The faithful and the saints: Bringing Calvinism and Arminianism together.
- Thread starter David H.
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I find that many people who teach false ideas of the Bible often use unbiblical terms, so that they can give them the meanings they want. Make it sound good, but not being true.
Personally I find that Scriptural truth properly understood can be expressed with Scripture in it's plain reading, without much comment.
Much love!
Robert Murray M'Cheyne said, It is God's Word, and not man's comment on God's Word, that saves souls...
I find that what is addressed in the Bible to one is addressed to the other, which is no other.
When you read, Saints and faithful, you can read it as, "saints, one group, and faithful, another group", or, "saints, even the faithful", that is, all one group. That's the use of the Greek "Kai". And these terms are used interchangeably, so it's the second use.
Much love!
There are two “castes” of Christians. Those who are still carnal and ruled by their passions, emotions and will and those who no longer are.
Who is fleshy? Ruled by the flesh? That's not a Christian. No, you can be acting fleshy, and that's something different. But if you are under the dominion of your fleshy passions, you are not justified.
After justification is the renewing of the mind.
Much love!
Lambano
Well-Known Member
I agree that the words as used in scripture refer to the same group, though I recognize God's calling may be different for different people. My use of the terms was for convenience only and to tie it back to Dave H. original premise.
But for now, I want to watch some of my favorite members of this board have an interesting discussion!
but be ye transformed by the renewing of you minds . . .
But with every temptation/testing, He has provided a particular way out, that brings you to a particular destination.
Much love!
I have the idea there is a full range of people. Some have not mastered their fleshy works in this area, some in that area. I don't see this being binary as such, that either you are "carnel Christian" or "sanctified Christian". We are all works in process. I personally have yet to meet a single person of whom I've not had occassion to observe some manner of the works of the flesh.
He who began a good work in you will complete it until the day of Christ Jesus. He will be working on you the remainder of your life, not because you have been fully perfected in this life, but because it remains a work in process.
We all have areas in our lives where God has given us greater control, and areas where we have less control.
Much love!
Lambano
Well-Known Member
In my experience, certain theological systems that are presumed to be biblical are also harmful. I acknowledge your experience may be different.
Great verse there from Philippians 1.6! Someone even has it on his avatar .... :)
PS: cc. @Eternally Grateful
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There are lots of problems with thinking about things the wrong way. I find that aligning my mind to the reading of Scripture simplifies things tremendously. Just thinking in Scriptural terms.
Much love!
Lambano
Well-Known Member
And yet both sides of the historical debate claim to be backed by scripture.
Oh. I didn’t know what you were talking about. I just read you telling a man to go and look up three words and then determine which words meaning was the worst.
I think this is true. You don’t? Even when satan tried, look what blessing for us.
If a man can sometimes do what’s right but sometimes do what’s wrong, I wouldn’t call that totally depraved. I would call totally depraved this: The LORD saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time.
But, we do have a holy God. There is absolutely NO sin in holiness.
If a man is born blind, he cannot just make the choice to see. A physician must heal his blindness. Men are born blind.
As for believing/trusting - what men call faith, For it is by the kindness of God (grace) that you have been saved, through your trust (faith)—and that trust (faith) is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—
So your trust/faith is a gift of God, right? The verse must be saying it is the trust that is the gift from God. No man would think or wonder or be mistaken that Gods kindness may have come from within the man himself, so the gift of God that is not of yourselves is referring to the trust (faith). But a man could make the mistake of thinking the gift of trust came from himself, and as we’ve seen, that leads to horrible arrogance.
Stop believing what? That God exists?
I think this is true. You don’t? Even when satan tried, look what blessing for us.
If a man can sometimes do what’s right but sometimes do what’s wrong, I wouldn’t call that totally depraved. I would call totally depraved this: The LORD saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time.
But, we do have a holy God. There is absolutely NO sin in holiness.
If a man is born blind, he cannot just make the choice to see. A physician must heal his blindness. Men are born blind.
As for believing/trusting - what men call faith, For it is by the kindness of God (grace) that you have been saved, through your trust (faith)—and that trust (faith) is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—
So your trust/faith is a gift of God, right? The verse must be saying it is the trust that is the gift from God. No man would think or wonder or be mistaken that Gods kindness may have come from within the man himself, so the gift of God that is not of yourselves is referring to the trust (faith). But a man could make the mistake of thinking the gift of trust came from himself, and as we’ve seen, that leads to horrible arrogance.
Stop believing what? That God exists?
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