteousness.

Philippians 1
7It is right for me to feel this way about all of you, since I have you in my heart. For in my chains and in my defense and confirmation of the gospel, you are all partners in grace with me.

Paul isn't speaking of everyone, but the Philippians in particular, and based on their righteous behavior.

You can not take my assurance or hope away from me or anyone because of your hatred and lack of faith in God and his followers who rely on him in security (anti OSAS rhetoric)

I'm just scouring Scripture to know what it teaches, it's not even about OSAS, it's just that OSAS gets caught in the middle of a person trying to have a coherent and consistent message from the Bible.

Yes, as a type. BUT IT DOES NOT SAVE THEM (it only saved the first born.. But I understand, you can not see anything that would refute your legalism)

They were saved, and it was a type that points to the future reality of Christ the Passover Lamb.

lol. If I have to rely on myself. I am condemned, Because I have sinned, and I continue to sin, I am not perfect and will not be until I get to heaven.

As I've proven, and as you continue to prove, you don't understand what "works" means.
When we walk in faith, that is God's righteousness, that is "God working in you to will and do for His pleasure", that is "no longer I but Christ", that is "not I but the grace with me".
You continue to fail to comprehend this distinction between works and grace.

Until then, I will rely on God not how good I think I am like your doing.

I'm not telling anyone "be like me", I'm just saying, "Look at Scripture and deal with it".

 

[GracePeace]

lol. Read your posts man. read your posts..

Again, as with everything else, you're very confused about what "works" are.

no. You vcan never seem to get this right.

Gods righteousness is imputed to you. Like it was imputed to abraham in Gen 14 (see romans 4)

When we walk in faith. we are walking in righteousness. But not Gods.

When we are walking and working trying to get saved, maintain our salvation, or keep from losing salvation. We are not working in Gods righteousness, we are walking in self righteousness. We are trying to work to earn salvation. Not work because we are saved.

One day I pray you will see the difference.

Romans 1:17 God's righteousness is revealed from faith to faith
Romans 14:5 Each man must be fully convinced in his own mind
Romans 14:23 What ever does not proceed from faith is sin

Yes, when we walk in faith we are walking in God's righteousness.
"My Father works, and I work"
"My Father does His works"
"God is at work in you to will and do for His pleasure"

You are completely and totally without knowledge and lost when it comes to understanding this matter.

 

[Episkopos]

the wage of sin is death, the gift of God is life.

If your saved. You have been saved from the wage of sin.

If you can sin yourself out of salvation. You have yet to be saved.

What? You have fully misunderstood salvation and grace. The bible doesn't say that the wages of sin are no longer death. Grace overcomes sin or it isn't grace from God.

 

[GracePeace]

@Episkopos
A user named @Hepzibah liked one of my posts, so I followed that back to a post and found out that you read this similarly. Pretty cool to find someone who just reads it straight. No backflips, no gymnastics, just plain simple truth. The rest of these people are willy nilly.

 

[Episkopos]

@Episkopos
A user named @Hepzibah liked one of my posts, so I followed that back to a post and found out that you read this similarly. Pretty cool to find someone who just reads it straight. No backflips, no gymnastics, just plain simple truth. The rest of these people are willy nilly.

All it takes is some honesty and a little humility....and guidance from God. :) All these you will find in short supply here...and in the modern version of churchianity.

 

[GracePeace]

All it takes is some honesty and a little humility....and guidance from God. :) All these you will find in short supply here...and in the modern version of churchianity.

It's kinda scary that it's so plain, yet people are unwilling to confess it.
It makes me know there must be other things that are plain that I can't see.
God is merciful to me.

 

[Episkopos]

It's kinda scary that it's so plain, yet people are unwilling to confess it.
It makes me know there must be other things that are plain that I can't see.
God is merciful to me.

On that level....many have been indoctrinated into a religious scheme that blinds them to the meaning of the gospel. Having eyes that don't see and ears that don't hear.

It's amazing really.

And the more you try explaining the plain truth...the more these will turn on you. It's the flesh with a "promise" of life that is a false assurance.

 

[GracePeace]

On that level....many have been indoctrinated into a religious scheme that blinds them to the meaning of the gospel. Having eyes that don't see and ears that don't hear.

It's amazing really.

And the more you try explaining the plain truth...the more these will turn on you. It's the flesh with a "promise" of life that is a false assurance.

I do not say they do not or cannot know God.
That said, I do not want their lives.
95% of men who go to Church are addicted to porn.
They talk about grace and faith, but it doesn't do anything for them.
God delivered me from porn by grace and faith.
Satan's arrows are extinguished by God's grace through faith.

It's weird that they can have and know God and yet be so rabidly opposed to God's truth.
I don't understand all of this.
I know that the angels will remove all sinners from the Kingdom at the end.
I just don't understand why this goes on like this.

 

[GracePeace]

@Episkopos One thing I'm curious about is where Paul says "I know and am fully persuaded in the Lord that nothing is unclean in itself".

Elsewhere, he warns "this persuasion does not come from Him Who calls you".

There are different places persuasions come from.

"If we abide in the light..."
"Is in the darkness until now..."

So, spirits issue persuasions; depending on whose we accept, they lead us back to themselves.
"I know where I come from and where I am going"; "knowing He had come from God and was going back to God".

But my question is... how do we know if our persuasion is "from the Lord" and "in the Lord"?
I have some thoughts on that, but maybe you have some.

 

[Episkopos]

I do not say they do not or cannot know God.
That said, I do not want their lives.
95% of men who go to Church are addicted to porn.
They talk about grace and faith, but it doesn't do anything for them.
God delivered me from porn by grace and faith.
Satan's arrows are extinguished by God's grace through faith.

It's weird that they can have and know God and yet be so rabidly opposed to God's truth.
I don't understand all of this.
I know that the angels will remove all sinners from the Kingdom at the end.
I just don't understand why this goes on like this.

The more you expose the flesh..the more reactions you will get. I don't want to consider what sins are behind the scene...I want to confront the false reasoning based on a misappropriation of the scriptures.

Ex. The wages of sin is death (but not for me???) but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (this I claim for myself???)

Ignoring and obscuring half the bible to feel justified by claiming to have something these know nothing about.

The wages of sin is death....always. But there is a spiritual and eternal life that overcomes sin...by grace through faith. And that is the freedom FROM sin...not IN sin. :)

That's just one blaring error that you will see here over and over again...same people, same doctrines, same posts..

 

[GracePeace]

Ex. The wages of sin is death (but not for me???) but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (this I claim for myself???)

Yep! They don't even bother to glance at the passages that came before--"because you have become a slave to God, you have the fruit of holiness, and the end of holiness is eternal life". Eternal life is a gift only because righteousness or slavery to God is a gift, and that is only IN CHRIST... but not all REMAIN IN CHRIST (1 Jn 2:28).

These people don't know and don't care.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You confused the matter, as you always do. You are always confused--and, again, I would ask you to interact with the answers that were supplied you, which you persist in refusing to do, even until now.

Yes, it is "typical" of me to keep my thread in order.
To you, that's a flaw? LOL
You can't find any legitimate way to look right, so you actually nitpick about orderliness. LOL
You really are lost.

I stand by the multitudinous times I've already answered this.

Romans 1:17, 14:5, 23 includes walking in faith in that, apparently.

Everything I've said on the matter is inscrutable--anyone can find it here and decide for themselves.
I won't keep repeating myself.

Yeah, actually, it does put a question mark on how to apply the statement.
That single statement of John isn't the entire Christian doctrine on the matter, it's a statement against gnosticism.
The other statement against gnosticism is "any spirit that confesses Christ is come in the flesh is of God"... yet, in Galatians 5:8, we see that the Judaizers were promulgating a persuasion that was not from God, and, yet, they had never denied that Christ had come in the flesh--which, for you would have meant that the spirit they spoke from was from God.
So, clearly, when John is making statements against gnosticism, you have to be careful how you're applying them--especially when your application causes rifts in Scripture so that it becomes incoherent.

The Lamb of God, Christ, fulfills the types and shadows in the Law.
If Christ the Passover saves from wrath, then the first Passover saved from wrath.
When we look back, we see that the Passover did save from death, which is a form of God's wrath.
That's just a surface level observation.

I made a whole lot of points that these three answers aren't sufficient to answer--again, as stated, you are not thorough in your responses--and, actually, all of your answers are insufficient, not thought out.

All of this,

And you did not answer a simple question

Do you believe a person who does not have faith is saved.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Right, Adam lost what God gave by sinning--therefore, sin can make you lose a gift that you didn't earn by doing anything right.

Romans 8
12So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.
13For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live

LOL View attachment 46192

Not sure how you confused yourself into thinking I said non believers were saved.

Like everything else, you rip that verse out of context.
Paul justifies and qualifies that statement by saying he had observed their righteousness.

Philippians 1
7It is right for me to feel this way about all of you, since I have you in my heart. For in my chains and in my defense and confirmation of the gospel, you are all partners in grace with me.

Paul isn't speaking of everyone, but the Philippians in particular, and based on their righteous behavior.

I'm just scouring Scripture to know what it teaches, it's not even about OSAS, it's just that OSAS gets caught in the middle of a person trying to have a coherent and consistent message from the Bible.

They were saved, and it was a type that points to the future reality of Christ the Passover Lamb.

As I've proven, and as you continue to prove, you don't understand what "works" means.
When we walk in faith, that is God's righteousness, that is "God working in you to will and do for His pleasure", that is "no longer I but Christ", that is "not I but the grace with me".
You continue to fail to comprehend this distinction between works and grace.

I'm not telling anyone "be like me", I'm just saying, "Look at Scripture and deal with it".

More rambling

once again, Do you believe a person can be saved who has never believed?

Yes or no? I am sick of your games

 

[Episkopos]

@Episkopos One thing I'm curious about is where Paul says "I know and am fully persuaded in the Lord that nothing is unclean in itself".

It's not about touch not or taste not. It's about a new nature...not self-discipline (although there is a real value in self-control..)

Elsewhere, he warns "this persuasion does not come from Him Who calls you".

There are different places persuasions come from.

"If we abide in the light..."
"Is in the darkness until now..."

So, spirits issue persuasions; depending on whose we accept, they lead us back to themselves.
"I know where I come from and where I am going"; "knowing He had come from God and was going back to God".

People have imaginations....and reading the bible many put themselves into the narrative in a positive way...unable to see their true spiritual condition..because they have not been exposed to the truth, to holiness...to the Lord.

But my question is... how do we know if our persuasion is "from the Lord" and "in the Lord"?
I have some thoughts on that, but maybe you have some.

We can know we are justified when we walk in the supernatural peace love and joy that is only found in the Spirit. A tree is known of its fruit. Are we walking in a supernatural power (resurrection life)? Then we can know we are covered by God's righteousness. No man walks in holiness in his own power. Such is to walk in the Spirit.

That's in the bigger picture.

On a more basic level we can be led by the Spirit even when we struggle in our own power.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Again, as with everything else, you're very confused about what "works" are.

No, You are.

I have explained multiple times what constitutes a work, and what is the result of a work.

Romans 1:17 God's righteousness is revealed from faith to faith
Romans 14:5 Each man must be fully convinced in his own mind
Romans 14:23 What ever does not proceed from faith is sin

Yes, when we walk in faith we are walking in God's righteousness.
"My Father works, and I work"
"My Father does His works"
"God is at work in you to will and do for His pleasure"

You are completely and totally without knowledge and lost when it comes to understanding this matter.

Yet you can not prove a thing, You quoting scripture and then saying I do not understand is nothing but a game you play.

Onece again, Do you believe a person can be saved who has never believed in Christ.

 

[GracePeace]

All of this,

And you did not answer a simple question

Do you believe a person who does not have faith is saved.

1. Again, you're not thorough. This is not at all an answer to every one of my answers.
2. Again, you answer matters before hearing them, as shameful fools do (Proverbs 18:13): I have said, endlessly, that 1 Corinthians 10 refers to a type, and a type is never its own anti-type (here, the anti-type would be men being saved by God's grace through faith in Christ's death and resurrection). I have also stated, in one of my answers to you, unbelievers are NOT saved in an anti-typical way. You are struggling to understand that parallel Paul teaches in 1 Co 10. You need to accept that before you can proceed.

 

[GracePeace]

No, You are.

I have explained multiple times what constitutes a work, and what is the result of a work.

I've addressed and debunked your view on "works", but you have not even tried interacting with my view on the matter.

 

[GracePeace]

It's not about touch not or taste not. It's about a new nature...not self-discipline (although there is a real value in self-control..)

The aspect of the verse that interests me is "I know and am persuaded in the Lord", not the "nothing is unclean in itself".
In other words, it seems like he's saying that he can do these things before and as unto the Lord, and he will not run away from the Lord, shrink back in shame (Heb 10:38, 39; 1 Jn 2:28), but others who try to do these things will run away from the Lord, shrink back in shame, because they're not abiding in the Lord.

So, at some point, he obtained this knowledge, this persuasion, before the Lord.
He says it is "in the Lord", so, connected to this, when a person has a legitimate "persuasion", then it is "in the Lord", and, therefore, breaking with this faith, or walking contrary to it, is sorta like unbelief "in the Lord", because the "doubt" (Ro 14:23) is directed toward "the Lord" from Whom the persuasion is emanating, so that when we submit to it, those are God's acts acting on us (starting in the heart and brain--the persuasion). This would make sense of how the person is "condemned" (Ro 14:23), whereas the one remaining in Christ is not condemned (Ro 8:1)--they're not remaining in Christ (1 Jn 2:28).

Salvation by faith is much more than people think.