The Kingdom of God - do we have access to it now?
- Thread starter Karl Peters
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
The answer is simple Wrangler.....”everlasting life” is not “immortality”. The only way to continue living as a mortal human on earth was to meet the conditions upon which it was granted. The conditions were not difficult.....out of all the fruit trees generously provided by their Creator, one tree God declared was his exclusive property...the humans were not to eat of that tree, which in reality represented his Sovereign right to set the limits of the freedom he had granted them.
If they had been created with immortality, (an indestructible life) then what you say would have been accurate, but granting mortals a way to retain endless life, was on condition of their continued obedience.... this was apparent or the death penalty would have been meaningless. An immortal cannot die.
Mortal earthly life is sustained by vital processes......all external.....oxygen, food, water, shelter...and all were provided in abundance by Jehovah, whose generosity is demonstrated in everything he does. But one of the more important aspects of being created with free will (as opposed to animals who were created to respond to life by programmed instinct) is that direction is necessary to maintain order. (Jehovah is a God of order)
Though animals, as sentient creatures, have a measure of free will, their actions are not conscious, but driven by unconscious programming is that designed to sustain their lives and produce future generations. Each have their unique ways to maintain their existence and care for their young, often in herds or family groups, with their needs also generously provided by their Creator. We were created to represent Jehovah here by taking care of his creation as he would....which is why we alone were “made in his image and likeness”.
So because Adam was created without defect, there was no reason or excuse to disobey his Creator. He did not have a sinful nature to use in his defence because perfect creatures do not make mistakes...they commit wilful and deliberate sin by abusing the free will that God granted to them.
This is why God cannot forgive what he did. He not only knowingly committed a capital crime, (he knew full well what the penalty was) but chose to join his wife in rebellion, rather than to obey his God. The repercussions of his action is what sentenced all of his offspring to death. He was therefore guilty of the death of the entire human race. (Romans 5:12)
Satan was the first rebel and he tempted (he did not force) the first humans to join him, in order to achieve his own selfish ambitions.....as he was a once perfect creature also. His fate will be shared by those who joined him, back then......and from then until now. He cannot “make” us do anything, but he can “tempt” us with clever deception, as he has always done....very successfully by appealing to our selfish desires. (James 1:13-15)
All the first rebels were guilty of the crimes that they clearly committed in full knowledge of what they were doing. How can God forgive them when there was no basis to do so. Jesus came to give his life so that all those who inherited sin and death from Adam could have hope....that hope comes in the form of God’s Kingdom......the governmental arrangement that was implemented as the means that will bring alienated mankind back into reconciliation with their loving Creator.
We can become citizens of God’s Kingdom by showing Jehovah that the one thing he has always asked of his children is something we can give back to him......our obedience, love, appreciation and loyalty....he asks nothing more and has provided for us so generously.....on this specially prepared planet, we lack nothing.
I find it sad that so many can’t see the big picture.....it’s a long term solution, not a quick fix. By our choices in this time of the end...we choose our own destiny.
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
After all that was said...this is your reply? Seriously?
Unless you can discern the difference between immortality and everlasting life, (and it’s a big difference) what you assume about life itself will not fit into the big picture at all.
Immortality is only possible for spirit creatures who do not have to depend on external things to keep living.....yet even the angels are not immortal because God will eventually destroy the devil and his hordes in the lake of fire......the incorrigibly wicked humans (those who can’t be told) will already be there along with Adam and his wife. Never to be remembered.
Life is a gift.....but those who abuse their free will to adopt things that they want to believe, will have that gift withdrawn. Free will was also supposed to be a gift....but abuse turned it into a curse. Life was conditional from day one. If we fail to meet the conditions, our ‘entry visa’ into God’s Kingdom, will be cancelled. Jesus is the one who issues the ‘passports’. Those he rejects will be complaining......
“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’” (Matt7:21-23)
What is the “lawlessness” they practice? And how many of them understand or expect the rejection they will receive? Weren’t they doing what they thought their “Lord” commanded? Were they correct in their assumption? Jesus knows who are serving his Father’s interests and who only imagine that they are.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Can we go over your comments Karl Peters?
1 Cor 13:11-13.......Paul likened the need for miracles to the traits of a child....something to see.
"When I was a child, I used to speak as a child, to think as a child, to reason as a child; but now that I have become a man, I have done away with the traits of a child. 12 For now we see in hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face-to-face. At present I know partially, but then I will know accurately, just as I am accurately known. 13 Now, however, these three remain: faith, hope, love; but the greatest of these is love."
He said we had to grow up, and the more important traits of "faith, hope and love" had to replace the signs that were previously so important in establishing God's favor shifting to the disciples of Christ, and his rejection of disobedient Israel. (Matt 23:37-39)
What was to identify true Christians?...John 13:34-35....love among themselves.....where is it?
One who is solid in the faith has no doubts because all their questions are answered within the parameters of the whole Bible. (James 1:5-8)
What did Paul warn us about in the apostasy that was brewing even at the end of the first century?
2 Thessalonians 2:1-10...
“However, brothers, concerning the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him we ask you 2 not to be quickly shaken from your reason. . . . 6 And now you know what is acting as a restraint, so that he will be revealed in his own due time. 7 True, the mystery of this lawlessness is already at work, but only until the one who is right now acting as a restraint is out of the way. 8 Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence. 9 But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders 10 and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved.”
This reveals the danger......the foretold apostasy was “already at work” even when the apostles were still alive. These were acting as a restraint back then, but once the apostles were gone, there was no longer any restraining influence.....”the church” was doomed, because the “weeds took over...... but those called out of the tangle of those weeds, would love the truth, and not be embroiled in their nonsense and false doctrines. They would all speak in unity. (1 Cor 1:10)
And yet, at the judgment, those who thought they knew their “Lord”, will be shocked to hear that they were not known by him at all......not ever. So there was a beginning where “the church” became a place where Jesus never set foot. I wonder where that might be?
What does it mean in the Bible to “believe”? James tells us that “the demons believe and shudder”.....so what is “belief” in that context? It has to be more than a mere mental acknowledgement and I'm sorry but hearing voices is a symptom of mental illness.....God speaks to us through the scriptures, not the voices in our head. The days of God speaking through his prophets are gone....Jesus was the last one and he trained his apostles to carry on his work with the aid of God's spirit. But with the death of the apostles, the gifts of the spirit ceased.
1 Cor 13:11-13.......Paul likened the need for miracles to the traits of a child....something to see.
"When I was a child, I used to speak as a child, to think as a child, to reason as a child; but now that I have become a man, I have done away with the traits of a child. 12 For now we see in hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face-to-face. At present I know partially, but then I will know accurately, just as I am accurately known. 13 Now, however, these three remain: faith, hope, love; but the greatest of these is love."
He said we had to grow up, and the more important traits of "faith, hope and love" had to replace the signs that were previously so important in establishing God's favor shifting to the disciples of Christ, and his rejection of disobedient Israel. (Matt 23:37-39)
Yes....but look at Christendom.....is it in all its fractured glory really a reflection of what Christ taught.....sorry I don’t see it and never have. I escaped from that den of thieves. Money is more important to today’s clergy than actually teaching their flocked to stay separate from the world....don't we see that religion is heavily into politics, setting Christians against their brothers....(James 4:4; 1 John 4:20-21)
What was to identify true Christians?...John 13:34-35....love among themselves.....where is it?
And yet Jesus asked his audience many questions to see if they understood the Bible teachings as opposed to what the Pharisees taught them.
One who is solid in the faith has no doubts because all their questions are answered within the parameters of the whole Bible. (James 1:5-8)
Yes, testing the spirits is difficult if they are the wrong spirits. “The angel of light” even tried to tempt the son of God....what hope do we have against his trickery? Simple....God withdraws the trickery so that all of it is revealed to be the devil’s work. Otherwise how could we tell at this important juncture in history who was performing the genuine miracles?
What did Paul warn us about in the apostasy that was brewing even at the end of the first century?
2 Thessalonians 2:1-10...
“However, brothers, concerning the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him we ask you 2 not to be quickly shaken from your reason. . . . 6 And now you know what is acting as a restraint, so that he will be revealed in his own due time. 7 True, the mystery of this lawlessness is already at work, but only until the one who is right now acting as a restraint is out of the way. 8 Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence. 9 But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders 10 and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved.”
This reveals the danger......the foretold apostasy was “already at work” even when the apostles were still alive. These were acting as a restraint back then, but once the apostles were gone, there was no longer any restraining influence.....”the church” was doomed, because the “weeds took over...... but those called out of the tangle of those weeds, would love the truth, and not be embroiled in their nonsense and false doctrines. They would all speak in unity. (1 Cor 1:10)
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Oh dear, did you not read that correctly? There was a separation of the waters above the expanse (earth’s atmospheric “heavens”) and the waters below it. The word "heavens" has three meanings in the scriptures....1) the heavens where birds fly....2) the heavens where there are sun moon and stars and....3) heaven which Christ identified as the abode of his God and Father.
The waters above the expanse were used by God in the flood of Noah’s day (2 Peter 3:5-6) .....but you knew that ...right?
Apparently it has not been explained well to you....? Your take on these verses is not correct.
Of course Christians know about heaven and earth, and why humans were created here and not in heaven as the angels were.
All creation was originally ruled by its Creator, but Adam put a spanner in the works by defecting and taking the entire human race with him. The King was in his rightful place as Universal Sovereign, but Adam rejected him as such and chose to throw us all under the bus.
God intervened immediately with the Bible’s first prophesy (Gen 3:15) and even though the details remained shrouded in mystery for many centuries, with the implementation of his rescue mission, Jehovah had already worked out a strategy to bring the human race back to the beginning....but only if we did as we were told. The one thing he has always asked of his "people".
Adam and his wife failed.....Israel failed......and so did her modern counterpart.....Christendom....both mirror images of one another. Both went so far off the rails that, in the first century Jesus did not recognize the Jewish leadership as authentic and told them straight up that they were bound for Gehenna. (Matt 23:33) He will say the same to Christendom when he returns as judge. (Matt 15: 7-9)
All things were “given” to him. His authority came from his Father (Matt 24:18) and he tells us that creation was made “through him and for” this firstborn son. (Col 1:15-17)
The sad thing is that this will be heard by the majority......the “many” who are on the wrong road. (Matt 7:13-14)
We have to be found among the “few”...those who are actively “doing the will of the Father”....not just talking about it. We have to be separate from the world, which is controlled by the devil (1 John 5:19) having nothing to do with its corrupt politics......and we have to be fulfilling the great commission. (Matt 28:19-20)
It also requires God’s people to “get out of” “Babylon the great” in obedience to Rev 18:4-5.
Do we have beliefs and practices that can be traced back to original Babylon? Christendom is full of them.
You are wrong about so many things, and it all comes down to not knowing the KING OF KINGS - Jesus Christ!!
You are wrong with the above. None of those claimed to actually know the Lord!! They claimed they were doing things in His name!!
How did you miss that part???
Is it not because you don't hear from Him either???
This is what people don't really understand. When you get to actually know Him you get soooooooo much proof that He is who He is that you have to believe He is who He says He is. Then every time you meet a person who makes it about the Bible instead of using the Bible to make it about Him, shows you they don't really know Him!!
Even those people Jesus spoke about showed in an instant that they did not know Him personally!! And you missed it!!
Let me help you by clearly explaining what was happening, because you missed it!!
Here are the vereses:
Mat 7:21-23 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. “Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’ “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’
First look and see that those people did not say they knew Him!!! What they said was that they were doing things in His name!!
People who don't actually know Him don't understand what it actually means to do something in His name!! So what happens is that they read the Bible, see that things can happen by using His name and go about just adding, "In the name of Jesus Christ" anytime they do something. That doesn't mean you know Him, it only means you read about Him or heard other people tell you about Him!!
When you actually get to know Him personally you start seeking His voice and listening to Him, and among other things He gives you instructions about what to do. Then you go about doing what He asked you personally to do! Then you are actually doing things in His name, but the focus you have comes off your doing things in His name, but rather you focus becomes about people knowing Him as The Lord who gives instructions personally to people!!
What you don't understand is that even when He gives you instructions to go heal someone, He starts telling you how to do it for that person. And in that process, you realize that it is not you who is doing the healing, but He is doing the healing and just using you to help! He really didn't need to use you, but He just wanted to make you a part of what He does because He loves you.
So then, when you meet up with Him you don't tell Him "I DID", which is what those people were doing by saying 'did we not prophesy in your name..."
To help you understand let me compare that with another group of people who did actually know Him and how they reacted!
Luke 17:10 “So you too, when you do all the things which are commanded you, say, ‘We are unworthy slaves; we have done only that which we ought to have done.’”
That is what you are totally missing!!!!
When you really get to know Him, it doesn't take long before you clearly understand that you are just not up to the standard!! At best you hear Him, but not as much as you should. You talk to Him everyday called Today, but not even close to as much as you should, because He is always with you! Even when you do your best at following his instructions, you still realized that you did not do a very good job of it.
So one this you clearly understanding, and I don't me you but anyone who really knows Him, is that He is doing the healing and you are at best just trying to do what He told you, and not that good at that!
That is why those who really know Him honestly will tell Him, "We are unworthy slaves; we have done (at best) only that which we ought to have done"
So you don't go around saying anything like "Did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, and in Your name perform many miracles" = because it was not you but Him who did the miracles, who gave you the prophesy, and cast out the demons!!! You were just along for the ride, trying to do what He told you, which is only what you should have done!!
I tried to tell you that when you really know Him, you can spot people who don't actually know Him. They don't understand verses like:
Mrk 16:20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed....
Do you see "while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed"???
We hear a word from Him spoken to us personally, but He does the "WORK", and He does the "SIGNS THAT FOLLOW". All we are doing is just trying to listen to Him and trying to do what He askes us, and we know that we don't even do that very well!! And this is what you are missing.
I just took one thing you responded, but I could have use many others. Yet this is supposed to be a thread on the Kingdom of God, and you are sidetracking it. So who is telling you to do that?
If you actually get to know the King, Jesus Christ, you will also actually get to know some in the Kingdom of God who serve Him; and I mean those angels who ascend and descend on Him!! And I will tell you something about them. They too understand what I explained above. We are like children in the Kingdom, and the best of us people are not close to being up to their standards, and they still understand the only Jesus Christ is the worthy One!!!
So these people saying, 'did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’, are even instantly understood to not have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. If they were humble then perhaps they would get into heaven. If they had been humble, then they would have actually sought the voice of the Lord and not have thought they were doing things.
Again, what you truly need to do is covered in these two verses:
Rev 3:19,20 ‘Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent. ‘Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
Because people think they are smarter than Him they don't seek Him and His voice. And thinking you are smarter than God, so that you don't need to seek Him and His instructions is the perfect example of having pride!! So the example of having humility is seeking God and listening to Him. If you knew Him you would understand this and you would also know that you still have too much pride, because unlike Jesus Christ who does and says only what the Father tells Him, even the best of us people are far off that standard He sets. Even the angels in heaven who faithfully serve Him, are not the Word of God - meaning they to do their best to do what He the King tells them, but they are not doing and saying only what they are told. They understand that, so they say:
Rev 5:9 And they *sang a new song, saying, “Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, and purchased for God with Your blood men from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.
The angels of the Kingdom of God glorify Jesus Christ, and they call Him alone "worthy", and though they do their best to do what He askes and are a lot lot better at it than us people, they would not have said what those people said!!
So again, I ask you: How did you miss it???
You really need to start seeking Him and listening to Him! It will truly be a humbling experience, yet at the same time it will give you confidence in Him. That He loves you. That He forgives you. That He will talk to you because He is worthy and not you. So, you will start pointing people to Him, the King, who has a Kingdom, that He made to house you in after you get rid of that flesh you are in.
But if you don't know Him by that day - your prideful speaking about how you did things in His name only does to show you never knew Him!! In that verse He is just pointing out the obvious, and it will be obvious to you then, that you never actually knew Him!
Those who have been born again are already in the Kingdom of God (which is also the Kingdom of Light). See John chapter 3. When Christ was on earth the King was on earth. Hence wherever He went and whatever He did represented the Kingdom of God. Today Christendom represents the Kingdom of God/the Kingdom of Heaven in a flawed manner as seen in the parables of the Kingdom. After the Second Coming of Christ there will be a real, literal, visible, tangible, physical and spiritual Kingdom of God on earth. At the present time the kingdoms of the world are under the control of Satan, hence sin and evil is growing by leaps and bounds. But as far as the Christian is concerned "the Kingdom of God is within you".
Let us take a look for Noah, like you say, and give it some context:
2 Peter 3: 3,4 Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.”
So in the context we are taking about how in the last days we are going to find "mockers", who are saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? Of course that is a problem, because Jesus said to His disciples that He would never leave them. So the mockers are those not listening to Him, like say - Noah. Noah did listen to the Lord, so knew what to do, but those not listening to Him are "mockers".
2 Peter 3:5,6 For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water.
So there have always been, in Noahs time, and in the last days, 'mockers" who don't know that God has always unused "the word of God' to create and even destroy as needed. And what are we talking about as waters when it comes to His word/voice?
Ezk 43:2 and behold, the glory of the God of Israel was coming from the way of the east. And His voice was like the sound of many waters; and the earth shone with His glory.
Now the Lord tends to speak in parables. There are reasons for that, but "waters" usually stands for spirits!! If the voice of the Lord is like "many waters" it is because He sends even the angels who serve Him with words from Him. That is who we are all to minister, but the angels are better at it, so when you are listening to Him with your spiritual ears you might hear what is often called 'an open heaven". That is what we mean by the Kingdom of God, and what we are preaching when we preach the Kingdom of God. They all listen to Him do what He tells them.
Now some angels fell from heaven or maybe we should say the Lord threw them out and down to earth. So we also find "waters" which are leading the rebellion. Of course we know they are going to be thrown into the lake of fire, along with their leader, Satan. And amazingly, it will only take one angel that serves the Lord to throw Satan in to the lake of fire. Of course not everyone:
Rev 20:15 And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up.
So yeah- the waters above - that is the Kingdom of God which is to say the King and His Kingdom were involved in things all along, like say the flooding of the earth, and things all along the way down to the disposing of Satan and His, along with taking people away or gathering up those who will inherit salvation!!
Mat 24:31 “And He will send forth His angels with A GREAT TRUMPET and THEY WILL GATHER TOGETHER His [fn]elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.
So don't you think it wise to seek the King and His Kingdom now!!!!!
And as for the different levels of heaven, it seems you are correct on those different levels, but did you forget the verses in Genisis only shows one division??? You must have forgotten. Let me help with the following verse where "a" (as in singular) great chasm if fixed.
Luke 16:26 ‘And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.
You get sidetracked so easily. There is heaven and hell, and a great chasm fixed between them. The Kingdom of God is on one side and the punishment of hell on the other side.
So how can we say the Kingdom of God is in our midst, since there is a great chasm? Well - did you not also notice that the person talking to Abraham was on the other side of the great chasm?? Jesus said His Kingdom was not of this realm, to Pilate. He also said that He could ask His Father and legions of angels would be there but He didn't at that time pray "Thy Kingdom Come". But He did tell us to pray it.
So did you? Do you see the angels of God descend and ascend on Him? If you did, we could actually start talking about the Kingdom of God instead of all this other stuff>
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
I guess I could say the same about you, and fill up pages doing so.
Who would be telling Jesus that they were uttering "prophesy in [his] name, and in [his] name cast out demons, and in [his] name perform many miracles?’"...except people whom claim Jesus as their "Lord"? They think that they are Christians....and that they know him....but he has NEVER known them.....
I think I've said my piece.....you can believe whatever you wish.....but Jesus is the judge, not you or I....
FactsPlease
Member
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Nuff said.
Parsing synonyms is in bad form. I don’t subscribe to inventing word meanings to fit doctrine.
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
I'll take my chances with not accepting the big picture as you see it. There simply is not a big difference between synonyms. LOL Consider
- Jesus was mortal but obtained immortality.
- Jesus was mortal but obtained eternal life.
Whenever questions of import regarding your doctrines come up, you often hide behind indoctrination, demonstrated by the many dozen paragraph posts. It is a sure sign of an attempt to try, not to dazzle with brilliance but baffle with BS.
Yet, you did not address the underlying logical flaw in your understanding of the big picture. Again, If Adam already had everlasting life, why was there a Tree of Life in the Garden that God later had angels guard so Adam would NOT partake of it? (The correct answer ought to be short, not entrenched with paragraphs of indoctrinated "knowledge.")
If your answer is what it seems, that Adam did not have everlasting life but immortality, we are done here.
Ok - you finally got it figured out that a person can think they are a Christian, but never know Him.
But you still don't realize that was exactly what was happening in the Bible with most of the Jews also.
Jesus told them:
Jn 5:39,40 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.
The thing is that if you really know Him, you really know Him as someone who you have conversations with!!
We talk!!
Of course it is via His Holy Spirit speaking to my spirit, but I hear words from Him. Yet there are many who don't have conversations with Him, still they go around casting out demons in His name, healing the sick in His name, and praying for all kinds of things, 'in His name". They do that because they were told to pray like that instead of getting into conversations with Him.
And that is what their statements showed. If you know Him, meaning you talk with Him, He tells you what He wants prayed for, who to go about ministering, and as Isaiah put it: "Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left." (Is 30:21)
Of course if you don't hear Him like that it is only because you don't believe you can hear Him like that - He is always around you! He stands that the door knocking just hoping anyone will open up to Him so they and He can talk. (Rev 3:20)!!
And if a person does come to know Him, they come to know certain things because they know Him. They know He is the Word of God who is God (Jn 1:1,2) They know it is not by their own power and authority that miracles happen and demons are cast out, but He and His Kingdom of angels that serve Him make things happen. And if a person prophesies, that person knows that it was not their words but His, becasue they actually heard Him tell them to tell someone something!! So they don't go around saying, 'didn't we cast out demons in your name', because they were only doing what He asked, and they even know they don't do that very well.
But you are having trouble understanding that and think I am wrong. Where as because I talk to Him I instantly realize that you don't, or you would have instantly understood the problem those who were telling Him that they had cast our demons, performed miracles, and had prophesied in His name had. They were thinking it was them, so they didn't know it was Him who cast our the demons, did the miracles, and had the prophecy!
Now I was talking to Him last night about this posting, and He was telling me about how nobody gets into the Kingdom of God unless like a little child, and He reminded me of a couple of parables He had given me. He was telling me how people "over think" this.
Once upon a time there was this ant carrying a heavy load and looking up at a big hill. At the same time there was this little boy that was looking down at this small ant hill and the boy just decided to jump right on top of it.
So the question is: What is your view point of heaven?
Mat 18:3 and said, “Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
You don't get into heaven because you are smart theologian! You don't get in because you are counting all your great works you did for Him, even works you say you did in His name! Neither Him, nor the angels who serve Him are not impressed by you. You get into heaven because you just want to get of the lap of the King and talk with Him like a child!!
You don't get to know Him otherwise!!
Now it is amazing who much I sound like a child when I am with Him. I am the type of kid who goes, "What about this, and what about this", and who keeps asking "why"!
And perhaps the strange part is that He likes it. He once told me to just ask Him questions all day long. I was sittin in a fast food restaurant eating and talking with Him at the time. So when He gave me that instruction, I had to start looking for questions to ask Him. I pointed to a little tray at the table which had ketchup packets, salt, and pepper in it. So I pointed to it and asked Him, "What about that?"
He instantly responded, "Wasn't it a great idea I gave them?"
It was a great idea, because I hate having to go up and find the salt and ketchup. Often I have to ask the cashier for them, and the cashier is always busy so I usually have to wait while my food gets cold. He had a great idea, that someone there heard from Him, but whether anyone knew it was His idea is questionable. He is just standing there speaking to us, but unless a person starts actually believing in Him they will never understand that He is still there for us!!
And if the King is there for us, so too is His Kingdom of heaven!!
That is not wrong, that is right. But many think that is wrong. So they don't seek the Lord, don't get to know Him, and He winds up telling me to go again and make a post about Him, and His Kingdom, being there for them - because they still didn't get it!!
Again - I like the above post and all of it:
There is one thing I would like to point out, and that is about the "The correct answer ought to be short, "
That is also correct, but it is also written that God uses the foolish things of this world, and that you can tell a fool by the number of His words!!!
That proverb always gets me!!
Ok - I can see that He like using me, but I also know I write too much.
Never-the-less: it is correct to write: "The correct answer ought to be short, "!!!
Indeed, one of the thing that amazes me about the Lord, and also helps me figure out if I am hearing Him or just listening to my own thinking - is how He can say so much in so few words!
Anyway - I like the post even if it does remind me that He uses the foolish things (like Me) who tend to write too much.
I'm just saying, because writing too much could actually be a sign that God is using that person???
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Well, my point had nothing to do with that excellent proverbs verse 10:19. It's more about self delusion. Ever see the movie The Manchurian Candidate starring Frank Sinatra? When asked about the traitor, they went into a trance and repeated a mantra about how great a guy the scumbag was. This prevented them from critically looking into the truth.
WHAT & WHEN & WHO questions should have short answers. HOW or WHY questions could be very elaborate, especially if one is looking for a comprehensive answer. God said let there be light and there was light is a WHO & WHAT statement. Concise.
I do not believe it is the quantity but the quality of writing that indicates one is used by God. That is, independent of the quantity, look to the quality. "Behold, The Lamb of God." Memorable. Castro's 7 hour forced indoctrination sessions were not.
The more you talk, the more likely you will cross the line and say the wrong thing;
but if you are wise, you’ll speak less and with restraint.
Proverbs 10:19 (Voice)
Yeah - Thanks Wrangler - It was actually meant to be more funny than serious. I did love the post. It was great, though it did hit on something the Lord has gone over with me personally. That touchy point about me wanting to say and write too much. :)
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Edifying. Did you see the thread I started about The Words of Satan?
Not that this applies but tangentially. In that thread I explain how the world pushes ‘honesty is the best policy’ when it is not true. Love is the best policy.
And a brother in Christ was confused that the pivot to honesty is dishonesty. The divine pivot or bound is Grace. One ought not say things that unnecessarily hurt, especially unnecessarily hurt a relationship.
AJ likes to be pedantic more than the average bear. She has a world view that took 50-years to build up and she is understandably proud to share it. It’s that that you or her hurt but maybe do not edify. AJ likes to get people thinking along her world view. But it may not be what people, like me, are looking for. Brevity.
Still love you both and the enthusiasm you bring to CyB.
I will take a look for that thread.
You are right, "Love is the best policy" - but of course God is Love and His policy is to not lie, right. :)
And again I am just saying for the fun of it - That Isaac means "“to laugh." and Isaac was the promised son to Abraham. So Isaac, Laughter, was a type of Christ.
And since we are talking about the Kingdom of God - He has at times sent me an angel of humor who told me that I could call him "Josh", which gives you a good idea about his humor.
Of course Josh is not our Lord, but the Lord does send angels to minister to us, and they have personalities. And in the Bible we see people, even Jesus, name according to what they do and minister. Josh pointed out to me studies where hospitals applied some humor and the recovery times of their patients improved. Also that we see a lot of humor often coming from the podium, for a reason. He also pointed out that during the fall many angels like him fell. So often we call some humor "Sick"! And it is that those angels meant to follow the Lord and use humor to help people relax and help them recover from sickness, would up using their gift of humor to make people sick. And that knowledge from God can even be found in our spirit and out our mouths.
I mean since this thread is about the Kingdom of God and you mention a thread on words of Satan, this seemed like the right time to bring all this up. That is to say, when we go to a place like some comedy club, which specializes in "Sick" humor, it is going to wind up having an effect on our spirit which is likely to have an effect on our physical bodies too. Satan and those who follow him know this and so evil spirits use the talent God gave them to harm us. Where as angels from God use the talent God gives them to help us - and humor can be a help at times.
Thanks again for the post, and I will try to look at your thread, :)
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Lot's of great points there Karl!
I got banned for saying otherwise.
Not too funny. See 1 Kings 22:19-22.
Hmmm. I've thought about this a lot. Can you name a time that Jesus said something for the fun of it? I do not believe there is a lot of support in the Bible for comedy and fun. Rather, there is quite a bit about being serious.
We are coming to the end of all things, so be serious and keep your wits about you in order to pray more forcefully.
1 Peter 4:7 (VOICE)
While dining with a ruler, pay attention to what is put before you.
Proverbs 23:1
Praise God! I pray I one day have such an experience.
I got banned for saying otherwise.
Not too funny. See 1 Kings 22:19-22.Hmmm. I've thought about this a lot. Can you name a time that Jesus said something for the fun of it? I do not believe there is a lot of support in the Bible for comedy and fun. Rather, there is quite a bit about being serious.
We are coming to the end of all things, so be serious and keep your wits about you in order to pray more forcefully.
1 Peter 4:7 (VOICE)
While dining with a ruler, pay attention to what is put before you.
Proverbs 23:1
Praise God! I pray I one day have such an experience.
Both sentences could each be there own thread. Are you saying a lot of angels that had a sense of humor fell?
This is why I take food in Romans 14 rather metaphorically. Not merely food but what one exposes themselves to. For instance, while Jesus commands us to be the light, he also commands us not to throw pearls before swine. Both ought to guide our path.
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