Is Jesus the End of the Law?

[robert derrick]

So, I gave you the chance to answer honest questions and perhaps help you. You decline. No problem.

People who promote this “real Christians don’t sin” idea should think twice because if they’re right, then they aren’t saved and neither is anyone else. .

No man sinning for the devil against God is also born of God at the same time. There is no fellowship with Christ and Belial.

This is the case , because all Christians sin.

Speak for yourself sinner.

In Romans 7:18-19Paul admitted that he couldn’t stop sinning. Are they saying he isn’t saved?

Paul was empathizing with the double hearted in Romans 7 and then gave the answer to be delivered from it at the end of the chapter, to go on to the no condemnation of Romans 8: Jesus Christ.

No man sinning against knowledge of the Lord is justified by Christ, but is condemned worse than the ignorant unbelievers.

The Holy Spirit is our “ Helper” who advises us on behavior that’s pleasing to God, but as long as we’re here on Earth we’ll have a sin nature that makes it impossible for us to completely stop sinning.

Christ has never made a sin nature nor spirit to make any soul of man nor mortal body of flesh from the womb. Christ makes all things good and well in the beginning for His good pleasure. No baby is born sinful and of the devil, whether of man or of beast, but just naturally mortal.

It's not a sin to be mortal.

Sin nature is ready made excuse for the unrighteous to blame their sinning with the devil on their own mortal bodies. "It's not my fault. I was born this way."

It's also rebuked by James, for those who say "God made me this way."

Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man.

Which of course would be the case, if Christ made men sinners with sin nature at birth. The sin nature lie is accusation of the devil against Jesus being the maker and tempter of sinning.

When Jesus went to the cross He took all the sins of our life with Him, past present and future.

Only past sins confessed and repent of are forgiven. Confession is necessary for forgiveness of Jesus and cleansing from sinning. It is therefore impossible to be forgiven while presently sinning with the devil, and especially for sinning tomorrow that may never come.

One thing is for sure though, unrighteous sinners, no matter what religion, will definitely be sinning for the devil tomorrow, if tomorrow comes.

Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children.

Because of this God sees us not as we are but as we will be when He’s perfected us. /QUOTE]

God is not blind to any man doing nor thinking anything. Blind grace of OSAS is not grace of Christ.

God doesn't see anyone as any good, much less perfected, while sinning for the devil.

This is why Paul could say that according to God it wasn’t “he” who was sinning but the Old Sin Nature that was still living in Him. (Romans 7:20)........

If the old man is still alive sinning for the devil, then the new man is dead to God.

Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

All Believers will find “ True” Perfection “ over there”, when we make it to Heaven and exchange these “ corrupt” Flesh bodies with Incorruptible Bodies That are identical to Jesus......

Only those living in righteousness and true holiness over here, will be resurrected into perfect body and mind over there.

Unrighteous sinners, no matter what religioun, will not be in the presence of the Lord over there, if they depart while unrighteously sinning over here.

Until that day arrives, we are covered by Grace....

OSAS grace is fool's help to not be judged for sinning, but God's grace is true help not to be sinning. OSAS makes the blood of the Lamb that washes away sinning, into that of a bull or goat that only covers sinning.

we need to thank Him for that Grace when we sin,

Ah yes, the good ol' OSAS song of the corrupt lamb, "Ceeeeeelebrate that grace, C'mon!!!" Do di dum dum dum dum dum...

being fully aware that just because we are totally forgiven for all of our sins as far as our Salvation goes, nobody will ever “ get away” with Sinning—- we won’t be damned for Sinning , but if we get out of line — especially for trying to abuse Gods Grace, God will Chastise any and all of His Errant Children —— even to the point of “ taking them Home” many years before they were supposed to leave the earth....God will Forgive abundantly, but He will NOT be mocked....

God will not be mocked by gumshoe!!! He will absolutely kill the unrighteous sinning hypocrite and take him home early!!!

"You see that hypocrite Father??! Why, I'll show him a thing or two!! I'll just take him here to heaven, and give him a real shellacking!!!!"

If I really believed the OSAS doctrine of killing off hypocrites to save their souls, I would go back to sinning raucously, while openly naming the name of Christ all the while.

Take me home Jesus!!! Or else I'll shame your name even more!!!!

You have left out a couple more OSAS talking points:

The law of Christ is now dead on the cross, and it's letters in Scripture don't matter anymore. And you really hate sinning while sinning now, rather than really enjoying it before being a sinner with grace.

You did sort of infer soul separation from the body, so that when you sin, it's not your soul that sinneth, but that poor old hapless sinful flesh of yours, that is now to blame.

Also, Paul was not just preaching being double hearted for life, but was also the chiefest of sinners after being saved. He was still destroying the faith, but now as an apostle.

A perfect OSAS apostle.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

So, I gave you the chance to answer honest questions and perhaps help you. You decline. No problem.



No man sinning for the devil against God is also born of God at the same time. There is no fellowship with Christ and Belial.



Speak for yourself sinner.



Paul was empathizing with the double hearted in Romans 7 and then gave the answer to be delivered from it at the end of the chapter, to go on to the no condemnation of Romans 8: Jesus Christ.

No man sinning against knowledge of the Lord is justified by Christ, but is condemned worse than the ignorant unbelievers.



Christ has never made a sin nature nor spirit to make any soul of man nor mortal body of flesh from the womb. Christ makes all things good and well in the beginning for His good pleasure. No baby is born sinful and of the devil, whether of man or of beast, but just naturally mortal.

It's not a sin to be mortal.

Sin nature is ready made excuse for the unrighteous to blame their sinning with the devil on their own mortal bodies. "It's not my fault. I was born this way."

It's also rebuked by James, for those who say "God made me this way."

Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man.

Which of course would be the case, if Christ made men sinners with sin nature at birth. The sin nature lie is accusation of the devil against Jesus being the maker and tempter of sinning.



Only past sins confessed and repent of are forgiven. Confession is necessary for forgiveness of Jesus and cleansing from sinning. It is therefore impossible to be forgiven while presently sinning with the devil, and especially for sinning tomorrow that may never come.

One thing is for sure though, unrighteous sinners, no matter what religion, will definitely be sinning for the devil tomorrow, if tomorrow comes.

Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children.



God will not be mocked by gumshoe!!! He will absolutely kill the unrighteous sinning hypocrite and take him home early!!!

"You see that hypocrite Father??! Why, I'll show him a thing or two!! I'll just take him here to heaven, and give him a real shellacking!!!!"

If I really believed the OSAS doctrine of killing off hypocrites to save their souls, I would go back to sinning raucously, while openly naming the name of Christ all the while.

Take me home Jesus!!! Or else I'll shame your name even more!!!!

You have left out a couple more OSAS talking points:

The law of Christ is now dead on the cross, and it's letters in Scripture don't matter anymore. And you really hate sinning while sinning now, rather than really enjoying it before being a sinner with grace.

You did sort of infer soul separation from the body, so that when you sin, it's not your soul that sinneth, but that poor old hapless sinful flesh of yours, that is now to blame.

Also, Paul was not just preaching being double hearted for life, but was also the chiefest of sinners after being saved. He was still destroying the faith, but now as an apostle.

A perfect OSAS apostle.

I must inform you, my fellow Wretched Sinning friend ( your Confusion and your Pride just Blind you from knowing it , whereas True Believers See it and admit it and thank God for His Grace)......That even if you “could” achieve your Foolish attempt at being Justified by your Stellar Performance ( Filthy Rags, actually) you are going to find that you were “ barking up the wrong tree” your entire life..... That “ Grace” That you claim that you don’t need because you have No Sin Nature ? Here’s you a News Flash—- “ It is by * GRACE* that we are Saved, Through FAITH, and NOT by Works, lest any man ( like you) should have a reason to boast” ....You are obsessed with trying to live a Lie of Satan called “Sinless Perfection”—— and even if you kept the Law , you will find that it was not Gods Recipe for Salvation...the Recipe is the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-4 .....That Gospel is NOT what “ You” did for God , That Gospel is what “ God” did for you......When it comes to Salvation , Jesus gets ALL OF THE GLORY and Self- Righteous Fool’s like you get NONE!

Go on putting your Faith in yourself and your pitiful “ performance” and your ability to obtain “Lucky Repentance” and Repent Of ALL of your sins before you die........just remember THIS as you get dragged away on Judgement Day after hearing “ Depart from Me, I Never knew you!”—- It really WAS “ Nothing But The Blood” ...

Ol’ Blood Bought is the True “ Chief Of Sinners” , Yet because he put “ his” faith in the Blood Of Jesus Plus Nothing, and “ you” put your “ faith” in Sinless perfection and Lucky Repentance , guess who gets Saved? If you said “ Blood Bought”, go to the head of the class.....

One more little thing before I go ,Mr. Deceived Sinner—- if humans are Born without a Sin Nature, why MUST we be “ BORN AGAIN ?”

 

[Taken]

Is Jesus the End of the Law?
OP ^

Jesus is the Fulfillment of the Law.
Freewill of individuals ~
~Believe the Law was fulfilled or not.
~Continue under the Law or not.
~Join in make yourself under the Law or not.

 

[Phoneman777]

True, The law is not written for the righteous, who need not be reminded that murder, adultery, drunkenness, thefts, blasphemies, railing cursings, lust after strange flesh, etc...is not good nor of God.

The law simply let's any man know, whether believer or not, that they have gotten away from God, and are now serving the devil.

There is however a third purpose why the law written on paper is good: to let the righteous know what is not law of Christ, but is only commandments of men.

The sheep of Jesus must learn the difference between being guilt-tripped by false teachers, rather than being convicted by the Spirit.

Amen, the Pharisees heaped many many laws on the people, like the ridiculous idea that picking food to eat off the plant was "harvesting" - which Christ came and showed weren't legit.

 

[robert derrick]

I must inform you, my fellow Wretched Sinning friend

This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.

I'm not your fellow sinner nor friend. Andy by your doctrine alone I would not keep company with you.

But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

your Confusion and your Pride just Blind you from knowing it

And so your 'friends' are also proud and blind. Not mine. Neighbor yes, friends, no.

Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

whereas True Believers See it and admit it and thank God for His Grace)...

True believers repent of sinning for the devil as enemies of God.

That “ Grace” That you claim that you don’t need because you have No Sin Nature ?

The grace of God not need by you unrighteous sinners is the grace that helps not to sin against God. Your grace covers you sinning against God as the blood of bull or goat.

You are obsessed with trying to live a Lie of Satan called “Sinless Perfection”—— and even if you kept the Law , you will find that it was not Gods Recipe for Salvation..

The law of Christ is not perfectionism. You make that, so that you can then justify sinning for the devil, by calling it being 'imperfect'.

The saints in Christ Jesus have single and perfect pure hearts towards Jesus, but our minds are not perfected until the resurrection of the body.

Unwanted unrighteous thoughts from the devil are cast down and out so soon as they appear in the our minds: we do not take them to heart to become lust for sinning.

Unrighteous sinners take in the fiery darts of the wicked and make their burn hotter and hotter, until they do them and are dead in their sinning.

you will find that it was not Gods Recipe for Salvation..

God doesn't have a recipe. OSAS recipe for unrighteous sinners is to make a soup out of the blood of the Lamb, to be no better than that of a bull and goat.

.When it comes to Salvation , Jesus gets ALL OF THE GLORY and Self- Righteous Fool’s like you get NONE!

And so, your fellow friends are wretched, proud, blind, sinning fools. That's quite a group you got there.

For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

You really don't know what you are saying, do you, when you get on your OSAS horsy and ride hard.

And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle.

just remember THIS as you get dragged away on Judgement Day after hearing “ Depart from Me, I Never knew you!”—-

And finally your fellow friends are the self-righteous fitted for destruction.

Ol’ Blood Bought is the True “ Chief Of Sinners” ,

I have saying how OSAS brags about how unrighteous and depraved they still are. I'll now be posting a thread about it in your honor as the chiefest of them. "OSAS Brags about How Unrighteous they are"

I wonder if Paul knows he's been replaced as chiefest of sinners. Since you people want to defame him as such, I guess you can outdo him.

One more little thing before I go ,Mr. Deceived Sinner—-

And so, we have a list of friends of OSAS: wretched, proud, blind, foolish, condemned, deceiving sinners.

When they say they are just as depraved as the rest of the world, they must be talking about before the flood.

And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

if humans are Born without a Sin Nature, why MUST we be “ BORN AGAIN ?”

An honest question at the tail end of the rubbish.

Because all men have sinned, therefore all such sinners need to be born again, even as they were before sinning: created pure with clean conscience from the womb.

And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Little children before sinning in their youth, are still pure of heart and clean in mind as when born from the womb, and those born again become as those good little children again, only not from the womb, and now with the mind of Christ not to return to sinning as before.

Jesus is the only man that remained pure in heart with clean hands from His youth all the days of His flesh, and His flesh and bones today ought now also walk as He walked.

And those boasting about how they still are the chiefest of them that still sin for the devil, are not now born members of the body of Christ.

 

[robert derrick]

Amen, the Pharisees heaped many many laws on the people, like the ridiculous idea that picking food to eat off the plant was "harvesting" - which Christ came and showed weren't legit.

I read a list of their stuff, and it is insane, which of course Scripture includes even declaring God healing by the Spirit to be profaning His own Sabbath.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.

I'm not your fellow sinner nor friend. Andy by your doctrine alone I would not keep company with you.

But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.



And so your 'friends' are also proud and blind. Not mine. Neighbor yes, friends, no.

Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.



True believers repent of sinning for the devil as enemies of God.




The grace of God not need by you unrighteous sinners is the grace that helps not to sin against God. Your grace covers you sinning against God as the blood of bull or goat.



The law of Christ is not perfectionism. You make that, so that you can then justify sinning for the devil, by calling it being 'imperfect'.

The saints in Christ Jesus have single and perfect pure hearts towards Jesus, but our minds are not perfected until the resurrection of the body.

Unwanted unrighteous thoughts from the devil are cast down and out so soon as they appear in the our minds: we do not take them to heart to become lust for sinning.

Unrighteous sinners take in the fiery darts of the wicked and make their burn hotter and hotter, until they do them and are dead in their sinning.



God doesn't have a recipe. OSAS recipe for unrighteous sinners is to make a soup out of the blood of the Lamb, to be no better than that of a bull and goat.



And so, your fellow friends are wretched, proud, blind, sinning fools. That's quite a group you got there.

For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

You really don't know what you are saying, do you, when you get on your OSAS horsy and ride hard.

And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle.



And finally your fellow friends are the self-righteous fitted for destruction.




I have saying how OSAS brags about how unrighteous and depraved they still are. I'll now be posting a thread about it in your honor as the chiefest of them. "OSAS Brags about How Unrighteous they are"

I wonder if Paul knows he's been replaced as chiefest of sinners. Since you people want to defame him as such, I guess you can outdo him.



And so, we have a list of friends of OSAS: wretched, proud, blind, foolish, condemned, deceiving sinners.

When they say they are just as depraved as the rest of the world, they must be talking about before the flood.

And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.



An honest question at the tail end of the rubbish.

Because all men have sinned, therefore all such sinners need to be born again, even as they were before sinning: created pure with clean conscience from the womb.

And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Little children before sinning in their youth, are still pure of heart and clean in mind as when born from the womb, and those born again become as those good little children again, only not from the womb, and now with the mind of Christ not to return to sinning as before.

Jesus is the only man that remained pure in heart with clean hands from His youth all the days of His flesh, and His flesh and bones today ought now also walk as He walked.

And those boasting about how they still are the chiefest of them that still sin for the devil, are not now born members of the body of Christ.

Can I take all Of this to mean that we won’t be taking any fishing trips together this summer? Damn the bad luck!

 

[robert derrick]

Can I take all Of this to mean that we won’t be taking any fishing trips together this summer? Damn the bad luck!

So long as you don't bring your OSAS sinners' theology, I won't bring the doctrine of Christ for saints.

And you don't even need to have a good sense of humor, though you obviously have one.

I know how to be neighborly with them that are neighborly, and how to leave the unneighborly alone.

I won't even correct your language, so long as it doesn't become uncomically filthy.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

So long as you don't bring your OSAS sinners' theology, I won't bring the doctrine of Christ for saints.

And you don't even need to have a good sense of humor, though you obviously have one.

I know how to be neighborly with them that are neighborly, and how to leave the unneighborly alone.

I won't even correct your language, so long as it doesn't become uncomically filthy.

Apparently you know a lot...it’s a shame you don’t know how to “ Rightly Divide” proving yourself to be a “ Good Student” Of The Word.....

Your “ Christianity” is a 90% Judaism Law and Performance Religion with a little bit of Jesus sprinkled about for appearance sake.....You do not know Him ...

 

[Wrangler]

Folks misunderstand this big time . The end of trying to EARN righteouness which none can do .

I am somewhat confused about the parsing of the Old Covenant from the Law made in this thread. I get that we don't EARN our salvation.

However, regarding the ongoing applicability of the law, particularly the 10 Commandments, I ask myself does God want us to now violate them? I think the obvious answer is NO.

Also, it is in keeping with the Spirit of the Law to not ask such questions as how much can we violate God's Will and still be saved.

 

[amigo de christo]

I am somewhat confused about the parsing of the Old Covenant from the Law made in this thread. I get that we don't EARN our salvation.

However, regarding the ongoing applicability of the law, particularly the 10 Commandments, I ask myself does God want us to now violate them? I think the obvious answer is NO.

Also, it is in keeping with the Spirit of the Law to not ask such questions as how much can we violate God's Will and still be saved.

Correct . God found fault with them , THUS He made a new covenant where it would be wrote upon our hearts .

 

[BloodBought 1953]

“ Repentance” is great ! It just won’t get you Saved....many people ( probably YOU! ) are Repenting their way to Hell.....”Repenting Of Sins” is mentioned in the Bible , and if ANYTHING is mentioned in the Bible, you had better DO IT! Unfortunately for YOU, “Mr.Poor Student Of The Word”—— the Bible NOWHERE says that we “ Repent Of Sins to GET SAVED!”

The Type Of “ Repentance That * WILL * get you Saved is THIS ONE—- “Turn ( Repent) to God with Faith in Jesus Christ”——- Doing THAT will Get you Saved and Keep you Saved forever....

There are three different Greek words that got translated as “ Repentance”...... every time you see that word, it does NOT mean to “ Repent Of Sins” .....

The #1 “Repenter” in the Bible is God Himself ( 11 times at last count) Do you think that He Repented From Sins? Let’s hope you are not “ That” far gone....

Look, my fellow Sinning Friend, let me repeat for the umpteenth time—- find a verse in the KJV that says “ You must Repent of all of your sins to be Saved” , and I will give you $1000.....some have tried to collect.....good luck, ol’ Buddy of mine!

 

[BloodBought 1953]

The grace of God not need by you unrighteous sinners is the grace that helps not to sin against God. Your grace covers you sinning against God as the blood of bull or goats




Words actually have meanings, my good friend....It is the Indwelling Holy Spirit That helps us not to sin...The GRACE or MERCY of God is that attribute of Him that not only Forgive all of our Sins , it is the reason that God goes even Farther and” FORGETS” our Sins! What a shame you reject all of this “ Good News” ......If you understood it like a Saved Man does, you would know that this is the impetus for living a life that is pleasing to God....
Don't Reject The Grace Of God That is the ONLY thing that will Save you....” It is by GRACE that you are Saved...” Someday you will wish that you had TONS Of it—- You are a MUCH bigger Sinner than you realize, My fellow sinful Friend!

 

[BloodBought 1953]

God doesn't have a recipe. OSAS recipe for unrighteous sinners is to make a soup out of the blood of the Lamb, to be no better than that of a bull and goat.




Lol.....sure “ sounds” like me, doesn’t it, my friend....To my Knowledge I am just about the only one in these Forums That CONSTANTLY and CONSISTENTLY proclaims “ NOTHING BUT THE BLOOD” for one’s Salvation——-and then “you” say that I “ make a Soup” out of that Blood .....lol....

You show you utter ignorance about me with that stupid accusation.....I esteem and proclaim the Shed Blood Of Jesus more than anybody around and you choose to call “ me” out.....It is your “ Works” Crowd that preaches a “False and Perverted” Gospel ....It is YOUR Crowd —-That “ Fallen From Grace” Crowd—- that “ Tramples the Blood underfoot , as if it were Worthless”.....To me, the Shed Blood That Jesus sprinkled on the Heavenly Mercy Seat is EVERYTHING! Can “ you” say that, my confused, deluded and sinful Friend?

 

[Wrangler]

“ Repentance” is great ! It just won’t get you Saved … The Type Of “ Repentance That * WILL * get you Saved is THIS ONE

Not sure what the quarrel is to contradict yourself like this.

It seems you are holding others to some standard of formal philosophical treatise. A type of repentance will get you saved, you say? To the layman, this translates to repent (in general) and you will be saved.

To me, I like the visual of repentance. First, you turned your back on God. Then, you turn to face and meet your Maker. A frightful prospect for us all, undeserving of his mercy.


1 Corinthians 1:17
The Voice

17 The mission given to me by the Anointed One is not about baptism, but about preaching good news. The point is not to impress others by spinning an eloquent, intellectual argument; that type of rhetorical showboatingwould only nullify the cross of the Anointed.

 

[Lizbeth]

The Law was/is weak through the flesh and carnal mind. By the Law is the "knowledge" (consciousness) of sin. Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (which Tree the Lord pronounced to be "good" along with all of His creation, but not "perfect"...scripture saying "we know that the Law is good when it is used properly"). Adam & Eve became conscious of (knowing) their nakedness. This is why Galations says those who go back under the Law have fallen from grace, like Adam & Eve. The strength of sin is the Law...sin become exceedingly sinful in one's consciousness of it (bondage).

Heb 9:9

Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience

And true righteousness is not really conscious of itself...when we are not letting the left hand "know" what the right hand is doing. But being under the Law manifests self righteousness which is self conscious righteousness.

 

[Lizbeth]

IT was made void CAUSE GOD FOUND FAULT IN MAN . NOT IN THE LAW , IN MAN .



Nope.....it was THE LAW that was “ weak and beggarly”....Why? “It had NO POWER TO SAVE!” And THAT is why God “ Found Fault In It”.....it could only POINT OUT Sin......

You want the POWER to fight Sin and get Saved Eternally? Obey the Law if you want to increase your Morality.....Trust Paul’s Gospel Found In 1Cor15:1-4 If you want to get Saved....Hell’s gonna be Chock-Full Of “ Moral” people.......

The Law was given so that Sin “ MIGHT INCREASE!” .....Why are you guys always promoting more Sin? Paul’s said that the Law was Useless unless you knew how to use it....The #1 Intention Of The Law was to show you that you CANT KEEP IT! It’s to “ shut you up” about any claims that you “ can” keep it and get you to * TURN” to the One that DID keep it! That “ Turn” is the Repentance That Saves ....Let the Law do what it was intended to do—- Turn to Jesus and simply Ask Him to Save you....

“ Anybody That ASKS to be Saved WILL BE Saved....”

The “ Starting Gate”of Christianity is seeing that you are a Sinner That MUST HAVE a Savior....Anybody that thinks that they are “ good enough” to get to
Heaven are damned .....If you have not received it, Pray for “ the Conviction Of Sin by the Holy Spirit”. ....How can you tell if you haven’t received that Conviction? If you think that you are “ OK” with God because you are a “ Good Boy or Girl” —- you have not been set straight yet....If you are Blessed by the Holy Spirit to see your True Wretchedness before a Holy God.....the rest should take care of itself.....it worked for me...

Some say there is no such thing as “ A Sinner’s Prayer”......Hog Wash! Jesus said that This Prayer got an evil man “ Justified” ( Saved) .....” Lord, have Mercy on me a Sinner!” .....

Jesus said that ANYBODY who asked for MERCY would receive it....Until one SEES the NEED for that “ Mercy” he is Lost....

I think the weak and beggardly had to do with the ordinances of worship, which have been done away with, rather than the moral/ethical laws (which are God's standard of righteousness as long as we serve in the new way of the Spirit not the letter). But brother, you make such a good point about the Law being given that sin might increase. There's a way in which too much focus on sin can be counterproductive.....the letter kills.

I think with this argument emotions are often stirred up so people are not always "hearing" each other very well and not willing to concede when someone on the opposite side of the debate says something that is not only true but important to realize.

 

[robert derrick]

The Law was/is weak through the flesh and carnal mind. By the Law is the "knowledge" (consciousness) of sin. Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (which Tree the Lord pronounced to be "good" along with all of His creation, but not "perfect"...scripture saying "we know that the Law is good when it is used properly"). Adam & Eve became conscious of (knowing) their nakedness. This is why Galations says those who go back under the Law have fallen from grace, like Adam & Eve. The strength of sin is the Law...sin become exceedingly sinful in one's consciousness of it (bondage).

Heb 9:9

Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience

And true righteousness is not really conscious of itself...when we are not letting the left hand "know" what the right hand is doing. But being under the Law manifests self righteousness which is self conscious righteousness.

So is the law of Christ on paper ended or not? Answer the question of the thread simply, and/or any point I have made at the first posting, and then we can go on to your teaching, which could be interesting for me.

Are men still judged by God as sinners, when they transgress any point of the law of Christ?

But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness...

If any soul is sinning against the law of Christ, that soul is proven dead to Christ, and their faith is vain.

 

[Behold]

Are men still judged by God as sinners, when they transgress any point of the law of Christ?

Only the unbelievers are judged by God, after they die.

The Born again are free from this judgment, because they have BELIEVED.

This is why the Christ Rejectors. John 3:36.....will die and meet God as ETERNAL JUDGE>

Whereas.....the born again, the Believers, will meet God.....as DADDY.....>"FATHER"..."ABBA".
See that?
No born again, will meet FATHER GOD, as Judge.
Only the unbelivers, meet God as JUDGE. John 3:36

 

[Lizbeth]

So is the law of Christ on paper ended or not? Answer the question of the thread simply, and/or any point I have made at the first posting, and then we can go on to your teaching, which could be interesting for me.

Are men still judged by God as sinners, when they transgress any point of the law of Christ?

But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness...

If any soul is sinning against the law of Christ, that soul is proven dead to Christ, and their faith is vain.

I'm no theology expert but I'll answer as best as I can. I believe if we keep on willfully sinning we may be in danger of being cut off from Christ, as that scripture says there would remain no more sacrifice for sins in those circumstances. But even then I believe the Lord is the one to judge what is deliberate, defiant willfulness...I've heard so many testimonies of people coming to Christ only to backslide and fall back into their former sinful lifestyle, especially younger folks...and then being brought back to righteousness again by the Lord. It seems to me the Lord doesn't let go of a soul easily and considers mitigating circumstances, such as immaturity, something like how a righteous judge would consider mitigating circumstances in a courtroom. If we're always judged by the letter of the law without mercy that's like a judge automatically throwing the book at a defendant without considering any of the mitigating facts in the case.

We all sin or come short inadvertently at times, without necessarily being cut off from Christ (hopefully not in big ways).....this is why scripture tells us to forgive one another and to bear with one another, because we all stand in need of being forgiven and bearing with at times. Just witness any Christian forum, for example. ;) James wrote that we "offend in many ways all"....inadvertent sins/offenses just because we are human. (One reason for communion is for examining ourselves in His light and bringing any realized transgressions under the blood of Christ....it wouldn't have been asked of us if it weren't needed.)

1Jo 1:6-10
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

I consider the Law this way: that it's part of scripture given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. As part of the word of God, when we keep it and hide it in our hearts, it will help to keep us.

Psa 119:11
I have stored up your word in my heart, that I might not sin against you.